18/19 Jackson/Targhee/Tetons Thread- Ski the big red one

[Parvo]

So they are going to keep coming and the village is not going to make money? Hum... doesn’t sound sustainable

I'd tell them to pay up or pound sand - nobody rides for free!

[skibrd]

I'd tell them to pay up or pound sand - nobody rides for free!

Yeah BS

Other note, my best guess for the comp is:

Girls
1- Catie Zeliff - first run
2- Ashley Babcock - first run
3- ??? I guess Hana Beaman - first run might of stomped the backflip if she didn’t hit Teton Browns ski? No other girl didn’t crash so I guess it’s either Hana or Veronica Paulson?

Guys
1- T. Rice - first run was the best of the comp
2- Crazy Karl - second run was so clean, close to TRs first run but TR had one more hit and went bigger. Crazy Karl might pull off the replete if he gets more points for his massive black flips, but I don’t think so.
3- Blaine Gallivan- second run was clean, but airs, stomped them all, no other guy was close.

Now my personal awards:
Girls sickbird - Veronica for almost being able to tuck for a double backie. Girl sent it HUGE with no regrets. She’s going to stick it one of these days and it’s going to be amazing
Guys sickbird- Trevor Kennison for sending it how deep on a sit ski? Are you kidding me? He went so big that when he landed and his ski bounced, he went another 40 plus feet before landing again. This dude needs to never buy a beer again at a ski bar in the world. Might need a second wheelchair for his balls too. We have all seen some cool shit in the ski world, but this was one of the coolest.


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[schwerty]

Given the fistfights that almost broke out in the AV line last year on presidents weekends pow day, this weekend could still make for some ikonic conditions. Plus, some folks (like me) bought the non black out pass so we could use it on the holidays.
I don’t think I’m the “average” ikon user, but I would say that 20 yrs ago when I started skiing jh I rarely if ever skied the village and stuck to the backcountry. Then I had kids about 10 yrs ago, was able to afford (and got off my bc high horse) a few more tickets a year, had less time, skied more and more out the gates, and then mtn collective started and my days became more like 50-50 bc/village over recent seasons. And my kids aren’t quite ready for glory laps (soon!). Anyway, everywhere in the world is more crowded, except for maybe western New York and small towns in the Midwest.
Hopefully the sun won’t come out this weekend.
Schwerty — I’ll be riding around w the fam for the most part; let’s make turns if you’re in town. I got to get you back, too

You bet! Kids should be over the damn flu, colds and general school germ bullshit by then!

Skiing outta be good! If not, cocktails will be!

Let me know what the plan is.

[eagleskier]

Hey mags I'll be back in town skiing JH this next week, (spent some time in December with DJ and Koko). I'll probably be spending Monday with one of my buddies from Boise, but the rest of the week is pretty open. For the most part I'll be skiing in the AM and working in the afternoon. Just PM me if you want to get out on any of those days.

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[LesterSmoove]

I heard Ikon pays JHMR $70 per redemption and their pot of village dough is nearly spent. Not sure what AltaBird get, but heard they may be SOL as far as getting their redemption cash due to the high usage. Not sure this is a sustainable model.

I've felt the same way. I don't understand how this makes sense long term for JHMR when the resort doesn't own hotels, does not own the most popular base village restaurants, and when I doubt that IKON can afford to pay JHMR the current redemptions without greatly raising the price of IKON pass. The crowds are certainly cheapening the experience at the village. if the resort were to leave ikon, they'll have given a bunch of ikon passholders their first taste of the resort, and my guess is that the better skiers of the ikon bunch would come back in the future and pay more money for actual lift passes just because it's worth it to pay more for jackson

[swerve]

I heard Ikon pays JHMR $70 per redemption and their pot of village dough is nearly spent. Not sure what AltaBird get, but heard they may be SOL as far as getting their redemption cash due to the high usage. Not sure this is a sustainable model.

I'm gonna bet ikon works the same way as mountain collective. Each skier day gets an estimated value based on budgeted revenue and skier days. Each month all the resorts are disbursed money based on skier days and the per day dollar amount might also be revised. At the end of the season everything is trued up to the total actual number of skier days and revenue.
So you're kind of right in that each day has a value and there is a limited amount of money but each skier days value is a constantly decreasing number as there are more and more total skier days. The marginal cost for a resort to add another skier to the hill is almost nothing so with a model like this it incentives them to get as many people as possible on the hill. Obviously at some point the quality of the experience will fall off but people bitch every year about how crowds are worse than last year.
Next time I'm having a drink with some of my old co-workers I'll see if I can get actual details.

[AdironRider]

I'm back on the no ikon train. I was still in a state of powder euphoria during my previous comments.

I also heard that JHole gets 80 or 82 bucks per head, but haven't heard anything about that rate being variable or there being a cap. I also heard that Vail offered substantially more to go Ikon, but the Kemmers told Vail to fuck themselves and that they hate them.

Whatever the number is, I bet they ask for substantially more for next year if they stay on it.

This is also the first time I think there is enough blow back that they might actually decide the juice isn't worth the squeeze. Jhole is in a relatively unique position to do this vs most of the other participants who really need the increase more than we do.

[muted]

Anyone see the snowboarder jump the big permanently closed cliff under Sublette yesterday? I can’t remember the name of it. He popped out of his bomb hole and was wearing an employee jacket, it was hilarious. Maybe he was planning on quitting anyways if he got caught.

Here’s a heavily cropped photo from yesterday so you can’t see where it is although it should be obvious to locals. Nobody posts ski photos in this thread so I thought I should crop the background out in case someone gets crusty about their local stash.

Hate to leave before it gets even better, but leaving one big storm for another at home. What a crazy winter.

[AdironRider]

Diving board is a grade A send I haven't seen done in while. Way to quit in style.

[Foggy_Goggles]

I also heard that JHole gets 80 or 82 bucks per head

If that is even remotely close to true and Alterra is OK with that number, I'd guess you should get used to it. That is a pile of marginal revenue.

What is the armchair economists are wrong and it is a long term gold mine for the owners, then what?

I love the argument that the long term viability of the business ain't the locals' problem right up until the locals' have a problem that they think is counter to the long term viability of the business.

What if the IKONards get bent about all the locals with passholders making it so busy? Why if the ski area stops selling season passes?

I get it but it has been happening since the beginning of time. Too much money chasing too little pow and terrain.

[AdironRider]

You really going to argue that if JHole didn't go Ikon they wouldn't be a viable business long term?

[skaredshtles]

You really going to argue that if JHole didn't go Ikon they wouldn't be a viable business long term?

I'm tellin' ya - they're angling to get BOUGHT by Alterra.

[Foggy_Goggles]

You really going to argue that if JHole didn't go Ikon they wouldn't be a viable business long term?

No, to use your verbiage, I'm saying that the juice may actually be worth the squeeze. A pile of skiers at +/- $80 with I'm guessing close to zero marketing costs is probably good for business.

Sucks for the local skiers but if that number is correct, I'd love to know the rational behind why it is bad for business. That's all I am getting at. Walk on trams in 95 were great but I'm guessing that it wasn't as profitable as today.

[babybear]

slide onto the highway between smith’s and Rafter J. hit a car but not buried- all ok. yikes

[mall walker]

^ yiiiikes

[GKWood]

I am planning to get out Thursday for sure, maybe the next two days also.


- I am here for the stoke

I am planning to tour during President's day weekend if anyone's interested. Not familiar with the area, but thinking Teton Pass or the park, provided conditions are somewhat safe (big maybe). Next week (Mo-Wed) I'm planning to hit the resort. Would love to share the stoke with some mags, so hit me up if you're down!

[passholer]

slide onto the highway between smith’s and Rafter J. hit a car but not buried- all ok. yikes

ya another slide near tj maxx still wanna ski taco coulior

https://www.jhnewsandguide.com/the_h...37936f251.html

listening to this on the scanner
meadow brook apts parking area is having flooding issues due to the creek being blocked by snow apparently
https://buckrail.com/flooding-at-mea...to-be-cleared/

[peterbmoorman]

Sucks for the local skiers but if that number is correct, I'd love to know the rational behind why it is bad for business. That's all I am getting at. Walk on trams in 95 were great but I'm guessing that it wasn't as profitable as today.

Good point.

Has anybody in this forum seen a P&L statement or balance sheet from JHMR?????

I would like to know the real numbers. Lots of bitching, but few facts.

How much did the new tram cost? New Teton Lift? New Sweetwater etc.... Gotta make money somehow I guess.

My big beef with JHMR is the J1 slave labor crews.... Haven't seen anybody talk about that here.

[AdironRider]

I'm tellin' ya - they're angling to get BOUGHT by Alterra.

No doubt. I don't know if it'll be Alterra, but I think a sale is on the horizon.

No, to use your verbiage, I'm saying that the juice may actually be worth the squeeze. A pile of skiers at +/- $80 with I'm guessing close to zero marketing costs is probably good for business.

Sucks for the local skiers but if that number is correct, I'd love to know the rational behind why it is bad for business. That's all I am getting at. Walk on trams in 95 were great but I'm guessing that it wasn't as profitable as today.

Well thats a bit different that talking about the long term viability of the business. I got more of a they are doing this to 'survive' vibe from your post as a result.

Word on the street is even though skier visits are up revenue in f&b and retail is down. They made the events tent into a brown bag lunch place apparently because people were taking over tables in restaurants so I kinda believe it. Parking has to be way up though, but I think that goes to TVA and isn't associated with the ski corp.

If that is true I could easily see Jackson being like, nah I think we are good with 80% of the visits from a higher paying clientele. Everybody is happier minus the ikons.

I do think Jackson is one of the few places that could think that way and could conceivably tell them to pound sand. Otherwise, I'm sure Boyne and their resorts are like fuck yeah make it rain for example.

[Foggy_Goggles]

We are saying the same thing. Of course part of the business model is the try and maximize per skier daily revenue...but the argument seems to be coming from the 100+ plus "hardcore local".

I feel you pain, I had Berthoud Pass just fold because the owners didn't want to play ski area anymore. I left town. It sucks, but I got a lot more respect for people that recognize that private businesses are gonna do what they do than the entitled complainers. When you live in a ski town, you just cross your fingers and hope it doesn't get all fucked up. Now that it is all fucked up, people are creating all kinds of economic theories about why the ski area that is right for them is the best business model for the ski area.

Again, it sucks. A lot of people are having something that was very important to their whole being taken aware from them. If the IKON is the straw that breaks the camels back, I will buy that. But if you didn't see it coming, that is on you. Specially in Jackson. Chad, Buffy and the trust funder's been there for a couple decades easy. It ain't about us.

It's hard, but try not to let it get you down. You gotta be able to see the rest of your life without quiet days at the Vill.

[Bruce Springskiin]

Anyone going up to Bozeman at the end of Presidents’ Day weekend? Looking for a ride up there to bring a vehicle back to town.
I’ll pay for gas.


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[wstdeep]

The thing is Jackson doesn't have to give the skiing away. They can hold the line on pricing and because the dirt is so good people will still show up. Less people paying more still keeps the ski experience great. Passes sell from the discounted $1300 range to $1800 range if you wait too long. No many areas can still demand this premium. The day ticket at roughly $155 is a bargain compared to the $200 you'll pay at Vile or Aspern for flat shit, 300 inches a year and speed limits. Hold the line on pricing and keep the experience high. If you plan on skiing a ton here just buy the pass or get a part time gig for the freebie. It doesn't take long to get the value out of the pass.

Filling up the Motel 6 in town with your discounted promotion doesn't do much for the resort.

[cdubski]

My big beef with JHMR is the J1 slave labor crews.... Haven't seen anybody talk about that here.

Pretty sure it came up earlier in this thread. (A lot earlier)

[Djongo Unchained]

Lots of bitching, but few facts.

Facts? Facts?!

Hehehe, we don't need no stinking facts!

Did I tell you about the Paraguayan dude on Casper, who couldn't explain to me why I needed to jump off the stopped chair. He got both barrels; he just looks at me now.

[peterbmoorman]

and now this.....https://www.jhnewsandguide.com/news/...b365126b0.html

“I’m grateful for this special place,” Londy said. “But the thing that made Jackson so special to me was that we didn’t have lift lines, and it seems like there’s been a shift in goals in recent years."

Is that new goal to make money??????