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  1. #101
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
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    Reno
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    705
    Quote Originally Posted by wwwllw View Post
    When will there be more info on the wildcat tour 108? Have shifts that need skis. Was thinking wren 108 tour layup but if it ends up being my only tour setup I think they’ll be too heavy.
    Should have them on the site this week.

    If you cant wait you can shoot us an email info@momentskis.com and we can get your order in the system. We already have a lot of pre-orders for this ski...

  2. #102
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Gaperville, CO
    Posts
    3,057
    Kudos for Moment making three 10X waisted touring skis in different camber profiles/flexes/shapes. Interesting to me that the Meridian actually has more effective edge in a given length than the deathwish.

    There's been lots of Deathwish / Bibby stiffness comparisons. But how does the revised stiffness of the DW compare to the Meridian?

  3. #103
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by doebedoe View Post
    Kudos for Moment making three 10X waisted touring skis in different camber profiles/flexes/shapes. Interesting to me that the Meridian actually has more effective edge in a given length than the deathwish.

    There's been lots of Deathwish / Bibby stiffness comparisons. But how does the revised stiffness of the DW compare to the Meridian?
    FWIW I ski the Deathwish & Deathwish Tour. Nice to have a lightweight touring ski that skis very similar to my inbounds ski.

  4. #104
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Reno
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    705
    Quote Originally Posted by doebedoe View Post

    There's been lots of Deathwish / Bibby stiffness comparisons. But how does the revised stiffness of the DW compare to the Meridian?
    The Meridian 187 is still going to have a thicker core than the DW 190 and Wildcat(Bibby) 190.

    There are a lot of other factors in play that need to be taken into consideration like Full Rocker vs Mustache Rocker vs Triple Camber.

  5. #105
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    375
    steved

    Do you know a weight?

  6. #106
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Los Angeles/Mammoth
    Posts
    538
    Quote Originally Posted by wwwllw View Post
    steved

    Do you know a weight?
    Just noticed the listed weights of the 18/19 Wildcat Tours and lighter than the 17/18 Bibby Tours. 190s are 1810 grams vs 1925 grams each. Interesting. Wonder what changed in the construction? I have a pair of 17/18 190s that weigh in exactly at 1925

    Sent from my Pixel using TGR Forums mobile app
    Unofficial Fact: Skiing was 69% more rad in the 1980's.

  7. #107
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Reno
    Posts
    705
    Quote Originally Posted by jdadour View Post
    Just noticed the listed weights of the 18/19 Wildcat Tours and lighter than the 17/18 Bibby Tours. 190s are 1810 grams vs 1925 grams each. Interesting. Wonder what changed in the construction? I have a pair of 17/18 190s that weigh in exactly at 1925

    Sent from my Pixel using TGR Forums mobile app
    No major construction changes. Honestly, we have been listing our skis about a half pound heavier for the pair than the really are for the last couple years....total mistake on our part.

    All weights are legit on the site now.

    Also, that Wildcat Tour weight is pretty badass. Especially for how it skis...

  8. #108
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    5

    Commander Review 108 - 188cm after 5 days at Valle Nevado

    I was fortunate enough to take a 108 Commander 188cm to Valle Nevado in Chile last week. I also had my Blizzard 185cm Cochise with me. I like the Cochise, and I currently have a lot of other skis (2016 Spur, 190 Bibby, 187 Brahma, 187 Bonafide), but Iíve still been looking for a 108 all mountain ski that is a go-to in difficult and variable conditions. I like the dampness of the Cochise, and while itís easy to break the tail free in tighter places when needed, I thought it would be great to have similar dampness while being able to hold an edge in a tighter than 27 m radius. (towards that ideal I tried the J Skis186cm Metal, which had good qualities but ultimately felt short to me and did not exhibit good edge hold in firm, icy conditions, and the 2018 Black Crows Atris in 189cm, which also exhibited some good qualities but felt brittle and wasnít nearly damp enough. First day of 5 on the trip I took the Cochise and Commander out, and I started on the Cochise until I had my legs back under me after the summer off. After switching to the Commander, I didnít take the Cochise back out again, nor did I take out the Brahma I brought Ė even though conditions were pretty firm everywhere and best on groomers, perfect conditions for the Brahma -- just enjoyed using the Commander the whole 5 days.
    I never found the 185cm Cochise a difficult ski, but the Commander is an easier, more intuitive ski. It wants to be ridden from a more centered position and requires much less input to drive the tips and is also really easy to drift and slarve. The tails hold up well, and while you donít want to get in the back seat, if you do, it's pretty easy to get back in position. Held an edge on firm and icy groomers and wind scoured packed powder, far better than the Cochise, and I felt more comfortable getting air on bumps and jumping turns on the Commander, which was quicker edge to edge. If bases are flat at speed on run outs that are roughed up at all, I would say the additional weight of the Cochise, my 185 was roughly 225 grams, or .5 lbs., per ski heavier than the 188 Commanders, made the Cochise feel more damp. However, stability at speed on the Commander is enhanced by another 3 centimeters of length and less tip splay than the Cochise so despite a little less dampness, run outs at speed felt more stable on the Commander. When on edge, whether on roughed up groomers or in crud, or jumping in bumps, the difference in dampness wasnít as noticeable and what feels like a longer effective edge on the Commander gives it more stability. Most really damp skis donít offer much in the way of quickness or liveliness. In contrast, I think the Commander was engineered to combine edge to edge quickness, lightness in the air, and a very solid dampness that is still lively enough to offer lots of rebound out of turns.
    For me, someone who doesnít need a 108 ski to be a powder ski, the 185 Cochise had pretty clearly beaten out the new ON3P Wrenegade 189 108, (felt much more locked into its radius and did not feel very lively), Jís Skis The Metal 186, 2018 Black Crows Atris 189, and 2017 Volkl 108 189.
    Now, the 188 Commander pretty soundly beat out the Cochise and is clearly the best 108 ski for me. Great ski.

  9. #109
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    1,495
    ^^^ nice review and nice first post.
    sproing!

  10. #110
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Los Angeles/Mammoth
    Posts
    538
    Quote Originally Posted by 188108 View Post
    I was fortunate enough to take a 108 Commander 188cm to Valle Nevado in Chile last week. I also had my Blizzard 185cm Cochise with me. I like the Cochise, and I currently have a lot of other skis (2016 Spur, 190 Bibby, 187 Brahma, 187 Bonafide), but I’ve still been looking for a 108 all mountain ski that is a go-to in difficult and variable conditions. I like the dampness of the Cochise, and while it’s easy to break the tail free in tighter places when needed, I thought it would be great to have similar dampness while being able to hold an edge in a tighter than 27 m radius. (towards that ideal I tried the J Skis186cm Metal, which had good qualities but ultimately felt short to me and did not exhibit good edge hold in firm, icy conditions, and the 2018 Black Crows Atris in 189cm, which also exhibited some good qualities but felt brittle and wasn’t nearly damp enough. First day of 5 on the trip I took the Cochise and Commander out, and I started on the Cochise until I had my legs back under me after the summer off. After switching to the Commander, I didn’t take the Cochise back out again, nor did I take out the Brahma I brought – even though conditions were pretty firm everywhere and best on groomers, perfect conditions for the Brahma -- just enjoyed using the Commander the whole 5 days.
    I never found the 185cm Cochise a difficult ski, but the Commander is an easier, more intuitive ski. It wants to be ridden from a more centered position and requires much less input to drive the tips and is also really easy to drift and slarve. The tails hold up well, and while you don’t want to get in the back seat, if you do, it's pretty easy to get back in position. Held an edge on firm and icy groomers and wind scoured packed powder, far better than the Cochise, and I felt more comfortable getting air on bumps and jumping turns on the Commander, which was quicker edge to edge. If bases are flat at speed on run outs that are roughed up at all, I would say the additional weight of the Cochise, my 185 was roughly 225 grams, or .5 lbs., per ski heavier than the 188 Commanders, made the Cochise feel more damp. However, stability at speed on the Commander is enhanced by another 3 centimeters of length and less tip splay than the Cochise so despite a little less dampness, run outs at speed felt more stable on the Commander. When on edge, whether on roughed up groomers or in crud, or jumping in bumps, the difference in dampness wasn’t as noticeable and what feels like a longer effective edge on the Commander gives it more stability. Most really damp skis don’t offer much in the way of quickness or liveliness. In contrast, I think the Commander was engineered to combine edge to edge quickness, lightness in the air, and a very solid dampness that is still lively enough to offer lots of rebound out of turns.
    For me, someone who doesn’t need a 108 ski to be a powder ski, the 185 Cochise had pretty clearly beaten out the new ON3P Wrenegade 189 108, (felt much more locked into its radius and did not feel very lively), J’s Skis The Metal 186, 2018 Black Crows Atris 189, and 2017 Volkl 108 189.
    Now, the 188 Commander pretty soundly beat out the Cochise and is clearly the best 108 ski for me. Great ski.
    Great review, thanks! Whats your height and weight?

  11. #111
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    5

    height weight

    6'4 210

    I don't think the ski skis big. Mount point is 3 up from Cochise which is basically straight pull length difference. I ski things like the 189 spur and 190 Bibby, lots of rocker, but the 192 Cochise is too much ski for me.

    I wouldn't think anyone would go down in size on the Commander.

  12. #112
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    1,495
    Just ordered some 2018 188 PB&Js. Will replace Bonafides, which are capable everywhere, but a little dull. Woot!
    sproing!

  13. #113
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    tahoe de chingao
    Posts
    309
    Great review of the commander - really has me interested. Cochise is a great reference ski, as well. You mention it "requires much less input to drive the tips and is also really easy to drift and slarve" - is it easier to break free than the cochise? If so, combined with that kind of edge hold, I am very intrigued. I've gotten away from cochises in the last year or so mainly because of the way they really only like that one turn shape, and have been looking for an alternative like this (but looser than the belafonte)

  14. #114
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    5

    commander and cochise

    Yes, easier to break free, but I didn't find the Cochise, newer version, that difficult to break free more just limited to the 27 m radius if I wanted to edge v. break the tails free. I never get the right effective edge numbers when I measure as opposed to the manufacturer, or I would measure the 2. I've attached a picture of the two profiles, Commander on right. Rocker starts later at tip end of Commander and less tip splay, and rocker starts later at tail with more tip splay at end of tail.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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  15. #115
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Tahoe
    Posts
    3,707

    Moment Skis Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by meter-man View Post
    Just ordered some 2018 188 PB&Js. Will replace Bonafides, which are capable everywhere, but a little dull. Woot!
    They are fun! Tried an true design.

    Nice review on the Commander 188108! I hope I can get on them this year. Is that where your name came from lol? 188cm commander 108? I thought it was a random assigned name at first


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  16. #116
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    5
    yeah. too many accounts and passwords so just keep it simple on names.

  17. #117
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    1,495
    Quote Originally Posted by 188108 View Post
    yeah. too many accounts and passwords so just keep it simple on names.
    So what are your other aliases?? 666? Melee? freemomentski4me2001? haha, but seriously - are you a paid pimper of Moments?
    sproing!

  18. #118
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Tahoe
    Posts
    3,707
    So theres the PB&J and the PB&Jib..

    I would love to see the other end of the spectrum with a PB&X with metal! Would be so sick. Badass freestyle all mtn crud charger.


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  19. #119
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Gaperville, CO
    Posts
    3,057
    While we're on dream Moments...

    Skinny Deathwish
    - 95ish waist
    - same radius
    - reduced tip/tail splay but similar rocker lines
    - micro camber profile
    - 1 layer of titanal underfoot, tapering in the tip and tail.

    Think that would hit my fun vs stability sweetspot for low-tide conditions, but IANASD.

  20. #120
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Tahoe
    Posts
    3,707

    Moment Skis Discussion

    196 Metal Donner Parties? The Spatula Party. Ultimate Sierra Cement Blasters, Cream Cheese Spreaders


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

  21. #121
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Reno
    Posts
    705
    Quote Originally Posted by meter-man View Post
    So what are your other aliases?? 666? Melee? freemomentski4me2001? haha, but seriously - are you a paid pimper of Moments?
    He isn't paid. He knows our new sales guy who used to work at a retail shop and helped him out with tons of different skis. He paid full price and got the skis overnighted to him for his South America trip. We did ask him to write a review and give us his feedback since he was one of the first customers on the Commander 108.

    If I was going to make an alias I would be more creative...maybe something like Scott_Andrus or ONP3.

  22. #122
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    5
    To further clarify, I hadn't logged in to TGR maybe since creating an account, had issues, and created a new account, thus the specific to topic handle for the post. Have been a member for a while, buy gear, go to movies, never posted -- I never post on any discussion thread anywhere, although I have called into sports radio shows a few times in the past, if that counts. Sole purpose on here was to post the review. I'd already posted the review on Moments site and just cut and pasted it here. So there we go.

  23. #123
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    in the shadow of the white rocks
    Posts
    1,179
    Moment is on my short list of next skis, yet my lil grom may get a pair first. She’s due for a set to compliment her racers/frontside skis, comments / thoughts on the Carsons for a first Freeride ski?

  24. #124
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Sandy by the front
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    1,662
    Quote Originally Posted by iriponsnow View Post
    Moment is on my short list of next skis, yet my lil grom may get a pair first. She’s due for a set to compliment her racers/frontside skis, comments / thoughts on the Carsons for a first Freeride ski?

    Our nine year old granddaughter is on her second pair. First pair of 115 cm at five then last year at eight we got her the 130's. When we gave them to her she was a little put off by the graphics compared to her (crappy foam core) pink Nordica's. We live in SLC all winter and ski Alta almost exclusively. So at Alta she took a couple of runs on the Carson's and said she wanted her old skis back. We let her put the Nordica's on and after one run she said she wanted the Carson's back. A couple of runs later I asked her how she liked them and she told me to throw the Nordica's away. Her skiing improved instantly on the Carson's. Literally took maybe four runs before she was just railing on them. She turned nine in March and she skis everything at Alta confidently. She is also a racer and has no issue going back and forth between her race boards and Carson's. I have posted this photo before but this is Allison three years ago, on her seventh birthday skiing at Alta in Catherine's the day after a decent storm on her Carson'sName:  Allisonpictoftheday.jpg
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    We would highly recommend the Carson's, wood core, plenty of snap and they ski well on groomers as well as in soft snow. Also Moment is a great Company to deal with, bunch of good dudes that work hard and make great skis and stand behind them.

    Lastly here she is mounting up her new Carson's last December
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  25. #125
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
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    in the shadow of the white rocks
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    1,179
    That’s awesome- my daughter is 7.... racers are 120cm - 121 Carson? Looks like they are 121, 136, 152cm.

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