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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
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    NH
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    473

    G3 Zed Heel Turret Failure

    Yesterday, I broke both heel turrets on the same turn at moderate speed. If you believe my Suunto watch, I was going 14.5 MPH. Not exactly charging. I did hop maybe half a foot to clear a small water bar. I bet it was less than that as my vertical is terribly low. No rebounding title for me this season.

    The accident/breakage occurred 4 minutes and 36 seconds into the bindings’ first descent ever. Brand new.Click image for larger version. 

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    I’d skinned 2 miles and 1,900’ without incident before starting the downhill.
    Mounted at a good shop. Inspected by the head tech at another shop. That seems legit. No?
    I followed the transition from tour to ski mode instructions from G3 so I can’t see the user error there. Am I missing something?

    Edit: 200 lbs, 6'5".

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    the heart of Pennsyltucky
    Posts
    3,848
    ohshit

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2009
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    pdx
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    10,088
    That’s sucky for sure

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    north aspect
    Posts
    39,944
    good pics
    bF
    Alpental Indigenous

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    8,431
    fuck
    .....I hope you know that this will go down on your permanent record

    http://procatinator.com/?cat=80

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Gaperville, CO
    Posts
    3,081
    Rutro.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    NH
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    473
    Quote Originally Posted by acinpdx View Post
    That’s sucky for sure
    Beautiful day for a walk down a mountain with skis strapped to your pack.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
    Posts
    16,308
    well look at the bright side ... the screws didnt break so the top didnt peel off like expected it to

    that post for the heel piece looks to be composite, I could geek out on it with picts from wildsnow but i have to go skiing in 2 minutes
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    45
    ouch

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    541
    Well this is concerning. Still haven’t mounted my pair (suspect this is the case for many people) so they’re returnable.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    8,431
    I'm really interested to hear what G3 has to say about this today.
    .....I hope you know that this will go down on your permanent record

    http://procatinator.com/?cat=80

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Monument
    Posts
    28
    Yeesh what a failure. With both failing in the same fashion at the same time I'm wondering if they had a manufacturing issue. Curious to hear what they say.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using TGR Forums mobile app

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Simi Valley, CA
    Posts
    4,764
    Probably a bad batch of plastic, the heel housing wouldn't have passed finite element analysis if the design was at fault.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Methow Valley
    Posts
    666
    That sucks. I'd imagine G3 isn't going to be too happy about this. Just to ask the bindings were adjust properly for length? IE you didn't have any problem clicking into them at the top of the run? It seems like the "forward pressure" system should prevent that much force on the base of the tower.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Simi Valley, CA
    Posts
    4,764
    Quote Originally Posted by John_B View Post
    That sucks. I'd imagine G3 isn't going to be too happy about this. Just to ask the bindings were adjust properly for length? IE you didn't have any problem clicking into them at the top of the run? It seems like the "forward pressure" system should prevent that much force on the base of the tower.
    Great point, that's probably it. Skis flexed deeply, heel post hit the end of it's travel, and boot kept pushing the heel housing backwards until the front of the housing snapped off.

    Assume proper Zed adjustment is boot about to touch binding heel, but no preload? If someone preloaded it like an alpine binding, it would reduce available heel travel.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    NH
    Posts
    473
    Quote Originally Posted by 1000-oaks View Post
    Probably a bad batch of plastic, the heel housing wouldn't have passed finite element analysis if the design was at fault.

    Only one other thing comes to mind...the break is in a very unexpected location. Any chance you somehow released at the toes first, and fell backwards? The boot heel insert could theoretically put a lot of leverage on weighted heel pins as the boot toe rotates upward, and peel off the front of the housing in the manner shown. Never heard of this happening, but it would explain the location of the fractures.
    Hmmm. How do I discern if the replacements are made from a good patch of plastic?
    I fell/landed towards my left shoulder, so it doesn't seem like that scenario happened. Thanks for taking a look.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    PNW
    Posts
    4,484
    FWD pressure is my first thought, too. If the heels were adjusted too close to the boot, perhaps the skis flexing popped the heels. But he stepped into them...

    OP... can you verify proper heel spacing? What skis are these on?

    Edit... too slow, sorry for repeating ideas, carry on
    PE, Mechanical Engineering

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    NH
    Posts
    473
    Quote Originally Posted by John_B View Post
    That sucks. I'd imagine G3 isn't going to be too happy about this. Just to ask the bindings were adjust properly for length? IE you didn't have any problem clicking into them at the top of the run? It seems like the "forward pressure" system should prevent that much force on the base of the tower.
    No problems clicking in. I carpet tested them the night before and the boots clicked in and out without hindrance.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    NH
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    473
    Quote Originally Posted by 1000-oaks View Post
    Great point, that's probably it. Skis flexed deeply, heel post hit the end of it's travel, and boot kept pushing the heel housing backwards until the front of the housing snapped off.
    I think I understand this, but am confused as I didn't drop into the depression and landed pretty squarely on my feet. Does that change your opinion?

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    NH
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    473
    Quote Originally Posted by Norseman View Post
    FWD pressure is my first thought, too. If the heels were adjusted too close to the boot, perhaps the skis flexing popped the heels. But he stepped into them...

    OP... can you verify proper heel spacing? What skis are these on?
    Aren't the Zeds gapless? From Skimoco: The ZED is the first “gapless” binding in its weight class with adjustable vertical and lateral release. No heel-gap means the release stays consistent throughout the ski flex while offering additional energy and rebound to your skis. In other words, the designers wanted it light without sacrificing safety or ski-performance.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    PNW
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    You're right, gapless. Well... now gapped a little much.

    How does the heel travel rearward in normal use? How far can it slide? What feature stops it?

    Mount was too short, perhaps?
    PE, Mechanical Engineering

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    NH
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    473
    Quote Originally Posted by Norseman View Post
    You're right, gapless. Well... now gapped a little much.

    How does the heel travel rearward in normal use? How far can it slide? What feature stops it?

    Mount was too short, perhaps?
    The shop and G3 will likely sort out the answers to those questions?
    Just went through the din guide from G3 and it seems that was set as it should have been.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Gaperville, CO
    Posts
    3,081
    The idea that if the heel runs out of travel it catastrophically fails like this is pretty discomforting. I can't imagine that is a reasonable failure mode since we would've seen a lot of this in Ions by now.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    1,076
    Quote Originally Posted by 1000-oaks View Post
    Great point, that's probably it. Skis flexed deeply, heel post hit the end of it's travel, and boot kept pushing the heel housing backwards until the front of the housing snapped off.

    Assume proper Zed adjustment is boot about to touch binding heel, but no preload? If someone preloaded it like an alpine binding, it would reduce available heel travel.
    Curious about the spring loaded travel of the heel piece on baseplate. No clue about how to mount/set up heel properly but would these markings on the heel base plate indicate max/min settings and probably 'optimal' on the middle white notch where the actual heel piece arrow is aligned with?

    Hafjell; if you push the remaining turret pieces back to test the travel, is there any weird friction or binding that might have prevented smooth rearward travel that might have contributed to some weird stress loading scenario?

    Click image for larger version. 

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    What if the hokey pokey really is what it's all about?

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Lake Wallenpaupack, PA
    Posts
    399

    G3 Zed Heel Turret Failure

    Thank you for posting. I know we were all very interested about it last night.

    Again, at least you were not injured. I am sure this will all be taken care of by you shop. I personally would ask for store credit and go with a different company/set up. Lots of good choices, with a double failure like that....go in a different direction.

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