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  1. #2151
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    Quote Originally Posted by N1CK. View Post
    you know HAB, if you chose a transparent color and Keith did the snake in black, the snake would print as a relief, so the wood grain would show through.
    Wait, you mean Powdah Snek Black, but with the black subbed for a transparent color?

  2. #2152
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAB View Post
    Wait, you mean Powdah Snek Black, but with the black subbed for a transparent color?
    I mis-spoke.

    what you said, that would work, I know he can do gradients
    what I was picturing what the ski in a light trans color for contrast and the snek graphic in WHITE, that doesn't print on veeners so it comes through totally transparent and the grain shows through.

    edit: the white snek would print with the wood grain in place of the white.
    black snek would be print black and the whole ski would be wood grain.
    the black being slightly tranparent or grey would be SICK.
    Name:  snek.JPG
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  3. #2153
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    Quote Originally Posted by N1CK. View Post
    the black being slightly tranparent or grey would be SICK.

  4. #2154
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    Quote Originally Posted by N1CK. View Post
    the black being slightly tranparent or grey would be SICK.
    Name:  snek.JPG
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Size:  55.1 KB
    Someone please try this.

  5. #2155
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    You have to be careful to not lose the beauty of the wood. I think HAB has it right, Powdeh Snek White. The snake in a different color, a darker transparent would look awesome.

  6. #2156
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    Quote Originally Posted by dschane View Post
    Good info., thanks. I'm looking for a spring ski and am leaning towards a 173 Exp, enduro with carbon, #4.
    Knowing your taste in slightly more robust skis for touring, I think you're on to something. @grinch's 173s in the standard #3 (with veneer) are surprisingly steady in manky snow. It belies their 1430g weight. This ski really surprised me, because of its stability at this length and weight. Bumping up to enduro #4 would be right up your alley.

    I wish I could give you a data point against those CD 104Ls, but COVID (my household situation) has shut me down since last March.

    ... Thom
    Last edited by galibier_numero_un; 05-01-2021 at 06:28 AM.
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  7. #2157
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    I missed that. It does sound good. Could be just the right amount of camber to play with a 4 flex

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app

  8. #2158
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    Just heard back from Keith, and he says a 4 flex protest with veneer and enduro/carbon is his personal choice. I’m interested in just a 4 flex 192... the price difference for the veneer is just a bit much on my humble budget.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  9. #2159
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    Id skip the carbon and get the veneer. Ez decision

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app

  10. #2160
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    Quote Originally Posted by grinch View Post
    Id skip the carbon and get the veneer. Ez decision

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app
    ^^^ this ^^^

    In no way does the nylon top suck, but in comparison, veneer leaves it in the dust. I'm reminded of the following quote, in terms of the value over time of spending a few extra bucks up front:
    The Bitterness of Poor Quality Remains Long After the Sweetness of Low Price is Forgotten
    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  11. #2161
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    Quote Originally Posted by galibier_numero_un View Post
    ^^^ this ^^^

    In no way does the nylon top suck, but in comparison, veneer leaves it in the dust. I'm reminded of the following quote, in terms of the value over time of spending a few extra bucks up front:

    ... Thom
    Im going to use that one!!

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app

  12. #2162
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    Done deal:
    • GPO
    • 182
    • Flex #3
    • UL/Carbon/Veneer (maple)
    • +10
    • Max topsheet

    I wrestled with Max, Tsunami and Mountain Sunrise. I mssed those Max graphics from my departed Qs, and the playfulness of the graphics embodied the fun/pow attitude of this build.

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  13. #2163
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    Thom, your specs are going to produce one helluva a touring and floating ski.

    Interesting views on the pros/cons of carbon. I'm definitely a fan, but it's been so long since I've skied without it.

  14. #2164
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    Yes Thom!! Going to be a sweet ski. Should i go to the hill? Or should i go touring? Looks at ski- TOURING!!

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app

  15. #2165
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    Quote Originally Posted by grinch View Post
    Yes Thom!! Going to be a sweet ski. Should i go to the hill? Or should i go touring? Looks at ski- TOURING!!

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app
    Ya, after a year of COVID isolation, I'm debating on whether I'll even ride a lift next year (except for a trip to Revy, maybe?) Stay tuned, as I analyze my budget ;-)

    Quote Originally Posted by dschane View Post
    Thom, your specs are going to produce one helluva a touring and floating ski.

    Interesting views on the pros/cons of carbon. I'm definitely a fan, but it's been so long since I've skied without it.
    Ya, meadow-skipping in mid-Winter ... the bane of our existence here in Colorado.

    It could be worse (ain't complainin'). I've been curious to test the "fat ski for meadow-skipping" theory for a couple of years. My buddy got to test the theory this Winter, and was surprised at the improvement in float (between GPOs and Protests). It was much more than relatively small increase in surface area.

    I think @grinch is saying that with respect to carbon, if given an either/or choice (veneer vs. carbon) to opt for veneer. With a Praxis veneer build, adding carbon seems to me to be more about extra weight reduction, than the plus of carbon's extra "pop" and its minus of "nervousness".

    Veneer seems to do the "pop" without carbon's chatter, saving about the same amount of weight as carbon, as well as mitigating the chatter of carbon if it's included in the build (chatter mitigation only obvious to me inbounds, on harder snow).

    Interestingly, Enduro/Veneer and Enduro/Veneer/Carbon feel categorically very much the same to me, in that they're both much more calm than a Praxis layup with nylon/carbon.

    I've never skied Praxis in Enduro/Nylon (no carbon).

    Now, carbon with Down is much better damped than a Praxis/Nylon/Carbon build. I don't know if it compares to Enduro/Nylon (no carbon). Is the Down's dampness due to the flax? Beats me, but I'd equivocate Praxis Enduro/Veneer, or Enduro/Veneer/Carbon with the feel of my CD 114s. Maybe Praxis/Nylon (no carbon) would be similar?

    ... Thom
    Last edited by galibier_numero_un; 05-03-2021 at 01:40 PM.
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  16. #2166
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    Yes to that. I think veneer saves about the same weight as carbon and costs roughly the same. If youre going to pick one, id say veneer

    Sent from my SM-G950W using TGR Forums mobile app

  17. #2167
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    That +10 GPO sounds awesome Thom.
    Nice choice
    Post up the weight estimate or weight when you receive them, please?
    Aggressive in my own mind

  18. #2168
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    Quote Originally Posted by galibier_numero_un View Post
    Done deal:
    • GPO
    • 182
    • Flex #3
    • UL/Carbon/Veneer (maple)
    • +10
    • Max topsheet

    I wrestled with Max, Tsunami and Mountain Sunrise. I mssed those Max graphics from my departed Qs, and the playfulness of the graphics embodied the fun/pow attitude of this build.

    ... Thom
    Amusing that you're going for the +10 GPO, while, I'm scheming a -10 Protest. Different strokes, eh?

  19. #2169
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    Quote Originally Posted by hoarhey View Post
    That +10 GPO sounds awesome Thom.
    Nice choice
    Post up the weight estimate or weight when you receive them, please?
    Will do. I'm hoping to land in the 1950g. range. We'll see in 3-4 months ;-)
    Quote Originally Posted by HAB View Post
    Amusing that you're going for the +10 GPO, while, I'm scheming a -10 Protest. Different strokes, eh?
    And, after comparing notes with @dub2 who bought my Protests (and also sold them), I'm thinking that we've never experienced a "proper" Protest for our weight (I'm 165#). We both thought those 187s were like 2x4s.

    I'll bet they were a heavy core (coming in at an ON3P-like 10.4 Lbs. for the pair - a bit under 2400g. each).

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  20. #2170
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    Quote Originally Posted by galibier_numero_un View Post
    Will do. I'm hoping to land in the 1950g. range. We'll see in 3-4 months ;-)
    And, after comparing notes with @dub2 who bought my Protests (and also sold them), I'm thinking that we've never experienced a "proper" Protest for our weight (I'm 165#). We both thought those 187s were like 2x4s.

    I'll bet they were a heavy core (coming in at an ON3P-like 10.4 Lbs. for the pair - a bit under 2400g. each).

    ... Thom
    Keith estimated ~1900g for my -1 187 UL carbon/veneer Protests, FWIW.

    My current 192 MAP veneer flex 3s are perfect for my 165lb. I just want a lighter, touring-specific build that's easier on my gimpy knee on sidehills.

  21. #2171
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAB View Post
    Keith estimated ~1900g for my -1 187 UL carbon/veneer Protests, FWIW.

    My current 192 MAP veneer flex 3s are perfect for my 165lb. I just want a lighter, touring-specific build that's easier on my gimpy knee on sidehills.
    Sounds as if I'm looking at 2000g. or more for my rig. Maybe I'll just use double-sided tape for bindings to save weight ;-)

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  22. #2172
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    Mar 2020
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    This is a question for those of you who have or have had various Praxis skis, as to the relative stiffness of Praxis skis. It is my understanding from Keith that a #3 or #4 is a number #3 or #4 throughout the line, there is consistency. I have only seen and held one Praxis ski, my 9D8 #4 HH. As a comparative when I ordered the ski we talked about something in the range of the stiffness of a K2 Mindbender 108TI, Keith said a #4. Sure enough the 9D8 #4 is very close (just a bit softer) to the 108TI. The #4 is quite a bit softer than my ON3Ps, Woodsman 116 and Billy Goat. But the 9D8 is quite a bit stiffer than the original Rossi Soul 7 (yes I have a pair of the greatest ski ever made ) that sits in my basement. My summer order is for a #4 RX.

    My question is, how much softer is a #3 than a #4? For example is it like going from a Mindbender 108TI to a Soul 7, or is the difference more subtle than that?

    PS. Thom, that is going to be a great looking ski!

  23. #2173
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    ^^ it's subtler than a ti ski to an s7, but still significant. i'd say unless you're very light for your height or more flippy/spinny than goey-fasty I'd stick w a #4

  24. #2174
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    Quote Originally Posted by sruffian View Post
    ^^ it's subtler than a ti ski to an s7, but still significant. i'd say unless you're very light for your height or more flippy/spinny than goey-fasty I'd stick w a #4
    Thanks for the insight. I find the #4 flex in my 9D8s to be perfect for me. It will be interesting to compare the hand flex feel of a #4 HH core to a #4 Enduro core.

  25. #2175
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quandary View Post
    Thanks for the insight. I find the #4 flex in my 9D8s to be perfect for me. It will be interesting to compare the hand flex feel of a #4 HH core to a #4 Enduro core.
    Only one sample for me - a 184 Freeride HH/Veneer/#4.

    In comparison with Enduro, it took more energy to load it up and pop into a turn. You'd expect that.

    Hand flex of the HH felt the same as Enduro.

    As far as Praxis layups, I find that Enduro skis a bit more solidly than its hand flex would lead you to expect, and similarly, the HH is more robust yet.

    In my case, the Freeride was the wrong ski in the wrong layup for the job, but for the person who rips it up inbounds, I can see it working quite nicely. I think I should have been looking at more of PJ or perhaps, 9D8.

    For me, the conditions I'd take a ski this width out, I'd find myself in front side bumps at the end of the day - bumps that are pretty beat up, and the combination of being tired, the ski's design and layup was too much for me.

    I should have asked Keith before before ordering. I let a bit too much ego guide my purchase. When I asked Keith about this after the fact, he agreed that the Freeride isn't his favorite ski in bumps.

    ... Thom
    Last edited by galibier_numero_un; 05-04-2021 at 10:57 PM.
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

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