ON3P Billy Goat Vs. Other Powder Skis

[kwilder]

Looking at getting new powder skis. I've had a pair of K2 Annex 118 Seth Morrison for 5 or 6 years, and I've liked them, but now they are just getting old and beat, and it might be time to replace them.

I like the idea of owning ON3P skis, and everyone loves the Billy Goat, but they are narrower throughout the entire length of the ski than my K2's, especially in the tip and tail. It's not a whole lot of difference, but it has me wondering if the flotation is going to be equal to or worse than the K2's. Does anyone have experience on both of these 2 skis? I second guess these decisions because it is a lot of money to spend to possibly be disappointed.

On non powder days, I ski Line Supernatural 108, which are really not that much narrower than the Annex 118, but they don't ski nearly as well in deep snow. The tips dive in, making it way more difficult to lean into turns aggressively, and it takes a considerable amount more effort to make the ski turn in powder. I think this is all about rocker profile (The K2 has alot more rocker than the Line).

I'm Looking for comparison between the BG and the K2 Annex 118 (or what ever they are calling it now, Pinnacle 118?). Would I have to go to the ON3P Cease and Desist to get the same level of flotation as my k2's? (Wider under foot but slightly narrower tip and tail) There's not a whole lot of information or reviews on the Cease and Desist online, but some people have said that it is unstable at speed and a lot to handle in tight spaces.

[wwwllw]

The shape of the BG allows it to ski like a fatter ski. That same shape that allows the looseness and surliness in powder while being skinnier doesn't lend it to performing as well in firm conditions such as similar sized, but more traditianally shaped skis, such as a bibby pro.

[XavierD]

The Billy Goat floats much better than the K2 118. While yes the overall dimensions are narrower the BG shape builds a lot more volume of ski in front of your foot. As mentioned it doesn’t do as well on firm snow, but it’s still fine.

[Rideski]

Buy used, build a quiver.

[whyturn]

Do it! I got 186 skied it for a while and then got 189. It floats like a boat. They do Ski bigger Than their size and are very quick in the trees.

[auvgeek]

Who says the C&D is unstable at speed and also hard to handle in tight trees? Genuinely curious.

If you want something more similar to your K2s, maybe try the Kartel 116.

[SupreChicken]

Until the pow is chest deep, the Billy goat does not have issues with float.

[kwilder]

Soul7 the pinnacle

I had soul 7s before and I thought they were way too soft to be any good. The annex isn't exactly stiff, but it is alot more substantial than a soul7.

Who says the C&D is unstable at speed and also hard to handle in tight trees? Genuinely curious.

If you want something more similar to your K2s, maybe try the Kartel 116.

There's an older review on blister reviews that describes them this way, as well as an old thread here. These are both 5+ years old, so I know the design of the ski may have changed. I guess what makes the Kartel 116 different than the Billy goat? I'm not looking for a 1 ski quiver. I use my Line's for days that aren't fresh

[waxoff]

I'm not voting against the BG, but in the ON3P lineup I wonder if the Wren 114 are closer to your Annexes than BG, save for the slightly less sidecut in both of them. The BG pintails need to be considered, being a clear difference from the Seth's, which the Wrens don't have. Other skis to replace the K2's might be Moment Governor, or maybe even closer, Praxis GPO. My own pick in that class landed on a pair of +10mm Praxis BC, which by looking at the numbers come pretty close. Happy hunting!

[TAFKALVS]

goats float like a boat

[auvgeek]

I guess what makes the Kartel 116 different than the Billy goat?

Totally different shape and mount point.

Re C&D -- completely different ski than what was reviewed in the past.

[jorion]

It has to be more than 2’ of fresh before I start mildly wishing I had more float than a billy goat. I suppose I could get a cease and desist for those several hours of the season but it’s not worth it to me.

[carlh]

Supergoats are 118 underfoot and 193. I can't imagine needing more float anywhere that has lifts.

[nickwm21]

I’ll make it easy for you.

If you want a ski solely for powder days get a Protest or C&D.

If you want a ski for powder days plus a day or two after, get a Billy goat, GPO, Quixote, or Wildcat (Bibby)

Just buy whichever ski you can get a good deal on in your size.


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[SupreChicken]

I’ll make it easy for you.

If you want a ski solely for powder days get a Protest or C&D.

If you want a ski for powder days plus a day or two after, get a Billy goat, GPO, Quixote, or Wildcat (Bibby)

Just buy whichever ski you can get a good deal on in your size.


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I mean...this could go in a signature. This is the advice you need.

[galibier_numero_un]

I mean...this could go in a signature. This is the advice you need.

What he said.

... Thom

[goosedown]

The billy goat is my favourite ski so i’m biased. Read on at your own risk.

if you ski a lot ON3P build quality and durability should be a factor. Calling the BG a powder ski is selling it short as it really shines in soft variable.

Note that the BG skis better then faster it’s going. if you’re looking for something a little more leisurely Kartel 116s might be the ticket.

I’m a small guy on 179s. I’ve never felt like i needed more ski or more float.

[jackattack]

We really needed another Billy Goat thread?!

[whyturn]

We really needed another Billy Goat thread?!

No, but do I really need 15 pairs of Powder skis?

[auvgeek]

No, but do I really need 15 pairs of Powder skis?

Also no.

[::: :::]

bg thread burnout is a thing

“Praxis Rx”

[undertow2]

No, but do I really need 15 pairs of Powder skis?

I thought you did....?

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[whyturn]

I thought you did....?

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Well the protest 192 was a need for sure.

[rob stokes]

Just to be devils advocate....I didn’t think the BG’s floated very well. I am 190lbs, and skied the 184’s which may be too small I guess. Other pow skis I love are the 184 Katana and 190 lotus 120 so I think it’s more of a mount point thing than a length.

Build quality was awesome on the On3p’s, they are heavy, damp and stable in soft chop. Really liked them in shallow chop, slush and crud....just not the deep. Couldn’t get the tips to float in deep wet pow at all.

I am of a very top heavy physique and drive the tips old school, so didn’t like Hoji’s either, maybe if you like more cantered mounts you will like the BG more.

Just wanted to post an alternate view.


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[Norseman]

Just to be devils advocate....I didn’t think the BG’s floated very well. I am 190lbs, and skied the 184’s which may be too small I guess.

Absolutely too small for you. And they don't respond well to driving hard forward... neutral and balanced is their jam, as you noted.

Sorry, but I gotta rebut your review. Good to confirm these points tho.

Your claim on the weight sounds like bullshit... stated weight is accurate. Bamboo is heavy, no doubt... but they aren't misleading anyone.