Sentinel vs. Patrol

[toast2266]

Jumping in on the thread, question about sizing.

I'm in the market for a Smuggler (moving on from my V2 Bronson- just too much bike for 99% of what I ride). I'm in SF Bay Area (ride Briones, Annadel, UCSC, occasionally Auburn, etc). Thinking a mid-travel 29er will suit me perfect.

How is sizing on the transition line? I ride a Sz. L Bronson, which fits me perfect. I'm 5'10", longer torso vs. legs. I'd like to have at least a 125mm dropper, which I think would work on the large frame.

Any thoughts? I'm leaning towards large in the Transition line.

Large, for sure.

I'm slightly shorter than you, and the mediums feel not particularly big. The reach is long-ish, but the steep seat tube makes for a pretty short top tube.

[adrenalated]

Jumping in on the thread, question about sizing.

I'm in the market for a Smuggler (moving on from my V2 Bronson- just too much bike for 99% of what I ride). I'm in SF Bay Area (ride Briones, Annadel, UCSC, occasionally Auburn, etc). Thinking a mid-travel 29er will suit me perfect.

How is sizing on the transition line? I ride a Sz. L Bronson, which fits me perfect. I'm 5'10", longer torso vs. legs. I'd like to have at least a 125mm dropper, which I think would work on the large frame.

Any thoughts? I'm leaning towards large in the Transition line.

Large, for sure. I'm 5'9" and average torso and fit perfectly on a MD Patrol
Most likely you'll be able to fit much longer than a 125mm dropper. I have a 160mm OneUp dropper on my Patrol with lots of room to spare

[SchralphMacchio]

NorCal, what’s the stem length on your Bronson? Transition has longer reach than V2Bronson. I haven’t looked at the ETT numbers but Transition SBG geometry tends to have lower stack longer reach than most other frames.

I bet you could go either size on that Smuggler, with at least 150mm dropper, depending if you want a more stable feeling w/ like 35/40mm stem or more nimble but twitchier steering feeling w/like 60mm stem.

I think Guerilla Gravity now recommends Medium for up to 5’ 11” with their geo, depending how you want the bike to feel.

[SchralphMacchio]

Also I never felt my Bronson was “too much bike” for Bay Area, just that a 5010 would be “more fun” due to being able to pop around small features and accelerate more efficiently. I definitely liked my Bronson more at 150mm fork than 160mm fork in the Bay ... now back to 160mm up front for Oakridge vert and central Cascades chunk.

[Huskier]

Sentinel for speed. Patrol for fun.

Unless your definition of fun = speed. In which case, Sentinel.

Agree. My buddy's on last year's Nomad. We've agreed that the majority of the geometry is so similar (with a few variances) it's essentially the same bike. Nomad is slacker, more planted, tracks better, Patrol is more eager in the air and a better peddler. But this is all relative and the differences are minor. I'm taller and I went with the Patrol, just because the BB height and extra rotating mass of 29 felt less flickable, more rock-bashing monster-truck. You like fast and want a better climber and have ulterior financial incentives, all valid reasons to go Sentinel.

[robnow]

When I started looking into new bikes last year, I was ready to wait for the new HT, but after I rode a couple bikes with steep STAs and saw that the new Bronson didn't get there, I'm doubtful that SC is going to go all in on "forward geometry" as I'd like. Too bad, because I love the build quality of mine. I'm sure it will be a nice bike and sell gazillions, but assuming it's essentially a 29" Bronson, I personally would take a pass on it.

I kind of thought the same thing checking the Bronson specs...but it sounds like the first bike to come out will be more of an Enduro weapon, albeit probably a slightly conservative version of the Yeti SB150. Who knows, maybe they'll go nice round numbers like 450/475/500 reach, 76 SA, 65 HA, 160 front/150rear. I mean, the Sentinel has been rocking those numbers for TWO seasons now, seems likely SC will follow suit.

[bagtagley]

The numbers on the newest SC bikes are damn near perfect to me. I'd love to see a Tallboy with 5010ish suspension and geometry.

[smartyiak]

The numbers on the newest SC bikes are damn near perfect to me. I'd love to see a Tallboy with 5010ish suspension and geometry.

If they update both the TB and the HT (regular, not LT), it's gonna be a really tough choice between the two.

[NorCalSJK]

Also I never felt my Bronson was “too much bike” for Bay Area, just that a 5010 would be “more fun” due to being able to pop around small features and accelerate more efficiently. I definitely liked my Bronson more at 150mm fork than 160mm fork in the Bay ... now back to 160mm up front for Oakridge vert and central Cascades chunk.

Fair enough. I had my Fox 36 up at 160 for the summer, I think I'm going to switch it back to 150 and see how things feel from there. Honestly part of it is the mystery of the 29er. When they were first introduced (many moons ago) I rode/bought one and hated it. Since then, I've avoided them like the plague. Obviously they're a whole new animal now, and I'm curious.

[Banh Mi]

I had a sentinel, but only for a month or two. I loved it. Stable and plush, but still fun and I could pop off little shit here and there without thinking about it. I thought it climbed well compared to a lot of bikes I have tried. It was the first 29er I enjoyed enough to buy. I will probably buy a smuggler when I move to the city, since I always have a DH bike. I rode smugg and patrol too, just shortly, and both were amazing, but I like the Kona 153 a ton too, felt like my old Commencal Meta SX.


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[SchralphMacchio]

Honestly part of it is the mystery of the 29er. When they were first introduced (many moons ago) I rode/bought one and hated it.

The big wheels are not only fast, they cover up so many micro line mistakes ... like, ‘I should have gotten stuffed there, or I should have had to take a different entry into this feature, but no bother, big wheels keep on trucking ...’

With the right geo they are fun, fast and can rail corners. But one weak point of that geo and big hoops is the resulting long wheelbase can be a chore on switchback heavy trail areas like Tamarancho, Oakridge, etc.

[NorCalSJK]

The big wheels are not only fast, they cover up so many micro line mistakes ... like, ‘I should have gotten stuffed there, or I should have had to take a different entry into this feature, but no bother, big wheels keep on trucking ...’

With the right geo they are fun, fast and can rail corners. But one weak point of that geo and big hoops is the resulting long wheelbase can be a chore on switchback heavy trail areas like Tamarancho, Oakridge, etc.

So what I hear you saying is, N+1 (keep Bronson, add Smuggler?)

Definitely agree, I've seen my buddies on 29er struggle a big on techy switchbacks, but, that's few and far between. Mostly riding Briones, Annadel, Lime Ridge, Shell Ridge, with the occasional UCSC, Downieville, Georgetown, Auburn.

[SchralphMacchio]

You’re missing out on JMP night laps and China Camp backside ...

[Andeh]

If anyone cares, I ended up getting a Sentinel. I snagged one of the discounted factory demo bikes from Transition after confirming that it would still be eligible for crash replacement warranty (something I couldn't get with a used one off Pinkbike). I was planning on building frame up, but this lets me put the takeoff parts on my Nomad to sell, which hopefully makes it more attractive (compared to just frame/fork/wheels).

[BlueBison]

Congrats! Let's get some pics and thoughts on it once you build it.

[JLF1200]

I also picked up a Sentinel. I found a price on a used custom build that Im confident I can recoup in a resale. So I'm running an extended test, riding the Scout and Sentinel back to back on my local trails (Auburn, Georgetown, Tahoe, secret stuff in between) and putting one up for sale in the spring. So far I have 5-7 rides on each bike, and I honestly can't tell which one I like more, which is hilarious since they're at the opposite ends of the spectrum. Both bikes have a number of unexpected characteristics that make the decision hard. The Sentinel certainly looks like "too much bike," but being a 29er and 3-4 lbs lighter than the Scout, it's also the better climber (carbon vs alu). And it carries so much speed that I actually end up in the air more (and longer) than when riding the Scout. The Sentinel is just a big, fast monster of a bike. The Scout is small and reminds me of a Porsche: it really makes no sense, but for unknown reasons it's fun as hell and shines when you least expect it. Even though it can't blast through gnar like the Sentinel, I've ridden some extremely steep, fast stuff lately on the Sentinel where I really wished I had the Scout instead.

All I can say is we live in amazing times. Bikes are too good, and there aren't any bad options.

[Andeh]

I had to laugh when later today after I placed my order, Pinkbike posted their editor's poll on what their dream bike setup would be, and every single one used a reduced offset fork, everyone but the girl chose 29er, everyone wanted a STA above 76, and everyone but the old guy wanted a HTA at or under 65. Those were all things I was looking for, and when you correct for height, the reach I was thinking of was right in line too. I guess I'm a trendy mofo.