Moment Skis Discussion

[scmartin69]

Yesterday was my first day on the C98 188cm (thanks to Fasa for the demos)...
Absolutely a ripping low tide ski, easy and intuitive, handled scoured groomers, bumps and chowder with aplomb. 188cm felt just about right, but I'm a bigger guy and ski 190 on all my other Moments.
BTW, much higher speed limit than my WC108 and DWs.
Skied them on the line, moving to +1 today and will report back.

[scmartin69]

Yesterday was my first day on the C98 188cm (thanks to Fasa for the demos)...
Absolutely a ripping low tide ski, easy and intuitive, handled scoured groomers, bumps and chowder with aplomb. 188cm felt just about right, but I'm a bigger guy and ski 190 on all my other Moments.
BTW, much higher speed limit than my WC108 and DWs.
Skied them on the line, moving to +1 today and will report back.

Conditions at Mt Rose were 1" of chalky wind blown bumps and later afternoon groomers with low vis...
Didn't get a ton of time on these at +1 due to wind hold. But my basic observations align w/ conventional wisdom, they were more turny, didn't seem to affect the top speed stability much, hit 58mph v 65ish due to an upslope wind and they felt solid enough either way.
Sidecut seemed more "right" on the line on firmer snow, but bumps were slightly more "fun" at +1.
Not sure I can make a determination about mount point, sorry I really hoped to give better advice to the collective. I plan to buy these, but am still unsure as to the mount; may opt for demo binders to continue my research.

[AZskibum]

Took the moment commanders 98s out today on some AZ crusty hard pack. Ski rips. Just eats it up and goes fast. First time on a metal ski, lots of fun. I have a lot to learn about getting those tails to come around in tight terrain, bumps, trees. I think skiing playful twins has covered up some serious lack of skill. I'm pretty impressed with how stable they felt in the air. Thought I would be backseat on the landings.

Anybody have any good videos or suggestions on learning some of those maneuvering skills? Kinda felt like I was dragging the ski through crusty bumps, but that's every ski for me.

[scmartin69]

Took the moment commanders 98s out today on some AZ crusty hard pack. Ski rips. Just eats it up and goes fast. First time on a metal ski, lots of fun. I have a lot to learn about getting those tails to come around in tight terrain, bumps, trees. I think skiing playful twins has covered up some serious lack of skill. I'm pretty impressed with how stable they felt in the air. Thought I would be backseat on the landings.

Anybody have any good videos or suggestions on learning some of those maneuvering skills? Kinda felt like I was dragging the ski through crusty bumps, but that's every ski for me.

Hard/strong extension (or retraction) movement early in the turn will set you up for a lot of goodness in all conditions.. A agree w/ your assessment of a tail w/ a lot of splay making for lazy bump skiing (guilty as charged).

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[MakerofEden]

I've been looking at getting the wildcat 108 to replace my head kore 105 and trying to figure out the correct length, currently my kore is 180. I"m 5'8" and 180lbs. Also what's the most playful moment ski (frankenski/meridian)? I honestly have liked every moment ski I have tried and might end up with a whole quiver at this rate....

[Sargentdrufus]

I've been looking at getting the wildcat 108 to replace my head kore 105 and trying to figure out the correct length, currently my kore is 180. I"m 5'8" and 180lbs. Also what's the most playful moment ski (frankenski/meridian)? I honestly have liked every moment ski I have tried and might end up with a whole quiver at this rate....

I would go 184 if it was me and I was that size, Oh wait I'm 6'1" and went 184 on the DWT so I'd go there regardless, but I don't think you'd find the 179 crazy short if you like the 180 Kore

[MakerofEden]

I would go 184 if it was me and I was that size, Oh wait I'm 6'1" and went 184 on the DWT so I'd go there regardless, but I don't think you'd find the 179 crazy short if you like the 180 Kore

Do you feel like you have to be pretty aggressive to get the tail around? Do you use your DWT in the back country or mainly resort?

[Sargentdrufus]

Do you feel like you have to be pretty aggressive to get the tail around? Do you use your DWT in the back country or mainly resort?

I've done some early season groomer laps, and a ton of backcountry in tight quarters on shit snow. They pivot like a dream, super easy to swing the tails around. And it is my understanding the WC108/108T is better than the DW/DWT in the loose pivoty department.

[RadSkier_]

Duude! Do not go any smaller than 184CM at your height/weight. I’m a bit taller, same weight and ski the WC108 in the 190CM length no problem. The ski is super maneuverable in tight sports/moguls/trees.

184CM = you pick and chose your spots to give it gas

190CM= you love to floor it at all times.

I've been looking at getting the wildcat 108 to replace my head kore 105 and trying to figure out the correct length, currently my kore is 180. I"m 5'8" and 180lbs. Also what's the most playful moment ski (frankenski/meridian)? I honestly have liked every moment ski I have tried and might end up with a whole quiver at this rate....

[TahoeJ]

184 for sure. Wildcat 108 pivots really easily and they have a healthy dose of rocker. Not to mention it's a twin tip.

[MakerofEden]

Thanks for the recommendation! I've only skied the commander and felt like it wasn't as maneuverable as I wanted, hence going towards the WC.

[JaytaeMoney]

Can anyone comment on the 190cm WC108 vs 186cm ON3P Kartel/Jeffrey 108?

I love the K108's but mine are pretty clapped out after four seasons of heavy use, so I'm starting to think about a replacement. If I could change anything I'd make them a little more stable in general but especially in pow. I have gotten very used to finessing them but in truly bottomless pow or deep, soft chop, they are weird. Feels like a teeter totter if you are not precisely on the sweet spot in the center of the ski. It would be nice to be able to get on the shovels and drive them when needed. I really notice this on steep terrain, lower angle is not really an issue. Trying to decide if like a Woodsman/Wren would be better, or the WC. I do love the playfulness of the K108 and don't want to give up too much of that. I love the quick/poppy aspects and they are very stable for a ski in that jibby all mountain category. But, if I had a similar ski that I liked better in pow, I would be able to move to a two ski quiver - firm/groomer ski e.g. Brahma, and a soft snow/pow ski.

I would also appreciate some comments on overall stability in variable conditions since the WC is a lighter ski.

I'm 5'11 170lbs and would be on the 190 (The 186 K108 measures 189-190ish on a straight tape pull iirc and I'm very happy w/that length)

[K1mJ0ngTr1ll]

Can anyone comment on the 190cm WC108 vs 186cm ON3P Kartel/Jeffrey 108?

I love the K108's but mine are pretty clapped out after four seasons of heavy use, so I'm starting to think about a replacement. If I could change anything I'd make them a little more stable in general but especially in pow. I have gotten very used to finessing them but in truly bottomless pow or deep, soft chop, they are weird. Feels like a teeter totter if you are not precisely on the sweet spot in the center of the ski. It would be nice to be able to get on the shovels and drive them when needed. I really notice this on steep terrain, lower angle is not really an issue. Trying to decide if like a Woodsman/Wren would be better, or the WC. I do love the playfulness of the K108 and don't want to give up too much of that. I love the quick/poppy aspects and they are very stable for a ski in that jibby all mountain category. But, if I had a similar ski that I liked better in pow, I would be able to move to a two ski quiver - firm/groomer ski e.g. Brahma, and a soft snow/pow ski.

I would also appreciate some comments on overall stability in variable conditions since the WC is a lighter ski.

I'm 5'11 170lbs and would be on the 190 (The 186 K108 measures 189-190ish on a straight tape pull iirc and I'm very happy w/that length)

I owned both this years woods108 and wc108 before settling on the Comm108 and Ive ski this years jeffs as well since my brother has a pair.

This years WC108 190 is heavier than this years woods108 J108. The J108 also measures 186.7ish, kitty is closer to 188. The J108 will float better than the WC108. The WC108 will be better in chop and on the hard pack. Both the woodsman and the Jeff will be "looser" (they both have less ee) and prefer a more centered stance. I personally felt I could drive the WC108 better than this years woodsman.

For a high snow area the WC108 is more than capable during low-tide as it holds an edge really well. But if you wanted a two ski quiver I feel you wouldn't be in a bad place with a WC 101 and a full blown WC. or even a WC108 and a WC.

[mr_pretzel]

What did you weigh the W108 as? M old ones were 2030g’s, old J108s 2250g

[K1mJ0ngTr1ll]

What did you weigh the W108 as? M old ones were 2030g’s, old J108s 2250g

190 WC 2197g/2201g
187 Wds 2151g/2174g

[auvgeek]

Can anyone comment on the 190cm WC108 vs 186cm ON3P Kartel/Jeffrey 108?

I love the K108's but mine are pretty clapped out after four seasons of heavy use, so I'm starting to think about a replacement. If I could change anything I'd make them a little more stable in general but especially in pow. I have gotten very used to finessing them but in truly bottomless pow or deep, soft chop, they are weird. Feels like a teeter totter if you are not precisely on the sweet spot in the center of the ski. It would be nice to be able to get on the shovels and drive them when needed. I really notice this on steep terrain, lower angle is not really an issue. Trying to decide if like a Woodsman/Wren would be better, or the WC. I do love the playfulness of the K108 and don't want to give up too much of that. I love the quick/poppy aspects and they are very stable for a ski in that jibby all mountain category. But, if I had a similar ski that I liked better in pow, I would be able to move to a two ski quiver - firm/groomer ski e.g. Brahma, and a soft snow/pow ski.

I would also appreciate some comments on overall stability in variable conditions since the WC is a lighter ski.

I'm 5'11 170lbs and would be on the 190 (The 186 K108 measures 189-190ish on a straight tape pull iirc and I'm very happy w/that length)

ON3P tends to straight tape pretty close to their actual length. So no, not 190 cm straight tape...

I'm about your size, and I've spent some time on an older stiff Jeffrey 110 (now probably flexes close to stock) and the 2020 (last season's) Deathwish recently. Skied them back to back quite a few times in the last week. The difference in layup was huge to me. The DW is not nearly as poppy and also not as damp. I skied approximately 28% faster on the Jeffrey 110, caught maybe ~37% more air, and had 69% more fun. I was honestly surprised how much more I liked the Jeffrey, especially after how much I've read about the DW. I did not notice a difference in how much you can drive the tips of either ski, personally. The Jeffrey actually felt even more stable because the layup. Haven't skied the WC 108, but I would not be surprised if it wasn't as poppy or fun as the Jeffrey without a noticeable difference in top-end speed.

Regardless of the specific model, I think a forward mount point make it a little difficult to balance in super deep pow. I've noticed this on several different skis, and that's why I own a Billy Goat.

YMMV.

[optics]

If anyone is interested in some 186 ghost trains, shoot me a PM.

I love them but probably won't get any more deep days this year due to work, and I'm moving money to the bike realm...

[mr_pretzel]

190 WC 2197g/2201g
187 Wds 2151g/2174g

Damn that actually sounds good now for the WC108.

Wow my 187 wds are 2386g & 2347g, Scott always seems to give me the heavy cores

[JaytaeMoney]

ON3P tends to straight tape pretty close to their actual length. So no, not 190 cm straight tape...

You are correct, now I remember that ON3P measures their actual length and most manufacturers measure the ski before it's pressed so the tape pull is shorter than the stated length.

Anyway, appreciate the insight about the skis, less damp and less poppy/playful is definitely not what I'm trying to achieve.

[auvgeek]

Sorry, I forgot to finish my sentence, which was that while a 186 ON3P wouldn't straight tape at 190, Moment measures the material before it's pressed so their skis typically straight tape 2-3 cm shorter than the stated length. So I would guess that a 186 Jeffrey 108 and a 190 WC 108 are within 1 cm of each other.

[K1mJ0ngTr1ll]

Sorry, I forgot to finish my sentence, which was that while a 186 ON3P wouldn't straight tape at 190, Moment measures the material before it's pressed so their skis typically straight tape 2-3 cm shorter than the stated length. So I would guess that a 186 Jeffrey 108 and a 190 WC 108 are within 1 cm of each other.

Depends on how much rocker the ski has. My comm 108 is right at 187 so 1cm short while my wildcat 108 was closer to 188.

[TahoeJ]

Just to illustrate the difference. This is a 184cm Wrenegade 108 (pretty flat tail) next to a 190cm Wildcat (twintip).

[Pinned]

For those of you on Wildcat 108s - did you detune at all or just ski them right out of the box? I am sure they'll be super fun either way and looking forward to finally putting them on snow this week.

[TahoeJ]

Any ski with that much rocker I highly recommend detuning. Tips and tails. But we all have our preferences.

[scmartin69]

Any ski with that much rocker I highly recommend detuning. Tips and tails. But we all have our preferences.

+1
Detuned my WC108s and Bibbys back to at least the contact point, felt hooky otherwise--ymmv could be operator error.

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