18/19 Jackson/Targhee/Tetons Thread- Ski the big red one

[skibrd]

HMS and Cy, thanks for putting everything way better then I ever could. Everyone does their personal economic (living in ID v WY) and risk calculations (what to ski and when) differently. With the valley(s) getting busier, maybe it is time to brainstorm ideas as to how to close Twin Slides and Glory Bowl, or start a discussion with other regions with similar issues as to how they deal with these problems. Maybe that conversation is already happening and I don’t see it.


On the other note, I talked to friends in Steamboat and they are living the same issues with their lift lines that we are, and also attribute it to the Ikon pass. The Ikon Pass is a fundamental change in skiing. I don’t think JH is getting off it any time soon, so I’m interested to see what happens in the next 1, 3, and 5 years. Are we seeing a one year bump in visitors because the Ikon Pass is new, or will it be a consistent up tick.


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[peterbmoorman]

March is getting off to an Ikonic start!




Funny cartoon in today's paper

[Kinnikinnick]

Nice sidecountry runs the pass couple of days

Love the terrain at Jackson

Signed,

Ikoner


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[gtid]

Interesting article on Epic and Icon. Dreading the day that Targhee decides to join one of these passes: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/featu...-best-ski-pass

[Foggy_Goggles]

No, I’m completely aware and every one of those people either is or should be aware of the risks they take by moving to that side of the pass. It’s a two way street.

HMS and Cy, thanks for putting everything way better then I ever could. Everyone does their personal economic (living in ID v WY) and risk calculations (what to ski and when) differently. With the valley(s) getting busier, maybe it is time to brainstorm ideas as to how to close Twin Slides and Glory Bowl, or start a discussion with other regions with similar issues as to how they deal with these problems. Maybe that conversation is already happening and I don’t see it.

Sounds like back stepping to me. I get it. Keeping that Jackson cred is hard work. I don't know how long you've been in Jackson or ski towns generally, but let me share some friendly advice.

If you really love skiing and you want to be around it the rest of your life, be aware of bad ass burn out. I've seen it a ton. The more narrowly defined your definition of good skiing is, the more difficult it is to make your self happy. It was me. If I wasn't going 90mph, pushing my personal limits, I wasn't happy.

When Berthoud Pass closed, everywhere became busier and I wasn't getting my fix, I stepped back from skiing. Over the course of a couple of years I learned to enjoy being outside, hanging with my friends, being surrounded by smiling skiers and other simple pleasures of just doing it. The radness will still come but it ain't the end all be all.

[crashidy]

doesnt rogers pass have certain zones open and certain zones closed depending on avy assessment? the harsh reality of our times, is that too many people are too fucking stupid to make correct decisions or they just dont give a shit how their actions impact others. seems a no brainer to me that closing the paths that spill into the road on any day rated above moderate needs to happen before something bad enough happens to shut down access completely
never been, but is teton pass the only quick n dirty spot to tour from in your zone? gotta say, you guys are doing a great job of keeping traffic down from out of staters cuz it sounds like exactly the kind of place i avoid

It is true they do have an "education and permit system". The big thing is the railway and it seems to ahve the most power in this country. As a matter of fact this permit systems is ok but has also changed the game. It has made it harder to get early starts, a large portion is currently closed do to people not abiding by the rules and permanent closures. If people can't behave and respect closures , they will close it down.
Since it has been brought up several times here are some links to our permit system. Is it the answer for the teton pass? Doubt it. I've spent alot of time skiing both Rogers and Teton. One big thing that I see is the relative easy access in the teton pass 45 minute boot pack? sure boom nice long deep run. Mail creek, easy. Secondly the relative stability that you guys get in the tetons. Overall your pack is often quite stable and you ski things that we could rarely look at skiing here in the rockies. The easy access "Safe" snow pack makes the tetons an easy target for the uniformed. newbies, and experienced. When you get into Rogers you are generally climbing and going up for hours before you get the fun stuff and in much moire complicated terrain. My $0.02
https://www.pc.gc.ca/accessrogerspas...092.1551726223

https://www.pc.gc.ca/accessrogerspas...092.1551726223

[peterbmoorman]

Mrs. Disney has been replaced by a new president of JHMR.

[rideit]

Grand Targhee cashin’ in on the IKON phenomenon:

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?sto...id=37640136750

[MakersTeleMark]

If you really love skiing and you want to be around it the rest of your life, be aware of bad ass burn out. I've seen it a ton. The more narrowly defined your definition of good skiing is, the more difficult it is to make your self happy. It was me. If I wasn't going 90mph, pushing my personal limits, I wasn't happy.

When Berthoud Pass closed, everywhere became busier and I wasn't getting my fix, I stepped back from skiing. Over the course of a couple of years I learned to enjoy being outside, hanging with my friends, being surrounded by smiling skiers and other simple pleasures of just doing it. The radness will still come but it ain't the end all be all.

I can't reiterate how true this is and how close this hits to home.

Signed,
Completely Burned

[snoqpass]

Inbound to Targhee

[MakersTeleMark]

Interesting article on Epic and Icon. Dreading the day that Targhee decides to join one of these passes: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/featu...-best-ski-pass

Excellent article, thanks for sharing.

[japanada]

I can't reiterate how true this is and how close this hits to home.

Signed,
Completely Burned

Solid points!!! There are a few 'locals' that need to read this.

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[skibrd]

Sounds like back stepping to me. I get it. Keeping that Jackson cred is hard work. I don't know how long you've been in Jackson or ski towns generally, but let me share some friendly advice.

If you really love skiing and you want to be around it the rest of your life, be aware of bad ass burn out. I've seen it a ton. The more narrowly defined your definition of good skiing is, the more difficult it is to make your self happy. It was me. If I wasn't going 90mph, pushing my personal limits, I wasn't happy.

When Berthoud Pass closed, everywhere became busier and I wasn't getting my fix, I stepped back from skiing. Over the course of a couple of years I learned to enjoy being outside, hanging with my friends, being surrounded by smiling skiers and other simple pleasures of just doing it. The radness will still come but it ain't the end all be all.

Please don’t take my compliments to HMS and Cy as back stepping. I know both and have tons of respect for both. They presented arguments better then I could of.

Every decision in life is a calculation, where you live, what you do for work, how you decide to spend your free time. If someone makes the decision to work in Jackson and live in Teton Valley, and they don’t take into consideration the cost, time and other issues with commuting over the pass, that’s their fault. People making questionable decisions involving skiing the pass, and you possibly not being able to get to work is part of the risks one must take into the calculation when moving to Teton Valley. For me, with work being not in ID or WY, how I value my time off of work, the cost of driving over the pass (gas, tires, car operating expenses), renting in Teton Valley doesn’t work out, unless I can find a room for $300/month plus utilities. I am starting to look at buying a house and the calculations are totally different. I am looking at what’s available in Driggs and Vitor.

I’ve been a ski bum my whole life, just got stuck in NYC for a decade trying to finish college. When I moved out west, it was just about skiing, and after a bit, that didn’t fulfill me how I thought it would. Skiing is about balance, balancing solo shred days, balancing days flying around with friends laughing like kids, balancing days exploring new areas, balancing when to push myself inbounds and out of bounds. One of my best days this year was last week cruising blue groomers off Steamboat’s Sunrise chair with my aunt and cousin, and I’ve skied a ton of pow. Thanks for the advice, anti-burn out for me.


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[babybear]

always having fun, even on the traverses

[Djongo Unchained]

Inbound to Targhee

Will you be coming over the hill? Would like to pay you back for welcoming us to your place. I gots beers, smokajawea and 1/2 off village vouchers if that'd help.






I am not completely burned, but no doubt, there's a flicker some days. 80 days on the clock today.

Luckily, I still have a lot of fun. Today was the first drop off of people that I've noticed in 2 months. Coulda just been the cold.

Letting them go unimpeded on Rtrail and Werner/Moran before anyone gets in front of you. Man we gotta get the speed gun out. Deep breaths and relaxing at 40-50.
LPRs tomorrow in a mach schnell warmup for Brock Landers arrival. Looks like precip weds., On the warm side, so be ready for a stormy first day, BL. Lemme know if ya need some wax.

BBI19UT soon.

[cdubski]

Report of avy death at breccia.

[m468ce]

Was at the old pass road gap jump last Thursday the 28th. Had friends say they heard a bear roaring, minutes later I heard it too. Definitely wasn't a dog or wolf. Seemed about 500 meters away.

Has anyone else heard or seen one out there?

[Foggy_Goggles]

possibly not being able to get to work is part of the risks one must take into the calculation when moving to Teton Valley

True. As mentioned previously, keeping the road open is a higher priority that skiing Twin or Glory. You seem to disagree and also called snow science black magic.

I have a good friend that is a teacher in Wilson and another that is an ER nurse at St. Johns. One lives in Victor, the other Driggs. It is about a whole lot more that just getting to and from work, ya know kids and hospitals. The viability of your whole community relies to a certain extent on the pass being open. But maybe that gets to a bit of the divide you got going. Stop in the Valley Market and you'll here all about it.

[skibrd]

True. As mentioned previously, keeping the road open is a higher priority that skiing Twin or Glory. You seem to disagree and also called snow science black magic.

I have a good friend that is a teacher in Wilson and another that is an ER nurse at St. Johns. One lives in Victor, the other Driggs. It is about a whole lot more that just getting to and from work, ya know kids and hospitals. The viability of your whole community relies to a certain extent on the pass being open. But maybe that gets to a bit of the divide you got going. Stop in the Valley Market and you'll here all about it.

I don’t disagree that getting to work and keeping both communities running is a higher priority then pow turns. And people who have to ski should be smarter about where they are skiing, but people are going to do dumb shit. What gets me to roll my eyes is when pass commuters are up in arms and going nuts when someone remotely triggers a slide and it runs down to the road. That’s part of living over there. Getting upset and angry about the pass being closed due to a slide isn’t going to change anything. Starting a constructive discussion, helping grow the knowledge in the community about backcountry skiing (for skiers and non skiers) that will bring change.

Snow pack science is the vaguest science there is and anyone who tells you they are an expert, have a feel for the snow pack, or any other similar saying, is an idiot. You, me, any of us can study a snowpack from day one it falls, know exactly what layers, crystals, crusts are in there and we will not be able to say what it will do. Anyone who claims to be able to say or know what a snow pack will do, is a deadman. Snow science is voodoo, you do what you can to understand it, not you don’t know for certain.


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[snoqpass]

Will you be coming over the hill? Would like to pay you back for welcoming us to your place. I gots beers, smokajawea and 1/2 off village vouchers if that'd help.






I am not completely burned, but no doubt, there's a flicker some days. 80 days on the clock today.

Luckily, I still have a lot of fun. Today was the first drop off of people that I've noticed in 2 months. Coulda just been the cold.

Letting them go unimpeded on Rtrail and Werner/Moran before anyone gets in front of you. Man we gotta get the speed gun out. Deep breaths and relaxing at 40-50.
LPRs tomorrow in a mach schnell warmup for Brock Landers arrival. Looks like precip weds., On the warm side, so be ready for a stormy first day, BL. Lemme know if ya need some wax.

BBI19UT soon.

I’m here now staying on the hill got a bunch of dog training to do

[cydwhit]

Little ski stoke?

Went out in the park with a good group Sunday, initially planning to walk to the top of Son of Apocolypse and maybe ski it depending on stability. Got there and the plow was still working and the road to Death Canyon was still closed. Bailed for plan B, went over to Turkey Chute, expecting it to be scraped to crap. Looks like one group of two snowboarders beat us to it, great snow in the chute, and a nice out track put in. Fun little ski, nice stable snow. Park stoke!

[Djongo Unchained]

Little ski stoke?

That's big stoke C., Nice!

You have the best shots in the tetons thread so far this season mag, rad...

[Norseman]

Man... thanks for the relief from the pass circus discussion. I'd prolly tour in the park every damn day if I lived there. Thanks for the pic. I miss that place sometimes.

[babybear]

Was at the old pass road gap jump last Thursday the 28th. Had friends say they heard a bear roaring, minutes later I heard it too. Definitely wasn't a dog or wolf. Seemed about 500 meters away.

Has anyone else heard or seen one out there?

probably a mountain lion.
the bears are still hibernating

Man... thanks for the relief from the pass circus discussion.

that’s also why i posted the baton twirling

[AdironRider]

I don’t disagree that getting to work and keeping both communities running is a higher priority then pow turns. And people who have to ski should be smarter about where they are skiing, but people are going to do dumb shit. What gets me to roll my eyes is when pass commuters are up in arms and going nuts when someone remotely triggers a slide and it runs down to the road. That’s part of living over there. Getting upset and angry about the pass being closed due to a slide isn’t going to change anything. Starting a constructive discussion, helping grow the knowledge in the community about backcountry skiing (for skiers and non skiers) that will bring change.

Snow pack science is the vaguest science there is and anyone who tells you they are an expert, have a feel for the snow pack, or any other similar saying, is an idiot. You, me, any of us can study a snowpack from day one it falls, know exactly what layers, crystals, crusts are in there and we will not be able to say what it will do. Anyone who claims to be able to say or know what a snow pack will do, is a deadman. Snow science is voodoo, you do what you can to understand it, not you don’t know for certain.


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This is fucking horseshit. We all know slides can happen naturally and understand when they do, despite some grumbling.

What is unnecessary is jabronis like you saying we all just need to deal when a skier causes one of these (on a high avi day when they had been shouting from rooftops not to be there for almost a week) because they decided to be selfish. Then that unnecessary closure gets extended because there are 20+ other cars that need to be accounted for because they just couldn't think about anything else but their pow turns. Last Friday's closure should have been a couple hours max, instead it was an entire day. This has real effects, just not for you apparently. This one closure took a couple hundred grand out of our community's pocket that never should have happened. Empathy man, you clearly don't have any.

Avi science isn't perfect but it isn't throwing spaghetti on the wall either. This is a scary example of the junk show that the pass currently is. I like pow turns as much as anybody but if this is the mindset, the north side needs to be closed. You and others like you are the reason why.

Apologies to others for bringing it back up but this idiocy needs to be called out repeatedly or things are only going to get worse.