The 300g Touring Binding Thread

[riff]

I’ve settled somewhere in the middle of those two concepts. I like having an adjustment plate to loan skis or use different boots, and the tall riser is nice more often than I’d like to admit, despite preferring low angle skinners. I do have back and hip problems though, high riser may not be a necessity for you.
I don’t think there’s a tremendous safety difference, as long as the toes are strong enough. I’m currently a big fan of Plum Oazo’s. Two risers, adjustable BSL, great toepieces. Also, the heel is big enough to twist easily for flat mode. I have ATK race heels and they are a bitch to turn sometimes.


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[abcdethan]

I’ve settled somewhere in the middle of those two concepts. I like having an adjustment plate to loan skis or use different boots, and the tall riser is nice more often than I’d like to admit, despite preferring low angle skinners. I do have back and hip problems though, high riser may not be a necessity for you.
I don’t think there’s a tremendous safety difference, as long as the toes are strong enough. I’m currently a big fan of Plum Oazo’s. Two risers, adjustable BSL, great toepieces. Also, the heel is big enough to twist easily for flat mode. I have ATK race heels and they are a bitch to turn sometimes.


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I second this sentiment. I also have the Plum R170s and its worth the extra grams for the Oazos to have a bigger heel piece to turn with your hand with ease. The R170 can be tough to turn in the field.

[frorider]

Ok sorry everyone but finally providing an update on my side project of a killer heel elevator that IME turns the Marker Alpinist into arguably one of the two or three best in this category…and at $270 when ordered from Yurp, the best value.

Pic 1: Our CNC’d final prototype on the left vs the stock riser on the right:


Pic 2: tallest position (28.5 boot)


Pic 3: medium position


We’ll provide more information (e.g. dimensions and preorder details) in a separate new thread. As with my World Famous Strap Off product this is a labor of love for me that I don’t make money from…but Collin, my friend & Director of Manufacturing, certainly deserves to make a small profit

So for now I just wanted to announce after much testing and refinement we arrived at a final prototype (thx everyone for the DM’s and patience). For an extra 9 grams or so, you get an actually useful Medium heel riser height (equal to the ‘Tall’ stock riser position!) for moderate to somewhat steep skin tracks, and you get an awesome Tall position for steep skin tracks that feels incredibly stable thanks to the flat shelf design and product stiffness. Rotating the binding via pole tip or by hand is greatly improved too.

Collin will help fill in the details but he thinks $49.95 plus shipping is doable.

So keep an eye out for that Preorder thread. Pls don’t clutter up THIS ‘300 g’ thread or my PMs with preorder requests. But as the main designer and tester I’m happy to answer your other questions here.

[hick]

^^^that is fucking awesome!! Loved the way the Alpinist skied, but hated the finicky low floppy risers.


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[frorider]

^^^that is fucking awesome!! Loved the way the Alpinist skied, but hated the finicky low floppy risers.


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A million users and Blister and Outdoor Gear Lab agree with you. Having a zero gap heel piece and a reasonably elastic (and reliable) toepiece is the key. I’m stoked this heel riser project worked out.

Reminds me—Yes we designed it to create a more positive positioning. Of course even the stock Alpinist riser is less floppy than the Salomon Mtn, but we tried to improve it further.

[Blaster]

So keep an eye out for that Preorder thread. Pls don’t clutter up THIS ‘300 g’ thread or my PMs with preorder requests. But as the main designer and tester I’m happy to answer your other questions here.

Hell ya,

One question is what metal did you use? And is it any harder or softer than the stock riser? One of the issues with the first gen alpinists was that they used a straight steel bar for the spring to hold the heel riser in position. That bar was a good bit harder than the stock aluminum heel riser so after a medium amount of use would wear a grove into the heel riser, lose the spring pressure, and go all flaccid. The 2nd gen of the alpinist have an s shaped bar that you can see in your last photo to avoid this.

[frorider]

6061-T6 aluminum for the protos; production will be an anodized version for addl hardness. I and my test crew tour a lot, so I feel pretty good about the net improvement in ‘positive engagement’, but IME it helps to smear a dab of grease in there occasionally to reduce wear.

In the preorder thread we will discuss the DIY home installation process. It’s not difficult but we’d like to see shops stock the product to provide another installation option.

[kid-kapow]

That is nice! I do not plan to run Alpinists any time soon, but still appreciate the effort. Ideally a solution involving not having to svivel the heel to unlock two modes would have been ideal, but it probably adds a lot of complexity to make it work.

I know I am hardly the first one to run this setup, but this is what I have planned for my two main pairs of touring skis this coming winter: Vario.2 toes and ATK R/FR w/Freeride spacer heels. I am admittedly pretty excited to try the combo. The stock vario.2 heels skied fine and the lack of risers weren't much of an issue, but more is better, as are brakes

[meter-man]

Hell yeah frorider - please cross-post the thread link here whenever it goes live!

[Island Bay]

A tricky binding question:

My beloved, and ancient, Protests have Sollyfit plates, and I've been skiing them with Solly Drivers and Dynafit Radicals. And yes, one of the heels broke (roof came off), but luckily on the last climb of a Japan holiday, and a Voile strap saved the day.

I'm now unsurprisingly wary of going anywhere with those bindings, but my options seem limited. Skis are already drilled for the Drivers, so can't really do inserts for those and new touring bindings.

Would the best way be to buy some Kreutzspitze heels and plates, and keep the Radical toes?

Plates:
https://skimo.co/kreuzspitze-adjustment-plates

[frorider]

Kid kapow, we did consider designing a dual lever system but given the architecture of the marker heel piece itself there was no good solution that was light/reliable/stable.

As a 190 lb guy I can say the solidity of our aftermarket riser is noticeably better than a lot of bindings our there. Gives you confidence in those weird skinning situations.

[skis_the_trees]

A tricky binding question:

My beloved, and ancient, Protests have Sollyfit plates, and I've been skiing them with Solly Drivers and Dynafit Radicals. And yes, one of the heels broke (roof came off)…
Would the best way be to buy some Kreutzspitze heels and plates, and keep the Radical toes?

Plates:
https://skimo.co/kreuzspitze-adjustment-plates

The 14mm adjustment plate that is a radical mount pattern is a great option and will save some weight with a race style heel. How old are your radicals? The toes seem to last a very long time (indefinitely) but Dynafit did some updates on the heel design the first few years (check wildsnow.com for details). Dynafit might replace your heels if they are 1st Gen. The newest speed radical heel is better and just replacing your heels with those is reasonable.



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[Island Bay]

Good idea on the improved Radical ST heel pieces. Thanks.

The bindings are old, and Dynafit in NZ actually replaced the broken heel, but it's still the old version with the suspect roof.

[ezgzy]

https://skimo.co/slatnar-touring-bindings new player available, looks pretty interesting. 335 grams, fixed release, freeride spacer and it looks like they have elastic heel travel. Benneke posted about them in another thread but I figured I would post here as well

[frorider]

Hell yeah frorider - please cross-post the thread link here whenever it goes live!

https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...rker-Alpinists

[sweatypowderpig]

Haven’t seen it mentioned yet but Salomon recalled a run of MTN Pure

[ASmileyFace]

https://skimo.co/slatnar-touring-bindings new player available, looks pretty interesting. 335 grams, fixed release, freeride spacer and it looks like they have elastic heel travel. Benneke posted about them in another thread but I figured I would post here as well

$499.95 is a lot less than I expected and puts it solidly in the "affordable" range for tech bindings. I'll be curious to hear from anyone who gets on them here.

[Pins and Skins]

Their mounting pattern is wide as well, so could be used on fatter skis as perhaps an alternative to Alpinists or ATKs. But their mounting pattern is also unique, so can't imagine too many shops can mount them. I don't see any jigs or even paper templates out there.

$499.95 is a lot less than I expected and puts it solidly in the "affordable" range for tech bindings. I'll be curious to hear from anyone who gets on them here.

[ezgzy]

https://shop.slatnar.com/product/tou...ndings-st-1-0/ direct via the manufacturer comes out to 414 shipped to the US for me

[frorider]

330g w/o brakes for the Slatnars, so heavier than the Alpinists and carbon ATK competition but the 50 mm of BSL adjustment is nice.

I think I’ll stick with $250 Alpinists from the euro retailers but interested to see Slatnar reviews.

[Benneke10]

I believe ATK Freeraiders weigh almost exactly the same, around 330g with the freeride spacer and no brake. I bet the freeride spacer on the slatnar is more durable and performs at least as good

[dcpnz]

Isn’t this Slatner just a basic U-fork style heel .
Maybe I’m missing something but for same/less weight I’d take an ATK Raider with cam release heel or go full weight weeny with a much lighter race style U-heel

[fleaches]

I'd really like to see something that's a trab style toe, light atk cam heel, and low profile freeride spacer. I mean I guess there's nothing stopping me from putting this together myself...

Did atk release some kind of a low profile freeride spacer? The 15 mm tall "universal" one is too tall for any of the light bindings I have.

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[fleaches]

Also missed opportunity here, Slatnar could have been Slat-gnar

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[Cocximus]

I'd really like to see something that's a trab style toe, light atk cam heel, and low profile freeride spacer. I mean I guess there's nothing stopping me from putting this together myself...

Did atk release some kind of a low profile freeride spacer? The 15 mm tall "universal" one is too tall for any of the light bindings I have.

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+1