Low BB, soft rear shock

**Cocximus** · 10-23-2018, 03:31 PM

My rear shock is a RP23. Well maintained but it's pretty established the RP23s was always a trade-off between support and bump compliance. I ride on lots of roots, they are on the up, down, turns, everywhere. To get the rear end to feel secure I am at around 50% sag, probably more when I am actually pedaling. When it's cold I guess it drops even more. I want to be able to pedal more without pedal strikes. Should I just get a McLeod? Seems like a great shock, and hopefully it will ride well over roots and bumps with less sag.

Should I look in to sorter cranks? Dunno if going shorter than 175 would much.

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**grinch** · 10-23-2018, 03:38 PM

50% is a lot. You might want to pick up a cheap coil shock and set the spring for your bikes recommended sag. Coil is great for seated climbing thru roots and rocks . I don’t really like longer cranks than 170. Different strokes for dif folks though. I see Sam Hill is on 165’s for his enduro bike

**toast2266** · 10-23-2018, 04:13 PM

This is like that mtbr thread where the guy was surprised he flatted his ardent race when he was running 18 psi.

50% is way too much sag. Depending on your bike, that's like twice as much as what you should be running. If that's what it takes to get the rear end to feel decent, then your shock is shit, your frame is shit, or both.

**simple** · 10-23-2018, 04:17 PM

Something tells me that a coil isn't going to be available to replace this RP23....

OP can you be more specific on your bike? The DPS EVOL is a nice upgrade but don't know what size you need.

Hopefully we just recommend a whole new bike. The industry needs your blood money...and bikes kick ass these days...

**Cocximus** · 10-23-2018, 04:20 PM

I am 50% sag in my riding position. Yea... that low. I get the pedal strikes when I pedal standing. When I sit I can avoid just avoid them.

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**skaredshtles** · 10-23-2018, 04:21 PM

toast is right.

**Dantheman** · 10-23-2018, 04:23 PM

Originally Posted by skaredshtles

toast is right.

Yup.

**grinch** · 10-23-2018, 04:24 PM

Originally Posted by simple

Something tells me that a coil isn't going to be available to replace this RP23....

OP can you be more specific on your bike? The DPS EVOL is a nice upgrade but don't know what size you need.

Hopefully we just recommend a whole new bike. The industry needs your blood money...and bikes kick ass these days...

Possibly. I went from 8.5x2.5 rp23 to a debonair to finally a cc db coil w cs. If he’s not bottoming out on anything and everything at 50% sag ,and his e2e is long enough, it sounds like a coil would be a good option. Ya, depends on the bike though ,or in particular e 2 e

**stuckathuntermtn** · 10-23-2018, 04:28 PM

It sounds like something isn't tuned right.

**Cocximus** · 10-23-2018, 04:33 PM

That's where it feels great on those trails. I run 25% ish where the trails have bigger features. Bike is orbea occam carbon. 26, straight steerer... love it. I know I need the volume spacers, but they are hard to come by. That's why I figured I might as well get a new shock.

Shock is 200 eye to eye. I need to double check the rest.

Only improvement on tune is for me to gain 20 lbs.

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**skaredshtles** · 10-23-2018, 04:38 PM

Originally Posted by daught

That's where it feels great on those trails. I run 25% ish where the trails have bigger features. Bike is orbea occam carbon. 26, straight steerer... love it. I know I need the volume spacers, but they are hard to come by. That's why I figured I might as well get a new shock.

Shock is 200 eye to eye.

Only improvement on tune is for me to gain 20 lbs.

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200 i2i - that's a pretty common size. Get a new shock. Not sure what the leverage curve is like, but you can get a coil shock in that i2i length (depending on the stroke).

**Cocximus** · 10-23-2018, 04:41 PM

I have a coil shock around. I never considered a coil shock on a carbon frame. Don't they melt?

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**skaredshtles** · 10-23-2018, 04:41 PM

Originally Posted by daught

I have a coil shock around. I never considered a coil shock on a carbon frame. Don't they melt?

Probably.

**grinch** · 10-23-2018, 04:55 PM

Originally Posted by daught

That's where it feels great on those trails. I run 25% ish where the trails have bigger features. Bike is orbea occam carbon. 26, straight steerer... love it. I know I need the volume spacers, but they are hard to come by. That's why I figured I might as well get a new shock.

Shock is 200 eye to eye. I need to double check the rest.

Only improvement on tune is for me to gain 20 lbs.

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Ok that helps you probably want to stay w an air shock , just something more current. You could add a vorsprung corset, rebuild your 23 with volume spacers but at that cost you could find something current that would do everything those mods will do and more. Look for a barely used or new take off from pinkbike buy n sell . Rs, fox or dvo will add a lot if you already like the bike. It’s still a decent bike, especially w a 140 fork

**toast2266** · 10-23-2018, 04:55 PM

A quick glance at the kinematics on the older occams shows a pretty goofy leverage ratio. Massively regressive for the first half of the travel followed by fairly progressive for the second half.

(Link to leverage ratio. I take everything on that guy's blog with a grain of salt, but it's probably roughly accurate.) http://linkagedesign.blogspot.com/20...-2012.html?m=1

Which would 1) explain why you find that the bike works best at 50% sag - that's the inflection point from regressive to progressive. And 2) answers my previous statement: the bike is shit. The shock is probably fine. Also, 3) given that the overall leverage ratio is slightly regressive, I think a coil shock is not the answer. It might make things worse. Same goes for any of the newer, higher volume air shocks.

Which leads me to 4: get a different bike.

**skaredshtles** · 10-23-2018, 05:07 PM

Originally Posted by toast2266

<snip>
Which leads me to 4: get a different bike.

But I love it.

Straight steerer makes me think it's probably a pre-2011 model, perhaps? Looks like the 2009 had a less weird leverage curve.

I just looked - that 2009 Occam basically looks like an old Santa Cruz Superlight... or maybe a Heckler?

**Cocximus** · 10-23-2018, 05:09 PM

That's totally different from my setup. It's the 2012. Mine is a single pivot. I really don't intend to replace the bike, but I don't mind spending some $ for a shock.

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**simple** · 10-23-2018, 05:11 PM

I figured it was single pivot. It is like trying to make the old SC Superlight ride well. It just doesn't happen, and you have to run stupid high pressure to not bounce up and down.

**skaredshtles** · 10-23-2018, 05:14 PM

Originally Posted by daught

That's totally different from my setup. It's the 2012. Mine is a single pivot. I really don't intend to replace the bike, but I don't mind spending some $ for a shock.

As toast has mentioned... you're probably not going to fix it. Just live with it, since you don't plan to replace it.

SIUP.

**grinch** · 10-23-2018, 05:20 PM

Hmm I found an abp bike with 190mm shock and no stroke listed. I was guessing 50. Even 2012 is showing an abp and not a single pivot bike.
If it’s like skittles says, a 2009, it’s pretty much a new sport on bikes the last few years. You may want to move into something 2015/16ish

**Cocximus** · 10-23-2018, 05:26 PM

It's 2011. Thought I mentioned it.

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**grinch** · 10-23-2018, 05:32 PM

That’s ok. After we solve this riddle, we’ll breakdown all current orbea models , complete with a bunch of useless info. Got yo pen handy?

**radam** · 10-23-2018, 06:01 PM

I have a Monarch RT Debonair, 200x51, LL tune that I was getting ready to sell. PM me if you're interested

**Cocximus** · 10-23-2018, 06:44 PM

Well thanks for the input. Looks like I'm just going to stick with it as it is. At best I'll score a volume spacer. It's really not that bad.

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