Justify atheism. Please

**Core Shot** · 06-08-2018, 10:06 PM

I don’t get the rampant militant atheism these days.

Agnosticism is the privilege and indulgence of youth, skepticism and rational thought. In my youth, it was the acceptance of not knowing.

In the last 10 or 20 years it seems all the people that would have been agnostic are now militant atheist.

Why?

As a self reflexive bag of water, a meat coated skeleton, an illogical higher order homeostatic freak of nature and violator of the laws of entropy, how can you be sure of anything?

More specifically, how can you be so cock sure there is nothing greater than you and your limited sense of energy density reality?

I’m not saying you should believe in anything, but why deny the existence of anything beyond your limited bizzare self?

**El Chupacabra** · 06-08-2018, 10:11 PM

PM Rontele.

**Game Over** · 06-08-2018, 10:11 PM

<- grabs popcorn

**BigDaddy** · 06-08-2018, 10:13 PM

I think that the the old guard religions are being exposed for what most of them are (and have been for centuries)... pyramid schemes or gentrified cults.

Not saying that they weren't based on some noble premise, but most have been bastardized and abused by those able to assume control.

That said, I rarely doubt anything, and realize we know next to nothing in this universe. I know enough to know that we have much to discover and there are definitely some things beyond our pay grade out there.

**jono** · 06-08-2018, 10:21 PM

A little faith can justify anything. It's the orthogonal vector to knowledge. Take what you know for sure, your justifiable belief, sum it all up in n-dimensions and let a little faith move a little sideways from the end. You can justify a belief in anything. Or not.

If the question is why? The answer is probably laziness. Probably.

**Core Shot** · 06-08-2018, 10:28 PM

Originally Posted by El Chupacabra

PM Rontele.

He replied that you will burn in hell for spilling your seed

Originally Posted by steepconcrete

<- grabs popcorn

Micro aggression bro. Popcorn is not kosher.

Originally Posted by BigDaddy

I think that the the old guard religions are being exposed for what most of them are (and have been for centuries)... pyramid schemes or gentrified cults.

Not saying that they weren't based on some noble premise, but most have been bastardized and abused by those able to assume control.

More sociopathic humans in control. Imagine Bobby stainless as pope.
Or president, wait, we already have Drumpf,

That said, I rarely doubt anything, and realize we know next to nothing in this universe. I know enough to know that we have much to discover and there are definitely some things beyond our pay grade out there.

Exactly.
Let’s party bro [/spicoli]

Seriously. Come visit.

**The Reverend Floater** · 06-08-2018, 10:49 PM

Whenever I start thinking about spirituality or the like, I find myself reading about quantum and astro physics via texts written for the layperson. I walk away with faith that there is a whole fucking lot we don't know and that the universe cannot possibly be neatly explained via theology or any humanized story or explanation of a higher power.

Like most of you, I'm an average dude with no background in anything physics related but I'm enthralled by the topic. Shit, 99.9% of people don't have any interest in the world around them, let alone the theories of universal expansion, astrophysics, etc. but I find a strange comfort in it all. Read Astrophysics for People in a Hurry.

In the end, not knowing is more comfortable for me than knowing. And people who say they know are generally suspect.

**XXX-er** · 06-08-2018, 11:04 PM

I've had 60 yard to sit on the fence so why not make up my fucking mind that I haven't seen any sign and I'm not likely to ?

**Mazderati** · 06-08-2018, 11:16 PM

I saw the sign and it opened up my eyes, I saw the sign. Life is demanding without understanding. I saw the sign and it opened up my eyes, I saw the sign. No one's gonna drag you up to get into the light where you belong. But where do you belong?

**carpathian** · 06-08-2018, 11:19 PM

As far as suspect responses go, here it goes:

I'm convinced we are in a 'quantum responsive universe'

The natives called prayer, the scientists describe it with Bells Thereom / double slit. Is it a wave or partical?

Am I having a thought and universe is responding or is the universe about to do something and I'm predicting?

Creating or clairvoyance

For example ; im biking down paved path the other day. I see a person way up ahead walking to me. At a certain distance I start to try and recognize their face (living in a small town and all) I come to the conclusion it is so and so...

I get close and see that it is complete stranger. 30 seconds later I see another person in far distance and think nothing of it. Get closer and see it is person I had thought of just before.

Happens all the time in a multitude of forms.

Years ago I wanted to buy a pen. I stood in the office supply aisle at store and looked at selection.

There were .99 and $3 and $5 and $7 or so.

I really liked the looks of the $7 one but being on a budget i figured id better be frugal and went with the $3 pen

The next day my buddy and I were pushing DH bikes up through forest on side of random mountain not near any trail.

I noticed thing on ground under leaves. It was exact same pen as $7 pen from day before but different color.

I yelled to my buddy all excited and ended up keeping pen for a few years.

**GeezerSteve** · 06-08-2018, 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by Core Shot

In the last 10 or 20 years it seems all the people that would have been agnostic are now militant atheist.

You're running with a very odd crowd. Most people with whom I spend significant time are non-believers, and none of them could be described as "militant atheists." To the contrary, their belief system is defined by their lack of certitude. OTOH, IME, the Christians are the militant ones. I've never met a non-believer who possessed blind certitude to the degree manifested by the 1,000 most religious people I've met. The burden of proof lies on the believers, not the non-believers. AFAICT, the charge of "militant atheist" is yet another myth propounded by Christians who insist on playing the victim.

**evdog** · 06-09-2018, 12:00 AM

Rampant militant atheism? Can't say I've witnessed that. Though maybe it exists in response to the militant conservatism that has arisen these last few years with its thinly veiled racism and bigotry.

I would probably be considered an atheist. I don't believe in god but that's mostly because I've never taken the time to think about whether there is a god or not. I really don't have the time.... I just focus on whatever goals I have or things that are going on in my life. As far as I'm concerned, it is all up to me.

Seems to me religion is too often used as a means to justify one's prejudices. I dated a girl for a while who turned out to be a born-again, and I got dragged to church for awhile. The church preached inclusion and love etc etc but ultimately rejected anything outside their accepted values. The pastor told the GF she shouldn't date me because I was not a believer. Had we not already been on the out and out things could come to blows with that asshole.

Guess I just don't understand how someone could blindly believe in the bible in this day and age. I can see it 2,000 years ago. The bible had a real purpose back then, using stories to teach what was basically a savage society how to behave morally. But the bible seems to have been hijacked for power and politics over the centuries and is now used to justify particular ideologies and hatred, and maintain power over people, more so than teach to teach love for all and morality.

**mcski** · 06-09-2018, 12:05 AM

42

**billyk** · 06-09-2018, 12:07 AM

Science.

Dinosaur bones, etc.

**carpathian** · 06-09-2018, 12:09 AM

432

**MTT** · 06-09-2018, 12:09 AM

I was going to quote a couple people here. but,

You ever been in real trouble ? Really jammed up and scared.?

I remember years back I crashed my motorcycle, 120 MPH and ended up in a ditch.
I looked up at the sky and said, "God please help me"
and I am an atheist?

What is real?

**grinch** · 06-09-2018, 12:15 AM

If there was a god Tammy Faye’s eye shadow wouldn’t have run

**Flyoverland Captive** · 06-09-2018, 01:33 AM

There’s nothing to justify. If there are gods, show me the evidence of their existence. It’s that simple.

**Diamond Joe** · 06-09-2018, 01:45 AM

You got it all figured out huh
Show me the evidence that God does not exist. "Its that simple"

Anyone who is certain that they know the truth, is a moron. The only thing we can be sure of, is that we don't know anything for certain

**Flyoverland Captive** · 06-09-2018, 01:48 AM

So you’re certain that the Flying Spaghetti Monster isn’t real? Then prove it doesn’t exist.

Or are you certain it’s not real, therefore making you a moron?

**Bobby Stainless** · 06-09-2018, 05:49 AM

Originally Posted by Core Shot

More sociopathic humans in control. Imagine Bobby stainless as pope.
Or president, wait, we already have Drumpf,

Im fine with controlling the Padded Room.

Occupying the metal real estate of you and many others feeds my ego. It nourishes me.

**Peruvian** · 06-09-2018, 06:01 AM

How many of the estimated 320 million God’s do you believe in? Why don’t you believe in them all? How can you be so cock sure the god you pray to is the true , real, and all knowing god?

**frorider** · 06-09-2018, 06:55 AM

Originally Posted by Flyoverland Captive

There’s nothing to justify. If there are gods, show me the evidence of their existence. It’s that simple.

This.

Asking Atheists to ‘justify’ their observation that thus far, deists haven’t proven the existence of their Gods is absurd.

I’ve observed no evidence suppprting the belief that trolls live under bridges. It’s up to the troll believers to show evidence. It’s not my job to set up video cameras under millions of bridges to prove a negative. There will always be one more bridge the troll believers will point to as a possible troll dwelling.

**jono** · 06-09-2018, 07:11 AM

It says something sad about our society that we seem to feel we have the right--seemingly the obligation--to presume that someone is responsible for proving everything. Is the plan that we're all going to agree or something? What kind of basic assumptions does that take?

The FSM construct, as an example, exists as an explicit capitulation to the logical fact that we can't prove a negative--but that won't stop us from arguing about it!

**DBdude** · 06-09-2018, 07:15 AM

Originally Posted by Core Shot

I don’t get the rampant militant atheism these days.

Agnosticism is the privilege and indulgence of youth, skepticism and rational thought. In my youth, it was the acceptance of not knowing.

In the last 10 or 20 years it seems all the people that would have been agnostic are now militant atheist.

Why?

As a self reflexive bag of water, a meat coated skeleton, an illogical higher order homeostatic freak of nature and violator of the laws of entropy, how can you be sure of anything?

More specifically, how can you be so cock sure there is nothing greater than you and your limited sense of energy density reality?

I’m not saying you should believe in anything, but why deny the existence of anything beyond your limited bizzare self?

i don't have faith... end of story. militantism, I don't know. I am not militant about it.