What happened on Quandry

**Name Redacted** · 01-17-2019, 10:36 AM

Tough to judge whether a helmet would have saved him or not, but might have given him a chance. Guy died on Buffalo a few years back the same way. RIP, very sad. good reminder that avalanches aren't our only concern out there. Gotta keep the skis under your feet and ski more conservatively than when inbounds when skiing in the BC. Results of a fall can be far more serious, and although we have a great SAR team, their response time is far more time than ski patrol at the resort.

I've always hated helmets. I have a Vantage, don't love it, rarely wear it. Wish I could find one that I really liked. Had a pro-tec 20 years ago that was awesome till I drilled holes in it for a helmet cam and it snapped in half. I think that I need one that I can still wear a hat underneath.

**mall walker** · 01-17-2019, 10:58 AM

^ I really like having a hat brim too when it’s snowing (absolutely hate wearing goggles) and have found that a visor fits under my helmet better than a hat. I’m sure I look stupid as hell but it works so whatever.

edit: if using a regular hat, definitely rip off that stupid button on top, that shit hurts like a mofo if you bop your head with a helmet over the button

**auvgeek** · 01-17-2019, 11:12 AM

Originally Posted by Norseman

There's a new lightweight helmet from Salomon, the MTN LAB, that is certified for both climb and ski. I want one but the sizes might be picked over for this year.

Plenty of double and triple certified helmets available at skimo.co: https://skimo.co/helmets

Including the sally one in all colors/sizes.

https://skimo.co/salomon-mtn-lab-helmet
https://skimo.co/movement-3tech-alpi-helmet
https://skimo.co/ski-trab-gara-helmet
https://skimo.co/camp-speed-comp-helmet

Edit: No affiliation with skimo.co and I'm not saying a helmet would have helped in this particular situation, just providing links for anyone interested in light helmets certified to skiing/climbing and sometimes ski/climb/bike standards.

I have a Uvex p8000 that I try to wear regularly.

**S_jenks** · 01-17-2019, 11:27 AM

Originally Posted by mall walker

^ I really like having a hat brim too when it’s snowing (absolutely hate wearing goggles) and have found that a visor fits under my helmet better than a hat. I’m sure I look stupid as hell but it works so whatever.

This caught my eye. What about goggles in particular do you hate?

**mall walker** · 01-17-2019, 11:40 AM

Originally Posted by S_jenks

This caught my eye. What about goggles in particular do you hate?

you can’t wear them going up, even the julbo aerospace opened up fogs up on my sweaty face going up. and they fog up on my helmet too, every one I've tried anyway. so it’s just another thing to do every lap, switch goggles < - > shades. leave one or the other in a pocket and they fog up, gotta take the helmet off probably to get them on right (at least shades), after getting used to shades the field of vision in goggles feel super restricted, if you DO get snow in them it's nigh on impossible to clean out in the field, etc. also the julbo treks/aeros are plenty of protection with a brim over them. even in nuking snow / face shot conditions I usually just live with squinting in the white room with my treks. as long as you stop snow coming in from above, they have been fine for me, hence the visor.

**zion zig zag** · 01-17-2019, 11:49 AM

I'm in the camp of "seriously considering a helmet everytime I read one of these reports but it's just one more thing to carry and fuck with while ski touring."

**auvgeek** · 01-17-2019, 11:54 AM

Originally Posted by mall walker

you can’t wear them going up, even the julbo aerospace opened up fogs up on my sweaty face going up. and they fog up on my helmet too, every one I've tried anyway. so it’s just another thing to do every lap, switch goggles < - > shades. leave one or the other in a pocket and they fog up, gotta take the helmet off probably to get them on right (at least shades), after getting used to shades the field of vision in goggles feel super restricted, if you DO get snow in them it's nigh on impossible to clean out in the field, etc. also the julbo treks/aeros are plenty of protection with a brim over them. even in nuking snow / face shot conditions I usually just live with squinting in the white room with my treks. as long as you stop snow coming in from above, they have been fine for me, hence the visor.

Yeah, I don't know anyone who wears goggles going up. I usually bite the bullet and switch trucker hat + shades -> goggles as part of my transition for typical meadow-skipping type stuff. Helmet on when foot pons go on or if there's any chance of rockfall. But yeah, the helmet + visor + shades on the way up and down sounds super time efficient.

**Norseman** · 01-17-2019, 11:58 AM

Originally Posted by auvgeek

Plenty of double and triple certified helmets available at skimo.co: https://skimo.co/helmets

Including the sally one in all colors/sizes.

https://skimo.co/salomon-mtn-lab-helmet
https://skimo.co/movement-3tech-alpi-helmet
https://skimo.co/ski-trab-gara-helmet
https://skimo.co/camp-speed-comp-helmet

Edit: No affiliation with skimo.co and I'm not saying a helmet would have helped in this particular situation, just providing links for anyone interested in light helmets certified to skiing/climbing and sometimes ski/climb/bike standards.

I have a Uvex p8000 that I try to wear regularly.

I should've worded my post differently... I'm not suggesting that the Solly is the only option. IMO the Solly looked like the best suited for actual skiing function and goggle compatibility. But fit over all, eh

Interesting to see the spread of opinions and preferences here.

**auvgeek** · 01-17-2019, 12:02 PM

Originally Posted by Norseman

I should've worded my post differently... I'm not suggesting that the Solly is the only option. IMO the Solly looked like the best suited for actual skiing function and goggle compatibility. But fit over all, eh

No worries -- it does to me, too. I was mainly responding to the part where you said the sizes might be picked over for this season .... and giving anyone interested link where it's in stock in all sizes.

edit: maybe we need a "what backcountry helmet" or "how to deal with head protection in the bc" style thread?

**Name Redacted** · 01-17-2019, 12:15 PM

Originally Posted by mall walker

edit: if using a regular hat, definitely rip off that stupid button on top, that shit hurts like a mofo if you bop your head with a helmet over the button

They make hats without the button. Tough to find, but when I was a pilot my boss specifically ordered them because the button hurt under a headset.

**mall walker** · 01-17-2019, 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by shredgnar

They make hats without the button. Tough to find, but when I was a pilot my boss specifically ordered them because the button hurt under a headset.

ah I figured someone must make them. either way, if it's a hat you're willing to sweat in / don't mind "modifying the look of," it's pretty easy to just rip the button off with a pair of pliers or whatnot. I have one like that, it predates my visor lol

**adrenalated** · 01-17-2019, 12:46 PM

Contrary opinion: I just wear a normal helmet and goggles on the down, and a hat and sunglasses on the up. It takes like 1 minute to switch between them. If that's too long for someone I'm touring with, fuck them, I don't want to tour with someone that's in that big of a hurry anyways.

**total_immortal** · 01-17-2019, 01:09 PM

Originally Posted by zion zig zag

I'm in the camp of "seriously considering a helmet everytime I read one of these reports but it's just one more thing to carry and fuck with while ski touring."

Originally Posted by PowHound84

I'm guilty of not wearing it 95% of the time but stuff like this makes me really think twice about it.

Are you guys also skipping the first aid and repair kits because it's just one more thing to "carry and fuck with"? The heaviest helmet on the chart on the previous page is little over a 1 1/4 pounds which weighs less than a full Nalgene or about the same as two beers. The margin of error is so much smaller in the backcountry I just don't understand why you wouldn't wear one (I do still ski with people who don't wear them).

**simple** · 01-17-2019, 01:19 PM

Originally Posted by adrenalated

Contrary opinion: I just wear a normal helmet and goggles on the down, and a hat and sunglasses on the up. It takes like 1 minute to switch between them. If that's too long for someone I'm touring with, fuck them, I don't want to tour with someone that's in that big of a hurry anyways.

Same here. Backpacks with helmet holders are great btw.

**doebedoe** · 01-17-2019, 01:24 PM

Originally Posted by total_immortal

Are you guys also skipping the first aid and repair kits because it's just one more thing to "carry and fuck with"? The heaviest helmet on the chart on the previous page is little over a 1 1/4 pounds which weighs less than a full Nalgene or about the same as two beers. The margin of error is so much smaller in the backcountry I just don't understand why you wouldn't wear one (I do still ski with people who don't wear them).

I think the something to fuck with is pretty different than first aid and repair. With a helmet you're either wearing it the whole time, or fucking with it every transition. I rarely need my first aid or repair kit in the field.

**total_immortal** · 01-17-2019, 01:45 PM

Originally Posted by doebedoe

I think the something to fuck with is pretty different than first aid and repair. With a helmet you're either wearing it the whole time, or fucking with it every transition. I rarely need my first aid or repair kit in the field.

I gotcha, that extra 15-30 seconds to put a helmet on or strap it to the pack really makes or breaks my day as well, I guess I better stop using mine because it's so inconvenient

**skaredshtles** · 01-17-2019, 01:49 PM

Originally Posted by adrenalated

Contrary opinion: I just wear a normal helmet and goggles on the down, and a hat and sunglasses on the up. It takes like 1 minute to switch between them. If that's too long for someone I'm touring with, fuck them, I don't want to tour with someone that's in that big of a hurry anyways.

It takes me WAY longer than that just to catch my breath at the top.

**auvgeek** · 01-17-2019, 02:06 PM

Originally Posted by total_immortal

I gotcha, that extra 15-30 seconds to put a helmet on or strap it to the pack really makes or breaks my day as well, I guess I better stop using mine because it's so inconvenient

He never advocated not using a helmet -- he was advocating skinning in one (and a visor w. sunglasses). Keep your head protected at all times and minimize the transition time. Nothing wrong with that. If you subscribe to the "never take off your pack" method, it makes sense to skin with a helmet on. Not my personal approach but I see it's merit. Plus, it's what the cool rando racers do.

**mall walker** · 01-17-2019, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by adrenalated

Contrary opinion: I just wear a normal helmet and goggles on the down, and a hat and sunglasses on the up. It takes like 1 minute to switch between them. If that's too long for someone I'm touring with, fuck them, I don't want to tour with someone that's in that big of a hurry anyways.

Fwiw, my touring partners this year include 4 splitboarders and a guy recovering from an ACL injury whose transition involves putting on a knee brace. My wife takes both skis and pack off when at lap changes. It's mostly not a time/minutes thing, I just don't like to force myself to mess with more stuff than necessary. (edit: also, in the conditions I most want goggles in, they are most likely to get snow in them when I'm taking them on/off) But I'm more than happy to stop at the top/bottom and take in the scenery, take a picture, whatever. For some context, of the 41 days in the bc I have this season, probably 3/4 are early am before work, and probably more than half are solo. So on a lot of days going faster = more skiing, and if I'm solo, I can optimize that a lot.

Originally Posted by total_immortal

Are you guys also skipping the first aid and repair kits because it's just one more thing to "carry and fuck with"? The heaviest helmet on the chart on the previous page is little over a 1 1/4 pounds which weighs less than a full Nalgene or about the same as two beers. The margin of error is so much smaller in the backcountry I just don't understand why you wouldn't wear one (I do still ski with people who don't wear them).

I've been carrying not just the goggles I never use but also a repair kit, first aid kit, stove/propane, 2 person shelter, 800 fill down puffy, skin wax, etc etc all season. Doesn't mean I take them all out every time I rip skins. Not changing what's on my head (and hands and chest etc) once I get out there is just a happy-path optimization for me personally; do whatever works for you. It's also a personality thing, if I can find a way to not have to mess with things more than once, that's what I'll do. I don't like taking my shoes on and off either, drives my wife nuts

I'm not trying to convey "never stop and breathe or take any wasted action and I will glare at you if you take your pack off at transitions," just "I sympathize greatly with people who would rather not use a helmet than have to fidget with it; here's the compromise I made, which seems at least marginally safer than not using it."

**Foggy_Goggles** · 01-17-2019, 02:50 PM

I don't like taking my shoes on and off either, drives my wife nuts

Slip on everything. Life changing.

**mall walker** · 01-17-2019, 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles

Slip on everything. Life changing.

not sure if joking but I now drive to the trailhead in those north face slip on down booties... wife also loves that

**Foggy_Goggles** · 01-17-2019, 02:56 PM

Originally Posted by mall walker

not sure if joking but I now drive to the trailhead in those north face slip on down booties... wife also loves that

No joke buddy. Tell your wife if that the best shit she's got to pick on you, shes pretty lucky.

**auvgeek** · 01-17-2019, 03:04 PM

yeah, I can get the "don't want to mess with stuff" approach. My wife has started just wearing her touring boots home from the TH if the drive is less than an hour or two.

**Foggy_Goggles** · 01-17-2019, 03:10 PM

I don't know about wearing them home but I put my boots on at home and drive to the pass all the time. I need to start doing that with my helmet.

**zion zig zag** · 01-17-2019, 03:12 PM

Originally Posted by mall walker

Fwiw, my touring partners this year include 4 splitboarders and a guy recovering from an ACL injury whose transition involves putting on a knee brace. My wife takes both skis and pack off when at lap changes. It's mostly not a time/minutes thing, I just don't like to force myself to mess with more stuff than necessary. (edit: also, in the conditions I most want goggles in, they are most likely to get snow in them when I'm taking them on/off) But I'm more than happy to stop at the top/bottom and take in the scenery, take a picture, whatever. For some context, of the 41 days in the bc I have this season, probably 3/4 are early am before work, and probably more than half are solo. So on a lot of days going faster = more skiing, and if I'm solo, I can optimize that a lot.

I've been carrying not just the goggles I never use but also a repair kit, first aid kit, stove/propane, 2 person shelter, 800 fill down puffy, skin wax, etc etc all season. Doesn't mean I take them all out every time I rip skins. Not changing what's on my head (and hands and chest etc) once I get out there is just a happy-path optimization for me personally; do whatever works for you. It's also a personality thing, if I can find a way to not have to mess with things more than once, that's what I'll do. I don't like taking my shoes on and off either, drives my wife nuts

I'm not trying to convey "never stop and breathe or take any wasted action and I will glare at you if you take your pack off at transitions," just "I sympathize greatly with people who would rather not use a helmet than have to fidget with it; here's the compromise I made, which seems at least marginally safer than not using it."

Covered perfectly and exactly my thoughts.