The impending Death of HBO

[Dantheman]

https://gizmodo.com/at-ts-big-plan-f...m-t-1827449321

"You see, despite HBO turning a $2 billion annual budget into $6 billion in profits, it’s competing with Netflix, a company that plans to spend $2 billion on marketing alone this year and runs at a loss. Hulu, another direct competitor, managed to lose close to a billion dollars last year. And in Stankey’s maniacal mind, HBO must be more like these losers.

And the fact is, Stankey probably has a point. When you live in a system in which venture capitalism and public investment push a company to gobble up the market until all competitors are vanquished without regard for profits, this is the mindset we end up with. In what sane world does a man say “35 to 40 percent” market penetration just isn’t enough and that the definition of success is strapping as many eyeballs to a service for as many hours of the day as possible? No sane world, but this is Stankey’s world. It’s one in which consumer preferences must be chopped and screwed into endless charts that are monetized across endless platforms. And hey, if some people like the show with the dragons, that’s fine, too."

[Benny Profane]

Yup. Goodbye to profitable quality. Crazy world.

[dunfree]

It’s one in which consumer preferences must be chopped and screwed into endless charts that are monetized across endless platforms.

that's wrong. consumers are monetized on one platform - Netflix - that owns every non-working hour - and gives you pretty much all the non-sports content you want. Or some netflix like competitor. Didn't bother to read much of the OPs link, but it sounds like the author was somewhat reacting to this piece:
https://redef.com/original/netflix-i...standings-pt-3
that's been making the rounds without linking to it. It's worth a read.

HBO has good shows, a few great ones, but at any given time it only has 1 or 2 I care about and HBO wants $15 a month for HBOnow. That's more than Netflix and netflix has way more content.

[Dantheman]

Didn't bother to read much of the OPs link, but it sounds like the author was somewhat reacting to this piece:
https://redef.com/original/netflix-i...standings-pt-3
that's been making the rounds without linking to it. It's worth a read.

Read the link. He's reacting to recently leaked audio from a meeting between HBO executives and their new AT&T overlord John Stankey who tells them straight-up that their new business model is going to be a shotgun content mill and they can get with the program or GTFO. No fucks given regarding the network's unmatched ability to dominate the Emmys and attract A-list on- and off-camera talent.

HBO has good shows, a few great ones, but at any given time it only has 1 or 2 I care about and HBO wants $15 a month for HBOnow. That's more than Netflix and netflix has way more content.

That's great and all, but Netflix operates at a loss while HBO makes billions in profit annually. Which is a bad thing, apparently.

[AdironRider]

Unmatched? I feel like Netflix is doing pretty well on the talent side. Plus their original programming is better across the board, outside of Thrones, which I don't watch because I don't play Dungeons and Dragons, but will give them credit for.

HBO is seeing the writing on the wall a couple years to late it appears. This seems more to me like whining when they could've taken those ridiculous profits and reinvested them. Instead they cashed the checks while Netflix spent all theirs.

[dunfree]

That's great and all, but Netflix operates at a loss while HBO makes billions in profit annually. Which is a bad thing, apparently.

why does the consumer care whether the business makes a profit or not right now?

HBO made great shows. It never had a bench. Netflix has made some very good shows, bought rights to foreign ones, is closing in on HBO in general quality if not peak quality, and Netflix is spending billions to get more great content made - $12 billion this year alone:
https://redef.com/original/5aef0993c6ebc12630896b45
Netflix has a deep bench of shit to watch and is accelerating. HBO is just seeing the writing on the wall.

looking back HBO made the choice to die 7 years ago when Netflix outbid them for House of Cards:
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/ne...fincher-167882
they were too wedded to their quite profitable business model that was going to die because cable sucks. they (or at least plepler) admits as much, now. But they are playing catchup.

[MTT]

You can buy HBO though Amazon Prime for 7.99 per month.

I have not pulled the trigger but it's there.

Prime seems to rule the world

[Benny Profane]

Christ, the world is insane about money. Don't concern yourself with profit, just spend spend spend on crap and go for market share.

This is sad. An asshole CEO is going to drop in there and eliminate any reason for good talent to stay with and be attracted to HBO, which is easily the best movie studio operating right now, in our modern world of cinema.

Haven't they exhausted all this Superhero shit?

[MontuckyFried]

I am not pleased. Learned about it from this article:
https://arstechnica.com/information-...itable-enough/
The comment section in there is hilarious and unanimously pissed off.
Wow, this new CEO sounds like such a tool:

"We need hours a day," Mr. Stankey said, referring to the time viewers spend watching HBO programs. "It's not hours a week, and it's not hours a month. We need hours a day. You are competing with devices that sit in people's hands that capture their attention every 15 minutes."

Continuing the theme, he added: "I want more hours of engagement. Why are more hours of engagement important? Because you get more data and information about a customer that then allows you to do things like monetize through alternate models of advertising as well as subscriptions, which I think is very important to play in tomorrow's world."
...
...
Stankey reiterated that the first year under AT&T's ownership could be tough for HBO employees. "I suspect if we're in a situation where we're going to be investing heavier, that means that there's going to be more work for all of you to do—and you're going to be working a little bit harder," he said.

The first year under AT&T ownership is a time that HBO employees will "be very fond of" when they look back on it, Stankey said. But, he added, "it's not going to feel great while you're in the middle of it."

Basically he's planning on slave driving that ship right into the ground. I wonder how many people who work there plus there talent will be abandoning ship over the next couple years with this Stankey idiot at the helm.

PS: Is it a joke that his name is Stankey? Hahaha.

[MTT]

Christ, the world is insane about money. Don't concern yourself with profit, just spend spend spend on crap and go for market share.

This is sad. An asshole CEO is going to drop in there and eliminate any reason for good talent to stay with and be attracted to HBO, which is easily the best movie studio operating right now, in our modern world of cinema.

Haven't they exhausted all this Superhero shit?

If AT&T stays true to form, they will offshore or subcontract everything in HBO. Suck every dime they can out of it, sell the carcass to someone else.

[Dantheman]

why does the consumer care whether the business makes a profit or not right now?

HBO made great shows. It never had a bench. Netflix has made some very good shows, bought rights to foreign ones, is closing in on HBO in general quality if not peak quality, and Netflix is spending billions to get more great content made - $12 billion this year alone:
https://redef.com/original/5aef0993c6ebc12630896b45
Netflix has a deep bench of shit to watch and is accelerating. HBO is just seeing the writing on the wall.

looking back HBO made the choice to die 7 years ago when Netflix outbid them for House of Cards:
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/ne...fincher-167882
they were too wedded to their quite profitable business model that was going to die because cable sucks. they (or at least plepler) admits as much, now. But they are playing catchup.

No bench? Literally every piece of original content they've ever produced is available on their app. There are tons of people out there who have never seen Sopranos, The Wire, Deadwood, etc. They had record subscriber growth last year, so I don't think it's fair to say they were dying in any way. Netflix absolutely has some good shows (and also a ton of total crap that should have been left on the cutting room floor, I'm looking at you, Arrested Development reboot), but who has the better content is sort of beside the point. This guy is going in and telling a group of people who are damn good at what they do that he's about to flip their whole world upside down, which is probably only going to lead to:

Wow, this new CEO sounds like such a tool:

Basically he's planning on slave driving that ship right into the ground. I wonder how many people who work there plus there talent will be abandoning ship over the next couple years with this Stankey idiot at the helm.

The guy literally told them that the next year is going to feel like childbirth. When Netflix, Hulu and Amazon start offering these people more money they are going to jump ship in droves.

[MontuckyFried]

This guy is going in and telling a group of people who are damn good at what they do that he's about to flip their whole world upside down...
The guy literally told them that the next year is going to feel like childbirth. When Netflix, Hulu and Amazon start offering these people more money they are going to jump ship in droves.

It's asshat executives like this guy who boggle my mind. HBO has seen record growth over the last year and good profits. But nope! That's not good enough!

I can see this guy going off in a meeting with his underlings, screaming "We aren't happy until EVERY person on the planet is watching HBO 24/7 on 5 devices simultaneously, and you know what? When you peons achieve that, then it STILL won't be good enough...We're not stopping there, baby! No way! We're shooting to overtake Amazon! You guys need to make HBO Pantry happen NOW!!!! HBO Prime! 2 day shipping! What? We don't sell pencils and bulk lube? MAKE IT HAPPEN!", as he throws a chair at an interns head for no apparent reason and storms off, giving the secretary a big sloppy kiss and a slap on the behind on his way out for good measure. "MAKE. IT. HAPPEN." Door slams shut. Pokes head back in for sec, "Oh, and great job on Game of Thrones and Westworld. Keep up the good work there guys. Go team!"

[Benny Profane]

Isn't there a sordid history of bean counting and quarterly report obsessed Corporate types who bought film studios and failed in this same way?

As mentioned above, there is plenty of competition for talent. I see it all the time in these series. Let's face it, the acting can be pretty sketchy below a few name stars. Westworld is cool, but, I need more Hopkins and ED Harris on screen, because the other actors just aren't that great. Walking Dead, too. Bad acting.
Hey, maybe I can get a gig somewhere on cable! Call the Ferrari dealer, babe, we're going to roll big.

[MontuckyFried]

Well, this is sure an interesting development!
Justice Department appeals approval of AT&T-Time Warner deal: https://money.cnn.com/2018/07/12/med...eal/index.html

[Benny Profane]

Trump hates CNN.

[dunfree]

Well, this is sure an interesting development!
Justice Department appeals approval of AT&T-Time Warner deal: https://money.cnn.com/2018/07/12/med...eal/index.html

It's a political vendetta. Disney Fox got approved in record time and they are the only potential NetFlix competitor. The governments case is asinine in it's inanity.

[dunfree]

When Netflix, Hulu and Amazon start offering these people more money they are going to jump ship in droves.

they already did, and that's why HBO's dead. I loved most of the popular HBO shows (except Girls, fuck that trash). So many of the good shows came to ends far short of their potential. Deadwood. Rome. Luck. John from Cincy (yeah, I dug that show). It's equal to the shows that saw good ends - 6 feet under, the Sopranos, the Wire.

[SumJongGuy]

Well, this is sure an interesting development!
Justice Department appeals approval of AT&T-Time Warner deal: https://money.cnn.com/2018/07/12/med...eal/index.html

It's a political vendetta. Disney Fox got approved in record time and they are the only potential NetFlix competitor. The governments case is asinine in it's inanity.

It was in the works before that with the end of net neutrality. Expect cable companies and all internet service providers to throttle back data from competitors like NetFlix and Hulu. HBO's owned by AT$T/Time Warner. They're set up to rake it in now once they make sure everyone watching competitors gets shitty internet speed and random outages while HBO and premium cable is working fine, perhaps even better than ever since they can divert the resources away from the competitors over to their own program delivery

Another fun fact in all this.. Remember that Hitler Youth rally Trump had at the West Virginia Boy Scout conference round up last year? The CEO of BSA is also a high level CEO at AT$T and that's how Trump got that gig to the shock of a large number of the BSA organization. It wasn't approved through councils or anything. Happened because Trump asked to do it.. but not in exchange for special consideration and fast tracking of the big merger cough cough cough..

[dunfree]

Netflix had more emmy nominations than HBO this season, fyi.

[MontuckyFried]

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/...e-warner-case/

Man, I really hope this goes somewhere.

[Benny Profane]

Hey, maybe Trump or Sessions are HBO fans.

[MontuckyFried]

Hey, maybe Trump or Sessions are HBO fans.

Lol. Could be. Maybe they were cool with the merger, but then when that Stankey guy started running his mouth about how rough the changes were going to be for the folks at HBO, Trump was like "HEY! Wait a sec!"

Honestly, I wonder if they would've been able to get away with the merger more easily had they not jumped the gun on all their big announcements including hiking DirecTV prices right off the bat. But, hey! Gotta make those shareholders happy, right?! Sheesh.

Related; This made me laugh:

[Benny Profane]

I used to work for Time Warner, and never in my lifetime did I imagine that all of their premier brands would be destroyed so soon.

[fastfred]

very sad but don't doubt it

great shows
loving succession, wow
sharp edges is slightly disturbing
high maintenance is pretty f'n funny too

[bagtagley]

I'm looking at you, Arrested Development reboot

Did you watch past the first couple of episodes? It was a weird adjustment at first, and pretty slow, but I thought it came together really well in the end.