Best construction for Praxis protest 4 japan ?

**Evil E** · 11-20-2018, 11:05 AM

I’ve skied plenty of fully rockered and reverse skis, but never skied or owned a protest. What construction do I want that will be Light enough to tour well but stiff enough to rip japan ? Thinking of pairing with a Salomon shift

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**whyturn** · 11-20-2018, 11:10 AM

Hmm. I had carbon 3 in 187 and was light and did not get bounced much at alta. My new is not skied yet but is MaP 3 192 and still pretty light with nice flex

**eskido** · 11-20-2018, 11:23 AM

Yeah, I think if Keith would build you up a MAP core with some carbon and a veneer top you’d come in pretty light for a ski that big. Personally I don’t really jive with the UL core if it’s not intended to be a dedicated touring ski (shifts say not so much). Also, I wouldn’t pair down the flex to shave weight just get whatever flex you think you’d prefer. Flex 4 is $$$ for me in the Protest.

**2FUNKY** · 11-20-2018, 11:30 AM

187 Enduro Carbon Veneer 4flex.

**Muggydude** · 11-20-2018, 11:32 AM

What Funky said. If you’re under 180 lbs consider going 3 or 3+ flex

**Evil E** · 11-20-2018, 11:43 AM

Originally Posted by 2FUNKY

187 Enduro Carbon Veneer 4flex.

thanks funky. can you elaborate on why this combo is the answer? Just curious as to why you chose this. I will probably pull the trigger here today or tomorrow, stoked to get on the protest train.

**doebedoe** · 11-20-2018, 11:52 AM

I'm 175 and think 3 flex is plenty for most skiing. If I were heavier I'd go 4.

Carbon == Adds a touch of stiffness, some spring-y-ness, reduces weight.
Veneer == Adds a touch of dampening, reduces weight.

Probably save upwards of 1# / pair on a ski as large as the protest.

Both reduce weight a bit without going all the way down the the UL core which is noticeably less damp.

Protest + Shifts == perfect japan ski. Maybe a Wootest if you were skinning a lot.

**2FUNKY** · 11-20-2018, 11:56 AM

Originally Posted by Evil E

thanks funky. can you elaborate on why this combo is the answer? Just curious as to why you chose this. I will probably pull the trigger here today or tomorrow, stoked to get on the protest train.

Originally Posted by doebedoe

I'm 175 and think 3 flex is plenty for most skiing. If I were heavier I'd go 4.

Carbon == Adds a touch of stiffness, some spring-y-ness, reduces weight.
Veneer == Adds a touch of dampening, reduces weight.

Probably save upwards of 1# / pair on a ski as large as the protest.

Both reduce weight a bit without going all the way down the the UL core which is noticeably less damp.

Protest + Shifts == perfect japan ski. Maybe a Wootest if you were skinning a lot.

Doebedoe answered your question. I personally don’t own that layup but do own the 188 which is a 3 flex and a 192 enduro veneer 4 flex.

**doebedoe** · 11-20-2018, 11:59 AM

To be fair -- I don't own that layup either. I have a flex 3, MAP protest, a flex 3.5 carbon freeride, and a flex 3 UL yeti.

**kid-kapow** · 11-20-2018, 12:49 PM

why not just buy these and then get custom ones at a later date when you know a bit more about what you want?

https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...Atomic-Salomon

**nickel** · 11-20-2018, 10:39 PM

i got mine in the UL. haven't skied them yet. I'm hoping the lack of dampness is trivial in the setting protests are intended for. Can't wait to be able to report back. flex 4+ 192 UL veneer.

I agree with those saying not to compromise on flex.

**skibrd** · 11-21-2018, 02:38 AM

I had a pair of stock Protests and sold them for a pair of 4 flex, enduro w/carbon, veneer topsheets. They are going to be my go to pow skis for a long time. That’s what I’d recommend.

For reference both Protests were 196s and I’m 6-4, 210lbs with gear on.

**Evil E** · 11-21-2018, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by kid-kapow

why not just buy these and then get custom ones at a later date when you know a bit more about what you want?

https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...Atomic-Salomon

I just might. Do you think those would be too heavy to tour japan on ?

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**nickel** · 11-21-2018, 01:51 PM

I think you're planning on powder touring on a 128mm ski. You need to make your peace with that regardless of chosen construction. There's a reason so many are dismissive of it, because it sits as a bit of an outlier in most people's "compromise" window for weight vs. fun. You'll be fine if you go into it eyes wide open. Or you won't.

I know have a different mentality to people touring pow on shity skis that are no fun but everyone's free to make their own decision for their own reasons.

**ctsmith** · 11-21-2018, 02:14 PM

Not sure I would use light and Protest in the same sentence. All depends on how fast / far you want to go and who else is in your group. I’ve toured there on on older 188 carbon/ stiffs, super fun in the down, fine on the up except for steeper wind blown stuff like the top of Yotei. I’ve also toured there on BC’s and even 106 skied fine. Personally next time I’d go for something around 110 or so, 1500-1700 grams.

**2FUNKY** · 11-21-2018, 02:21 PM

Or just do more leg extensions.

**Evil E** · 11-21-2018, 03:15 PM

Originally Posted by nickel

I think you're planning on powder touring on a 128mm ski. You need to make your peace with that regardless of chosen construction. There's a reason so many are dismissive of it, because it sits as a bit of an outlier in most people's "compromise" window for weight vs. fun. You'll be fine if you go into it eyes wide open. Or you won't.

I know have a different mentality to people touring pow on shity skis that are no fun but everyone's free to make their own decision for their own reasons.

I’ve never skied them but they seem like a sweet choice for japan. I’m of the same mindset. I’m skiing because I enjoy going down the mountain far more than the up.
Still on the fence since I have some light fat skis but I might scoop up those advertised protests regardless

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**kid-kapow** · 11-21-2018, 04:19 PM

ain't nothing to it but to do it!

They will not be light, but try em, shift them again if not to your liking.

**eskido** · 11-21-2018, 04:59 PM

Originally Posted by Evil E

I’ve never skied them but they seem like a sweet choice for japan. I’m of the same mindset. I’m skiing because I enjoy going down the mountain far more than the up.
Still on the fence since I have some light fat skis but I might scoop up those advertised protests regardless

Looks like super sweet pair! Veneer, and I’m assuming the MAP core from last yr as opposed to the heavier MAA core there using now will keep them playful and a bit “lighter”. That’s honestly how I’d build a second pair if I ever needed one, MAP core kicked ass for pow skis. You should get off that fence in a hurry

**jorion** · 11-21-2018, 05:52 PM

I think there are too many variables to answer the weight for touring question for somebody else. You have to figure it out. I’m pretty fit but live at sea level. With 9 lb skis mounted with tectons I’m fine to do 4000’-5000’ of vert. Broke trail with 10lb l138s and ions though for 2500’ and was too tired to do another lap after. That lap was the best of the winter though. If I lived in Tahoe I would’ve been in shape enough to not care. So...variables.

**skibrd** · 11-21-2018, 06:28 PM

Originally Posted by jorion

I think there are too many variables to answer the weight for touring question for somebody else. You have to figure it out. I’m pretty fit but live at sea level. With 9 lb skis mounted with tectons I’m fine to do 4000’-5000’ of vert. Broke trail with 10lb l138s and ions though for 2500’ and was too tired to do another lap after. That lap was the best of the winter though. If I lived in Tahoe I would’ve been in shape enough to not care. So...variables.

Eliminate variable #1 - move to Tahoe

**Reformed** · 11-21-2018, 07:20 PM

I skied stock 187 (3 flex?) Protests and Tectons in Japan last year. There's a reason this ski comes up in every "which ski for Japow?" thread on here. It rips pow of all varieties extremely well. It is also completely passable on firm and deals with wind funk as well as anything. We toured most of the time we were there. Weight was never really a concern, as lots of the climbs there aren't that big. Yotei was the exception, and wasn't bad at all. If I was going to build a new Protest it'd probably just be a stock MAA core 192, but I'd talk to Keith to see how that core would compare to the one from a few years ago before pulling the trigger. I'm 6' and weigh 180 or so before gear FWIW.

**kid-kapow** · 11-24-2018, 01:51 AM

Betel is also seemingly selling some brand new Protests, could be worth considering if you did not already pul the trigger

**Banh Mi** · 11-24-2018, 09:28 AM

Yup, buy mine! A little pricey, but Bubinga Waterfall Veneer!

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**2wheeler** · 11-26-2018, 11:08 PM

Originally Posted by Evil E

I’ve never skied them but they seem like a sweet choice for japan. I’m of the same mindset. I’m skiing because I enjoy going down the mountain far more than the up.
Still on the fence since I have some light fat skis but I might scoop up those advertised protests regardless

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The Protests is my dedicated touring ski at home and in Japan. My latest iteration is the MAP with carbon and wood veneer. Just over 2 kg per ski. With a light binding and lightish boots it's not hard to keep up with everyone else. Of course it really depends on your fitness.

Something that has helped me is getting full mohair skins, saves my hip flexors some grief. To me this has helped more than dropping a couple hundred grams on the skis.