Help with main inbounds ski

[toastybroski]

So I am looking to have a two ski quiver and cant make a decision on my main resort ski.

My current setup is:
Dynafit Vulcans
183 Black Crow corvus freebirds w/ kingpins
187 Moment Bibby Pro (2008 OG model) with tyrolia frame bindings.

I thought the bibby was the perfect ski for me but after skiing the corvus quite a bit I didn't realize how much I missed the playfulness and pop that lack of tail rocker gives. Also, as I am putting shifts on whatever I get, im worried the wildcat will be just too much to ever go uphill on. My bibbys are so old at this point that I don't even remember what they felt like when I first got them and are probably close to reverse cambered by now.

Options:
Wildcat
Deathwish
Wren 114

[doebedoe]

All the skis you list have significant tail rocker. The wren the least but still more than the Corvus.

Personally--living in Denver too--110+ seems wide for a daily driver here.

That said, the Deathwish is super fun. A skinny deathwish with a slightly reduced tail rocker would be a stupid fun ski.

[auvgeek]

Your Bibbys could just be dead. I’ve skied plenty of skis with and without tail rocker and I wouldn’t necessarily say tail rocker makes a ski less playful and poppy.

It sounds like you prefer something with more carbon in it. Maybe an ON3P Wren or Kartel (depending on your preference in mount point), in a custom layup with extra carbon and lighter fiberglass (or maybe even a tour layup with extra carbon) for more pop.

[toastybroski]

Your Bibbys could just be dead. I’ve skied plenty of skis with and without tail rocker and I wouldn’t necessarily say tail rocker makes a ski less playful and poppy.

It sounds like you prefer something with more carbon in it. Maybe an ON3P Wren or Kartel (depending on your preference in mount point), in a custom layup with extra carbon and lighter fiberglass (or maybe even a tour layup with extra carbon) for more pop.

Yeah I used them forever and every seasons was always so stoked on how it was my favorite ski ever. It could be that the ski is dead or the frame bindings made them not handle the same. Im leaning towards deathwish but don't think they would cut it for big powder days.

[toastybroski]

All the skis you list have significant tail rocker. The wren the least but still more than the Corvus.

Personally--living in Denver too--110+ seems wide for a daily driver here.

That said, the Deathwish is super fun. A skinny deathwish with a slightly reduced tail rocker would be a stupid fun ski.

My corvus are 108 so I was thinking if I only have one ski that I use for inbounds and powder it should probably be a little bit wider at least. Even though they are freebirds my corvus absolutely rock on groomers and soft snow.

[Name Redacted]

I have the Wren 108 and ski them primarily in Summit (A-Basin). Since last year sucked and the snow was always crusty ice bumps, they were not the optimal tool unfortunately. I ended up skiing my old skis a lot (RMU SCRM). I might be in the market for either a skinnier Wren, or something else while keeping the 108's for the softer days. I really like the Wren's, but they were just too much (for me*) in tight ice bumps and trees.

*Disclaimer: I'm a pretty shitty skier overall

[doebedoe]

My 2c as someone who skis both the OG Bibby and Deathwish in the front range:

- Deathwish is 90% as good as the Bibby in powder greater than 8ish". And just as good in less.
- Bibby is certainly better in crud. This may be less true as the new DW is stiffened up this year.
- Deathwish is more energetic on groomers and more playful off jibby things.

Personally I like my 184s of both skis mounted back 1cm. I doubt it would be necessary on 190s of either.

[sruffian]

I have an old (11-12, I believe) set of 190 bibby's, and when swapped frame bindings out for pivots it was night and day. A lot of playfulness returned.

If you like the bibby shape and want something poppier, look at the bibby tour? Would solve your shift problem, too if you really want to ski a 'poppier' ski in bounds.

Disagree w/ doebedoe about pow performance in bibby vs deathwish - the deathwish just never felt as loose or floaty to me, really different feel than a bibby. Agreed on all other points. I should mention I ski both in maritime conditions

[toastybroski]

My 2c as someone who skis both the OG Bibby and Deathwish in the front range:

- Deathwish is 90% as good as the Bibby in powder greater than 8ish". And just as good in less.
- Bibby is certainly better in crud. This may be less true as the new DW is stiffened up this year.
- Deathwish is more energetic on groomers and more playful off jibby things.

Personally I like my 184s of both skis mounted back 1cm. I doubt it would be necessary on 190s of either.

I used to ski park a lot and I think that jibbby playful jump off everything style was something that really stood out being on a smaller and less rockered ski. The corvus would not hold up in powder though too well due to their short size. I think the 190 deathwish would probably suit me better?

Bibby tour is an interesting option but I wouldnt think those would be great to ski inbounds 80/20.

[doebedoe]

I have an old (11-12, I believe) set of 190 bibby's, and when swapped frame bindings out for pivots it was night and day. A lot of playfulness returned.

If you like the bibby shape and want something poppier, look at the bibby tour? Would solve your shift problem, too if you really want to ski a 'poppier' ski in bounds.

Disagree w/ doebedoe about pow performance in bibby vs deathwish - the deathwish just never felt as loose or floaty to me, really different feel than a bibby. Agreed on all other points. I should mention I ski both in maritime conditions

I should add, all my experience thus far has been in Colorado snow. The DW i was comparing on was also pretty worn out and soft, and tips/tails pretty heavily detuned. My bibbys are less worn.

100% agree re frames on the Bibby though. I had barons on there and going to STH made the ski way better.

[kathleenturneroverdrive]

Your Bibbys could just be dead. I’ve skied plenty of skis with and without tail rocker and I wouldn’t necessarily say tail rocker makes a ski less playful and poppy.

Couldn't disagree more. With camber you can load up and pop off the tail. With even moderate rocker it's just not the same feeling. You can kind of approximate it, but it's still a huge difference.

[skifishbum]

i was gonna tell ya ditch the kingpins
all the cool kids will buy shifts but cha figured it outs
other than thats
red rax
ftw

[Melee]

My bibbys are so old at this point that I don't even remember what they felt like when I first got them and are probably close to reverse cambered by now.

Options:
Wildcat
Deathwish
Wren 114

Your Bibbys are probably dead.

The 2008 version did not have any carbon fiber in them. A lot of marketing hype likes to state that carbon fiber adds pop, sure it does to a certain degree. What it really does it not fatigue as easily as other composites. If you add carbon to a build old worn out skis wont become full rocker and they retain their camber profile.

All Moment Skis now have a custom hybrid Triax fiberglass with carbon tow woven into the uni-axis which yields even distribution of carbon throughout the entire ski versus floating hand laid carbon builds.
All new skis will retain camber and have a lot more life to them.

Additionally, Tyrolia frame bindings kill flex and the life in skis. So that's part of your issue.

If you were really into the Bibby at one time I would give the Wildcat a shot with a better binding.

I ski the Deathwish a ton and if I am traveling and can only bring one set its always hands down the Deathwish, because it can do most things really well, even ski powder. The micro-cambers give the tip and tail added pop to a more traditional mustache camber/rocker ski and the remaining rocker at the tip and tail still allows for the ski to be playful in tight spots.

Another ski to look at if you want a traditional tail would be the Wildcats big brother, the Governor.

[toastybroski]

Your Bibbys are probably dead.

The 2008 version did not have any carbon fiber in them. A lot of marketing hype likes to state that carbon fiber adds pop, sure it does to a certain degree. What it really does it not fatigue as easily as other composites. If you add carbon to a build old worn out skis wont become full rocker and they retain their camber profile.

All Moment Skis now have a custom hybrid Triax fiberglass with carbon tow woven into the uni-axis which yields even distribution of carbon throughout the entire ski versus floating hand laid carbon builds.
All new skis will retain camber and have a lot more life to them.

Additionally, Tyrolia frame bindings kill flex and the life in skis. So that's part of your issue.

If you were really into the Bibby at one time I would give the Wildcat a shot with a better binding.

I ski the Deathwish a ton and if I am traveling and can only bring one set its always hands down the Deathwish, because it can do most things really well, even ski powder. The micro-cambers give the tip and tail added pop to a more traditional mustache camber/rocker ski and the remaining rocker at the tip and tail still allows for the ski to be playful in tight spots.

Another ski to look at if you want a traditional tail would be the Wildcats big brother, the Governor.

Yeah I just looked at them after removing the frame binds and there is zero camber left in them. Still not sure if I should put some shifts on deathwishes and just put some old STH bindings on the bibbys that I already have.

[2FUNKY]

Couldn't disagree more. With camber you can load up and pop off the tail. With even moderate rocker it's just not the same feeling. You can kind of approximate it, but it's still a huge difference.

Weighting the tail and loading them up to launch off the tail doesn’t not mean the ski has pop. Smh. Auvgeek is correct. Loading the ski under the boot, ya know, how you’re supposed to ski, and how the ski transfers that energy is what is considered pop.

[toastybroski]

I want to throw in my bibbys before were my every day all mountain skis but I never went uphill with them. If there is something that exists that handles powder days almost as well but is a bit more fun and controllable on groomers that is exactly what i'm looking for. Especially for the rare day that I go uphill with them. I could never get my bibbys to sink in powder and they were glorious.

[Cocximus]

I dread using frame bindings these days. It's a lot of dead weight that does nothing for the down.

[Melee]

I want to throw in my bibbys before were my every day all mountain skis but I never went uphill with them. If there is something that exists that handles powder days almost as well but is a bit more fun and controllable on groomers that is exactly what i'm looking for. Especially for the rare day that I go uphill with them. I could never get my bibbys to sink in powder and they were glorious.

Sounds like you want a Deathwish then.

[toastybroski]

Sounds like you want a Deathwish then.

You all have any discounts for an early adopter ?? 2008 Reno Rockers and Bibbys

[sruffian]

I want to throw in my bibbys before were my every day all mountain skis but I never went uphill with them. If there is something that exists that handles powder days almost as well but is a bit more fun and controllable on groomers that is exactly what i'm looking for. Especially for the rare day that I go uphill with them. I could never get my bibbys to sink in powder and they were glorious.

GPO. I think they're a little surfier feeling in pow, too

[Melee]

You all have any discounts for an early adopter ?? 2008 Reno Rockers and Bibbys

Probably. Send me an email: luke@momentskis.com

[kathleenturneroverdrive]

Weighting the tail and loading them up to launch off the tail doesn’t not mean the ski has pop. Smh. Auvgeek is correct. Loading the ski under the boot, ya know, how you’re supposed to ski, and how the ski transfers that energy is what is considered pop.

Whatever man we're over here doing wheelies like a boss while you're measuring edge bevels

[Banh Mi]

^^x2

Bibbys and Govs rock though too.

Maybe a 2019 1.5x carbon Kartel 108 with the new sidecut.


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