Analysis Paralysis: Sunrace 11-46 or 11-50?!

[Dee Hubbs]

No input, just letting you know what I run.
On my hardtail 29er I have a 28t matched to an 11sp 11-45. This is an XTR 11-40 with a OneUp 45 added (with the 17 and 19 removed for an 18t). I like the even gear changes at the top.31,35,40,45. Weighs in at 390g (one up adds 65g) All shifting is done with SRAM XO Shifter and RD.

On my 27.5 5+5 trail bike I have a 28t matched to a 10-44. This is a XX1 10-42 with a OneUp 44 added (with the 42 removed). My 42 was showing some wear, and this extended the life of a $350 cassette. It only added 15g to the 265g cassette.
This is shifted by XX1 shifter and RD.
Both of these cassettes perform flawlessly, they shift just the same, if not better than the original cassette. No extra long cage or even funny b-screw length needed. I will buy OneUp stuff again and again, great gear that is well engineered.
Both 28t rings are Chromag direct mount rings. This has been my go to chain rings since direct mount was introduced.

[jm2e]

Is the backpedaling issue resolved yet? I’ve been shocked by how much better Sram Eagle is at chain retention. This is compared with Sram 10-42, Sunrace 11-42 and Shimano 11-42. Shim & SR especially bad, but maybe more recent generations are improved?

Hard to imagine Shimano hasn’t taken a massive market loss with no end in sight. Essentially irrelevant for drivetrains and Sram has finally figured out how to make brakes. Their attempt to enter wide range 1x (4 years late?) is mostly a myth, AND only affordable to dentists if it does materialize.


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[Jonny Snow]

Is the backpedaling issue resolved yet? I’ve been shocked by how much better Sram Eagle is at chain retention. This is compared with Sram 10-42, Sunrace 11-42 and Shimano 11-42. Shim & SR especially bad, but maybe more recent generations are improved?

Hard to imagine Shimano hasn’t taken a massive market loss with no end in sight. Essentially irrelevant for drivetrains and Sram has finally figured out how to make brakes. Their attempt to enter wide range 1x (4 years late?) is mostly a myth, AND only affordable to dentists if it does materialize.


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Imho Shimano has currently lost the high end market, the M9000 groupo was a huge misfire, but their slx and xt parts have been very competitive, even though they arent 12spd, they are nicer than gx and nx and less expensive.

[grinch]

New xtr is said to be a major improvement. I’ll be waiting for the trickle down xt equivalents

[simple]

You might wait forever. Shimano should just stick with road parts.

[grinch]

You might wait forever. Shimano should just stick with road parts.

I like things about sram and shimano. Codes are the only sram brakes I’d buy. Guides feel ok but lack power when it counts. Shifting is pretty good , albeit a bit loud and clunky but positive/definitive and durable. Overpriced though. Even gx is ridiculously priced. I can almost buy 2 xt drivetrains to one gx drivetrain. Xt is lighter and quieter but the der isn’t quite as durable. Shimano 4 piston brakes are my favourite brakes . Maybe when chainreaction jack their shimano prices I’ll buy hope brakes and sram shifting although I still see much better pricing on shimano

New shimano sounds great. Shimano tooling has always been great and their quality control benefits for it. Sram is all over the map with quality control(is it going to work or not, will it break or not, do my forks have oil in them or not). Maybe you have proper sram kit and works as designed for along time or maybe you’ve bought the duds and they’re a headache



Not a game changer but I swapped my sram stuff onto my free ride bike and the shimano onto the trail bike. I like the quietershifting on the trail bike. The clunky loud sram gave away any secret attacks. On the free ride bike the guides sucked on long steep trails. First time I had to use 2 fingers in a while . Loss of playfulness with 2 fingers but I didn’t die, so there’s that

[Jonny Snow]

What gets me is that they blew the syling on m9000, making it look just like m960 which nobody liked. M980 is great, m950 is iconic, m900 is classic, m970 was a good effort. I'm generally ok with m9100 but I think the crank will be a weak seller on style alone.

[sethschmautz]

Got another ride on my fat bike today with the 30x11-46 (sunrace). The shifting was great, the gearing was perfect - even on the ice covered steeper climbs.

I can almost buy 2 xt drivetrains to one gx drivetrain.

The economy is tough for me to justify anything else. I got a little Christmas cash to invest in parts and although my initial thought was "Maybe I should buy a nicer cassette!" I quickly came back to "... But I could buy 3-4 sunrace cassettes for the price of an e*thirteen or garbaruk. They are probably really nice, but I'm not racing and the money could be spent on a dropper, carbon fork, or even a used bluto for the fat bike for the same price. Hard (for me) to justify spending the money.

Seth

[grinch]

My sixc cranks have been working good. There’s always a concern in the back of my head withcarbon cranks though. I miss the simplistic functionality of shimano cranks. They just work. Ez on ez off. It’s nice that they finally have direct mount and weights are competitive. I’m not sure on the differences between the models you mentioned. I do like that they’re not black or at least not coated/coloured so they wear off in no time and look like shit

Edit:sorry Seth, that was meant in response to Jonny

[grinch]

Got another ride on my fat bike today with the 30x11-46 (sunrace). The shifting was great, the gearing was perfect - even on the ice covered steeper climbs.



The economy is tough for me to justify anything else. I got a little Christmas cash to invest in parts and although my initial thought was "Maybe I should buy a nicer cassette!" I quickly came back to "... But I could buy 3-4 sunrace cassettes for the price of an e*thirteen or garbaruk. They are probably really nice, but I'm not racing and the money could be spent on a dropper, carbon fork, or even a used bluto for the fat bike for the same price. Hard (for me) to justify spending the money.

Seth

Fair play. I guess the conditions a fat bike gets used in may cause excellerated wear on drivetrains. The garburuk is a worthy consideration for the right app. Considerable weight savings in a noticeable location on a full suspension bike and it’s reasonably priced compared to sram and e13. Chains are cheap and I’ve found no noticeable performance or weight benefits between any of them shimano/sram/those gold ones I can’t remember the name atm. I always have a spare cheapchain on hand and change them up regularly to extend the life of my cassettes, especially after getting a bike with sram. In that context the price/weight ratio for the gaburuk is better than a lot of upgrades , especially considering where the weight is and the added benefits. I haven’t used a gabaruk and am only going by word of mouth but all reviews have been favourable

[Jonny Snow]

I've been running 10spd dura-ace chains (7901?) for many years now, can't detect any measurable stretch to them when hung up and measured full length. Supposedly they tested out as being exceptional long wearing, and I don't ride nearly as much or torque as hard as your average serious road cyclist. I pull them, degrease and check them every couple hundred miles or so, and have had no problems with them on new cassettes.

[grinch]

I wasn’t aware of A chain that doesn’t wear out . Almost positive I’ve worn out a few dura ace chains. I don’t log mileage though. Figured they didn’t last 4x longer than a $15 sram/sedis chain with a quick link. Weighing chains didn’t produce much difference

[Jonny Snow]

I wasn’t aware of A chain that doesn’t wear out . Almost positive I’ve worn out a few dura ace chains. I don’t log mileage though. Figured they didn’t last 4x longer than a $15 sram/sedis chain with a quick link. Weighing chains didn’t produce much difference

I've got four of the dura-ace 10-spd CN-7901 chains that I got for about $30-35 several years ago on closeout. One is still new, three are on bikes - I put a new chain on my main bike then move it to secondary bikes after a season or two. I hang them up and measure "chain joint" wear across the full length of the chain with a steel tape measure, pin center to pin center and cannot see any measurable wear in my light use. I guess I could get out my calipers and see if I can detect any roller wear vs. the new chain. I use shimano pins to resize the chains as needed and SRAM master links to mount them.

Here is the test that shows the CN-7901 as being a massively long wearing chain, this was the hollow pin/hollow link asymmetric chain with staggeringly good engineering and quality.

https://www.tour-magazin.de/services...er_4_2011/#/46

However, you are correct that the CN-7901 does not wear 4x less than the $20 PC-1051 chain. It in fact wears EIGHT TIMES LESS, per the test. While the CN-7901 is out of production, they still offer the $20 CN-6701 which tested well too. There's the mountain bike version HG95, but I have no idea how that compares in a wear test.

[grinch]

May have to try one again. For a spell there I was sworn off any shimano chains. Hopefully the 11spd dura ace is similar construction to your 10’s

[Jonny Snow]

May have to try one again. For a spell there I was sworn off any shimano chains. Hopefully the 11spd dura ace is similar construction to your 10’s

I'm sure the CN-HG901 is quite good and worth the $36 current price. I might just have to pick up a couple myself.

I only ran Sachs/SRAM PC-91's for almost 20 years, so there's that.

[jm2e]

Just bought a Sunrace 11-46, a SRAM chain and an new chainring for <$150 after letting mrs jm2e's drivetrain grind away for too long. It's nuts that my decision was made more on available gear ratios than cost or brand. I would loved to have bought a Shimano cassette if I had any reason to believe they'd done anything to acknowledge and change their gear spacing and improve the backpedaling problem. Could have gone with Sram, but would have been closer to $300 after the Sram cassette tax AND the cost of a new i9 xd Driver.
But wait! Shimano's coming out with a new improved 11 AND 12 speed? And all I have to do is buy an XTR level cassette AND a new wheel? Maybe I'll wait 3 years for it to trickle down.

[scrublover]

I've recently replaced an XT 11-42 with a Box 11-46 (a re-branded SunRace) and it works beautifully. Went with it for the same reason as others - better ratio/jump in the last cogs vs. the Shimano 11-46.

Fairly cheap, not too stupid heavy, shifts very well. Only unknown at this point is longevity.

[jm2e]

I'd happily take a cassette that works well and wears out quickly over a cassette that feels like garbage and lasts forever!

[scrublover]

I'd happily take a cassette that works well and wears out quickly over a cassette that feels like garbage and lasts forever!

This is a good point, and one with which I agree!

For me and my riding, I've no need for a smaller cog than the 11. It gets rare use as it is. Around here, the 30 x 11-42 was working quite well. I'm digging having a bit more low end bail out though with the 46.

[rippling over canyons]

I've been running a Shimano XT-M8000 11-46 for almost a year and I've had zero backpedaling issues.

[crisco.lord]

I believe the backpedaling issue is caused by chainline issues, not cassettes. I've seen people have that problem on various cassettes that other people don't have an issue with.

[gramboh]

I believe the backpedaling issue is caused by chainline issues, not cassettes. I've seen people have that problem on various cassettes that other people don't have an issue with.

Yep. I have backpedal issues with the SunRace 11-46 on my YT Jeffsy but I know someone on a Banshee Spitfire with no problems.

[sethschmautz]

Agreed. I have no issue whatsoever backpedaling on my Kona Wo with the sunrace 11-46.

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[Tamburello Rouge]

May have to try one again. For a spell there I was sworn off any shimano chains. Hopefully the 11spd dura ace is similar construction to your 10’s

Not to derail the thread (har-har) but my last two DA chains lasted 18,000 and 20,000 miles each.

[grinch]

Not to derail the thread (har-har) but my last two DA chains lasted 18,000 and 20,000 miles each.

That’s good to know. Was that on a mtb or road? I clean my chains fairly regular but can’t seem to make them last that long. As stated before I haven’t been on a DA in a while though