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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hacksaw View Post
    This is basically what happened at Sheep Creek with the deepest victim. When we (Loveland Ski Patrol) arrived we had 12' steel probe poles. All we could do was pinpoint on the victim and start digging because the probe was too short to touch the victim. Once we had dug down about 10' we could probe. That's when we touched the victim. This victim was buried approx 14' - 16'.
    That had to be rough on the rescue crew.
    I swear on my glass eye,

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper View Post
    That had to be rough on the rescue crew.
    It was....
    "True love is much easier to find with a helicopter"

  3. #28
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    Here is the draft text of the recommendation:

    Draft Recommendation Proposal on Position Probing

    Rationale:
    Position Probing allows to quickly gain information about the approximate orientation of the buried
    subject in order to define an optimal excavation strategy and gain head access more rapidly.
    The application of position probing is recommended in cases where more information about the
    position of the buried subject has the potential to minimize head access time.
    While position probing is performed, the remaining rescuers already start excavation with a certain
    distance to the expected burial area.
    Apply a spiral probing technique, each probe hit immediately becomes the center of the next probing
    spiral. Leave every probe with a probe strike in place and use an additional probe to proceed.
    Continue until the outline of the buried subject is evident and adapt the further excavation effort
    accordingly.
    When life gives you haters, make haterade.

  4. #29
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    Position Probing allows to quickly gain information about the approximate orientation of the buried subject in order to define an optimal excavation strategy and gain head access more rapidly.
    Wait...where’s the data on this?
    I swear on my glass eye,

  5. #30
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    Intended for a party of 4 or larger with one burial?

    I'd love to see the logic of this as compared to conveyor belt shoveling, especially from folks a whole lot more experienced than me.

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by galibier_numero_un View Post
    Intended for a party of 4 or larger with one burial?

    I'd love to see the logic of this as compared to conveyor belt shoveling, especially from folks a whole lot more experienced than me.

    ... Thom
    These are recommendations for professional rescue groups...
    When life gives you haters, make haterade.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by sfotex View Post
    These are recommendations for professional rescue groups...
    Thanks. I thought that was the emphasis but wasn't sure if it was being generalized beyond that.

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by sfotex View Post
    Apply a spiral probing technique, each probe hit immediately becomes the center of the next probing
    spiral. Leave every probe with a probe strike in place and use an additional probe to proceed.
    Continue until the outline of the buried subject is evident and adapt the further excavation effort
    accordingly.
    How many probes do they estimate (or better yet have found from experiment) it will take to make the outline of the buried subject 'evident'?

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by nickinbc View Post
    How many probes do they estimate (or better yet have found from experiment) it will take to make the outline of the buried subject 'evident'?
    this seems like it would be a big number to me...

  10. #35
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    go to 14:30 for a detailed description
    When life gives you haters, make haterade.

  11. #36
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    From the video:
    ...based on a very special case scenario..."
    ...you have to very many rescuers on the field. It's not supposed to be used within this window of opportunity where you're fighting time against asphyxia time, so it is beyond 35 minutes of burial time...
    Thanks, that explained it well.
    I swear on my glass eye,

  12. #37
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    OK, but in my opinion all this adds is one more complexity to a very stressful situation.

    I am sure that in one out of 10 or 100 or 1000 scenarios this would be of value but if I am ever buried, please just dig me the hell up.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not bunion View Post
    OK, but in my opinion all this adds is one more complexity to a very stressful situation.

    I am sure that in one out of 10 or 100 or 1000 scenarios this would be of value but if I am ever buried, please just dig me the hell up.
    ^^^ this. I can't believe we're even having a discussion about directional probing.
    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    the situation strikes me as WAY too much drama at this point

  14. #39
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    That video helped clarify it. From an organized rescue perspective, I still say this seems like it would be rarely used and offer little gain. I continue to worry about rescuers crushing the victims airspace.
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not bunion View Post
    OK, but in my opinion all this adds is one more complexity to a very stressful situation.

    I am sure that in one out of 10 or 100 or 1000 scenarios this would be of value but if I am ever buried, please just dig me the hell up.
    That's the rub for me with some of these recommendations. When they DOT first launched the EMT program they discovered that EMT's were delaying transporting critical patients so they could do a complete patient assessment vs. load n' go. I worry that giving people more shit to think can delay the digging, etc.
    When life gives you haters, make haterade.

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