Page 17 of 20 FirstFirst ... 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 LastLast
Results 401 to 425 of 483
  1. #401
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    21
    I would appreciate some advice about the Black Diamond Helio 180/145 or ATK Trofeo / Trofeo Plus bindings. It seems like are a fair number of you with experience!

    CHANGING RISER HEIGHT
    Is it a pain in the ass to change heel riser height in the backcountry? Do you have to kneel to turn the heel by hand to go from flat to elevated heel, and do you do it often? Are there actually only 2 heel riser heights (flat + medium)? According to this chart, there are 3. https://skimo.co/binding-riser-heights.

    A comment on wildsnow suggested that changing to "SLR Release" Heel Cover would give you another riser height. (https://www.atkbindings.com/en/prodo...se-heel-cover/) Is this true and worth considering?

    FIXED U-PIN
    Are fixed u-pins a big disadvantage? It seems like they increase wear on the pins and the heel fitting. Do you need to replace these parts periodically, and is it an issue? Is there any safety compromise with a u-pin binding?

    INSTALLATION
    Is it hard to find a shop with a jig for these bindings? Is it possible to DIY install the BD Helio 145 / ATK Trofeo with a paper template? It seems like this would be tough since no length adjustment means you need to drill holes exactly for the BSL. For that reason, it seems like the Helio 180 / Trofeo Plus seems easier for a DIY install.

    SKI CRAMPONS
    Do all the bindings come with a ski crampon attachment point?

    RELEASE VALUE
    The bindings ship with a set release value, but is it possible to change the lateral release of the heel somehow through disassmbly?

    I'm advising my sister who is new to the backcountry on which binding to buy. The ATK Trofeo actually comes with a release value of 4 which may work for her since she is short, light, and not going to be charging big lines. I think she'd benefit from lighter gear. I just want to make sure this binding is not a pain for a newer, less efficient bc skier. If you have alternative suggestions, I'd love to hear them.

    Thanks in advance!

  2. #402
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    71
    Quote Originally Posted by jindustry View Post
    FIXED U-PIN
    Are fixed u-pins a big disadvantage? It seems like they increase wear on the pins and the heel fitting. Do you need to replace these parts periodically, and is it an issue? Is there any safety compromise with a u-pin binding?
    According to the bench testing at G3 yes a u-spring has different release values at every step in, and the change in release value can be unpredictable. (due to wear) - Regular replacement of heel plates or a roller pin u-spring can mitigate this issue.

    Source: blister gear podcast

  3. #403
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    75
    I've got the trofeo+/180 on some light skis and just ordered a second pair for powder skis. They come with a crampon mount (145/non plus does not but you can buy one). Paper jig mounting was easy, make sure you mount the heel the right way forward ... picture on the BD site is the wrong way forward and impedes the flat mode due to the side notches being offset a bit.

    Mostly I just ski them with the flap over the pins which gives a medium-low riser. You have to kneel down to twist to flat mode or to twist them all the way around to access the "high mode" which isn't much higher then the medium mode.

    You can't really change the rv after purchase. You could change the U spring to change the upward release but not the sideways. Easiest thing to do would be to order a new pair of unadjustable torfeos in the new rv for cheap from europe and then swap the heel piece on the adjustment plate and sell the old heel / new toe. (Can't seem to buy just the heel anywhere).

    This is my first U spring binding and i have limited time on them but the u springs and the heel fitting on all my boots are easy to replace.

    Lack of a high riser and lack of ability to swap risers with a pole are the biggest downside. Not much of an issue for me as i'm usually setting my own skin track and using high ROM boots (f1s) but could be a pain for a newer tourer with less flexible boots or trying to follow a steep skin track. Dealing with leashes is kind of a pain for a new tourer too. Maybe look at the atk crest lightweight or haute route/bd 200 as well? If you're going to order new heel flaps the price isn't much different.

  4. #404
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Sun Valley, ID
    Posts
    1,813
    Quote Originally Posted by IanCH View Post
    According to the bench testing at G3 yes a u-spring has different release values at every step in, and the change in release value can be unpredictable. (due to wear) - Regular replacement of heel plates or a roller pin u-spring can mitigate this issue.

    Source: blister gear podcast
    I think G3 overstated the problem to the point of nonsense. High quality spring steel can do 1000ís of cycles. Pin wear should be monitored though.

  5. #405
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Colorado Front Range
    Posts
    3,622
    Quote Originally Posted by ryan b View Post
    Lack of a high riser and lack of ability to swap risers with a pole are the biggest downside. Not much of an issue for me as i'm usually setting my own skin track and using high ROM boots (f1s) but could be a pain for a newer tourer with less flexible boots or trying to follow a steep skin track. Dealing with leashes is kind of a pain for a new tourer too. Maybe look at the atk crest lightweight or haute route/bd 200 as well? If you're going to order new heel flaps the price isn't much different.
    Crest and Haute Route (Helio 200) also have a single heel flap: (a) over the pins in the "normal/pins forward" position and (b) slightly higher + flat when rotated 180 degrees.

    I love my Helio 200s, but when the skin track is steeper than I'd prefer, my right achilles gets stressed out, even when the heel is rotated 180 degrees. That's been a problem foot since a climbing fall several years ago.

    The riser thing has me pondering the R12 with it's double flippers.

    The ATK site is chock full of info, but as with most products, you need to get a handle on their language. 3 riser modes means what we're discussing (Trofeo, Haute Route, Crest, etc.). 5 modes means a 2nd flipper (R12 & FR14) which is usable in the "normal" as well as 180 degree rotated position.

    ...Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  6. #406
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    71
    Quote Originally Posted by CaliBrit View Post
    I think G3 overstated the problem to the point of nonsense. High quality spring steel can do 1000ís of cycles. Pin wear should be monitored though.
    I think the issue is in the heel plate not the spring itself. The bearing tip u springs prevent heel piece wear.

    Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

  7. #407
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Not Brooklyn
    Posts
    6,399
    Quote Originally Posted by CaliBrit View Post
    I think G3 overstated the problem to the point of nonsense. High quality spring steel can do 1000’s of cycles. Pin wear should be monitored though.
    This. It was G3's way of explaining why I should buy their bindings, even though I can think of no good reason to do so.

  8. #408
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    75
    Quote Originally Posted by galibier_numero_un View Post
    Crest and Haute Route (Helio 200) also have a single heel flap: (a) over the pins in the "normal/pins forward" position and (b) slightly higher + flat when rotated 180 degrees.

    I love my Helio 200s, but when the skin track is steeper than I'd prefer, my right achilles gets stressed out, even when the heel is rotated 180 degrees. That's been a problem foot since a climbing fall several years ago.

    The riser thing has me pondering the R12 with it's double flippers.

    The ATK site is chock full of info, but as with most products, you need to get a handle on their language. 3 riser modes means what we're discussing (Trofeo, Haute Route, Crest, etc.). 5 modes means a 2nd flipper (R12 & FR14) which is usable in the "normal" as well as 180 degree rotated position.

    ...Thom
    The high riser on the trofeo is only 5 mm higher then the medium which is pretty much useless. For the haute route it is 13 according to https://skimo.co/binding-riser-heights

    Someone should figure out an after market double flap riser.

  9. #409
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    21
    Thanks so much for your input, ryan b, CaliBrit , galibier_numero_un, IanCH, I've seen black diamonds!

    Looking at the riser heights closer, I notice the "middle" of a Dynafit Speed Turn is quite a bit higher than the only riser position of the ATK Trofeo (BD Helio 145/180). In fact, the BD Helio 200 / ATK Haute Route "highest" position is about the same as "middle" for the Speed Turn. I'm looking at the delta column. I wonder if it's possible to reverse that riser lever, so you could get 5mm more rise in the "normal" flip position. It seems like a dual flippers would be ideal. https://skimo.co/binding-riser-heights

    I'd like to find a binding that goes as low as a 4 release value for my sister, so that limits the choices. It seems like ATK Trofeo (plus) and Dynafit Speed Turn are 2 candidates. The Speed Turn weighs twice as much but has more riser options and you don't have to turn the heel by hand. I guess I'll have to weigh the tradeoffs. Thanks again, guys.

  10. #410
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Colorado Front Range
    Posts
    3,622
    Quote Originally Posted by ryan b View Post
    The high riser on the trofeo is only 5 mm higher then the medium which is pretty much useless. For the haute route it is 13 according to https://skimo.co/binding-riser-heights

    Someone should figure out an after market double flap riser.
    Agreed. When anyone asks me about the two "different" riser positions, I reply "medium an medium plus". I've taken to rotating 180 at the start of a tour so I have the flat optio when necessary.

    A dual riser option is the only thing that keeps my Helio 200 from being the ideal binding for me and my tight, right Achilles.

    BTW, I like Skimo's stated riser measuring methodology (toe pin to bottom of boot heel delta), but if you verify it using your own measurements, you'll find they're way off.

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  11. #411
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Sun Valley, ID
    Posts
    1,813

    The 300g Touring Binding Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by IanCH View Post
    I think the issue is in the heel plate not the spring itself. The bearing tip u springs prevent heel piece wear.

    Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
    Yeah but that doesnít change in a few clip ins which was their claims....
    Last edited by CaliBrit; 02-20-2020 at 06:04 AM.

  12. #412
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Posts
    49
    Quote Originally Posted by jindustry View Post
    Thanks so much for your input, ryan b, CaliBrit , galibier_numero_un, IanCH, I've seen black diamonds!

    Looking at the riser heights closer, I notice the "middle" of a Dynafit Speed Turn is quite a bit higher than the only riser position of the ATK Trofeo (BD Helio 145/180). In fact, the BD Helio 200 / ATK Haute Route "highest" position is about the same as "middle" for the Speed Turn. I'm looking at the delta column. I wonder if it's possible to reverse that riser lever, so you could get 5mm more rise in the "normal" flip position. It seems like a dual flippers would be ideal. https://skimo.co/binding-riser-heights

    I'd like to find a binding that goes as low as a 4 release value for my sister, so that limits the choices. It seems like ATK Trofeo (plus) and Dynafit Speed Turn are 2 candidates. The Speed Turn weighs twice as much but has more riser options and you don't have to turn the heel by hand. I guess I'll have to weigh the tradeoffs. Thanks again, guys.
    Why not look at the ATK Crest 8? Goes down to 3...

    Same risers as the Helio 200. Crest weighs 280g with brakes (you can remove them).

  13. #413
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Squaw valley
    Posts
    2,836
    Why don't you guys buy the Salomon mtn and be done?

    No need to turn the bindings, high rise, bomber.

    Sent from my Redmi Note 8 Pro using Tapatalk

  14. #414
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Sun Valley, ID
    Posts
    1,813
    Quote Originally Posted by rod9301 View Post
    Why don't you guys buy the Salomon mtn and be done?

    No need to turn the bindings, high rise, bomber.

    Sent from my Redmi Note 8 Pro using Tapatalk
    Never realized that, pretty neat. But how flat is the flat mode?

  15. #415
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Squaw valley
    Posts
    2,836
    Quote Originally Posted by CaliBrit View Post
    Never realized that, pretty neat. But how flat is the flat mode?
    Flat enough that i don't feel the ramp at all, even on totally flat approaches.

    Sent from my Redmi Note 8 Pro using Tapatalk

  16. #416
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    267
    I always thought that Salomon MTN was not so popular due to U-spring

  17. #417
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Posts
    49
    Why didn't I choose it?

    ATK Crest is cheaper, lighter, more reliable, and not a U Spring.

    Jindustry was looking for a binding that went down to 4 DIN, the lightest spring for the MTN binding is approx 6...

  18. #418
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Western MT
    Posts
    1,448
    Quote Originally Posted by JoeyFish View Post
    Why didn't I choose it?

    ATK Crest is cheaper, lighter, more reliable, and not a U Spring.

    Jindustry was looking for a binding that went down to 4 DIN, the lightest spring for the MTN binding is approx 6...
    Curious what are you basing the more reliable comment on?

  19. #419
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    6,030
    Quote Originally Posted by rod9301 View Post
    Why don't you guys buy the Salomon mtn and be done?

    No need to turn the bindings, high rise, bomber.

    Sent from my Redmi Note 8 Pro using Tapatalk
    Did you do anything about the ramp angle?
    For Sale:


    Dynastar Legend Factory 115 mounted 1x for 306mm Look Pivot

    Steeple 102 in a 184 mounted 1x for 302 Kingpins (mounting insert mishap though)

    Salomon Ghost 130 (Orange and Black Model Year) 26.5

    POC Auric Cut BC Spin XL

    https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...90#post5923890

    If you're in the Northeast and would like to borrow some Jigarex Plates I have:

    Rossi/Look plates
    Salomon Warden 13 plates
    Marker Kingpin Plates

  20. #420
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Squaw valley
    Posts
    2,836
    Quote Originally Posted by nyskirat View Post
    Did you do anything about the ramp angle?
    No, it doesn't have an excessive ramp, not like dynafit or g3 ions, of which i had a few.

    Sent from my Redmi Note 8 Pro using Tapatalk

  21. #421
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    318
    Just wanted to throw in my experience on my ATK Crest 10. I fucking love these binders. Rear release is set to 8 and after skiing a long day last week, I never had any release issues including some pillow drops, off camber landings, and weird icy patches. However, they did release as expected on a chunky downhill skin track where I got caught in the luge run.

    Downhill they’re super solid, I’m also very happy with the ramp angle and the risers. Most skin tracks, the riser over pins (medium) is perfect. For steeper skin tracks, the high riser just requires you flip the tower 180 degrees, which takes about 3 seconds per ski to bend down and turn it, usually while other folks are still fiddling with the flippy risers on their dynafits.

  22. #422
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    21
    Quote Originally Posted by JoeyFish View Post
    Why didn't I choose it?

    ATK Crest is cheaper, lighter, more reliable, and not a U Spring.

    Jindustry was looking for a binding that went down to 4 DIN, the lightest spring for the MTN binding is approx 6...
    Thanks, JoeyFish for the suggestion of the ATK Crest 8! Falcon3, thanks for your feedback on the Crest Binding.

    ATK's has inconvenietly named the binding after it's highest release value, and I didn't realize they made an adjustable binding that went as low as release value 3. I wasn't really looking for the added weight and complexity of a heel spring / "elastic response system", but it's weight is low, especially considering the features, so it looks like a good choice for a very light skier!

  23. #423
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Sun Valley, ID
    Posts
    1,813
    Quote Originally Posted by Falcon3 View Post
    Just wanted to throw in my experience on my ATK Crest 10. I fucking love these binders. Rear release is set to 8 and after skiing a long day last week, I never had any release issues including some pillow drops, off camber landings, and weird icy patches. However, they did release as expected on a chunky downhill skin track where I got caught in the luge run.

    Downhill theyíre super solid, Iím also very happy with the ramp angle and the risers. Most skin tracks, the riser over pins (medium) is perfect. For steeper skin tracks, the high riser just requires you flip the tower 180 degrees, which takes about 3 seconds per ski to bend down and turn it, usually while other folks are still fiddling with the flippy risers on their dynafits.
    Tempted by these as Iím finding the marker alpinist a little flat.

  24. #424
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    743
    I had a full day out on ATK FR14s today (resort riding to get to know the skis - Rustler10s - and bindings). I must mirror what has been stated previously - ATK FR14s ski really solidly with excellent power transfer. The toes are about as smooth as a leopard giving a facial (to quote the late and grat Robin Williams), though that kinda comes with the territory I guess.

    I also found out the hard way that they release smoothly in the event of a fall. I had the slam of the season today, and the right ski (that I manged to put square into / got caught in a depression/hole in a high speed, icy section) released smoothly and frankly impressively well. I was going down regardless due to being thrown off balance / rotated by the right foot getting somewhat hung up, so I am very happy that the ski released like it did.

    I am very happy with them so far. Noticeably easier to step into than Salomon's excellent MTN bindings, and those are pretty easy to get into as well.

    I have not gone uphill with them so far, but I expect them to that brilliantly like all tech binders.

    Recommended, though MTN/Backlands are excellent too at a much lower price.
    Last edited by kid-kapow; 03-06-2020 at 11:56 AM. Reason: added ATK re a few posts down :)

  25. #425
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Access to Granlibakken
    Posts
    7,466
    Getting more and more miles on my alpinist 12s, and I think over time Iím going to migrate most of AT quiver to Alpinists. Yesterday for shiggles I took my Praxis 9D8 / F1 setup to a resort and not only had no prereleases at speed on refrozen shitfuck, but in general there was a smoothness not normally associated with tech bindings other than my Vipecs or similar. Outdoor Gear Lab and Blister both emphasized this. $260 price tag makes buying 3 pairs conceivable for a quiver update. That U spring is $9 in yurp, so no biggie if I replace every 2-3 yrs.

    The Tall riser setting is more Medium Plus, but that doesnít seem an issue with my F1s on any steep Tahoe skin track. It is an occasional issue with my Maestrales but those boots now only get used with my vipecs and kingpins so no a big deal.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •