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  1. #51
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    i do not know how the legal issues will work out. however this article give good insight in to the accident.
    http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-no...limber_wa.html
    apparently the guy was going to snowboard the mountain and crampons with no ice axe. also first responders were trained rescue and medical people
    Last edited by BFD; 05-18-2018 at 01:33 AM.
    off your knees Louie

  2. #52
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    Mar 2006
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    Missoula, MT
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    There's still this sign at the Headwaters Lift that, among all the words, says something like "rescue may take some time." Because, well, rescue may take some time.
    SFOTEX, IDK what happened in your situation, but it was my understanding that even the courts understand that the first priority in a rescue is going about it safely. We can't have plaintiffs and defendants arguing about whether the weather and visibility was go/no go.
    Do people sue the Coast Guard for not getting rescued fast enough in the middle of a storm?

    Different situation, I know.


    And I wouldn't mind a huge payout from a certain air taxi in a certain state.
    No longer stuck.

    Quote Originally Posted by stuckathuntermtn View Post
    Just an uneducated guess.

  3. #53
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    Since when is the expectation of mountain climbers that a helicopter will definitely extract them from the upper reaches of a mountain within 3 hours?

    3-4 hours is pretty good response for extraction IMO

    That guy who called 911 didn’t exactly make it seem like it was an emergency. But the dispatch was fucked up too, where’d she get that a 60 year old was hurt from that first call?




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    Quote Originally Posted by Benny Profane View Post
    Keystone is fucking lame. But, deadly.

  4. #54
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    Feb 2008
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    Surprised the (obviously experienced) rescue crew is depending on 911 dispatch and doesn't have a direct line into the sheriff's office and other responding agencies. Or is that SOP to make sure it gets priority?

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by TBS View Post
    Correct


    My thought too. Life insurance co trying to weasel out of paying.

    From what I can see plaintiff is grasping at straws. Helo was dispatched 90min after first call. Those on the scene said they thought they could get the injured guy down on their own, then changed their mind. Don’t know why it took 2.7 hrs for helo to get there - aircraft must have not been at PDX base - but that seems the big delay.

    I’m also mystified about why routing the call to Tline patrol is a bad thing. They have cats that can get personnel & equipment to at least Silcox Hut, and farther if they can cross into wilderness during an emergency. That’s way faster than trying to deploy a PMR or Crag Rats team

    Here’s a helo rescue on Mt Hood gone wrong. The narrative is a little overwrought but it’s still one of those holy shit moments. And it illustrates the “suicide pact” Steve described upthread.

    http://pjmed.libsyn.com/65-civil-sar...-with-chief-cd
    Good podcast with one of the J's who had that Helo roll over him. Pretty crazy account of the whole rescue.

  6. #56
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    I am sorry this guy died and I feel for his family, but when you step off the ground to lead a rock climb, or venture on skis into the backcountry, or attempt to climb a mountain like Hood, you are taking your life in your own hands and willingly accepting the risk. Pisses me off when people try to cast blame just because shit went sideways. Nobody OWES you a mountain rescue, regardless of the circumstances.

  7. #57
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    May 2009
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    inpdx
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    rescue started on mt hood today
    not many details yet

    climber fell 200 ft, alive & breathing...hope they get him down safely

    https://www.kgw.com/article/news/loc.../283-558762745

  8. #58
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    Oct 2005
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    Sandy
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    Quote Originally Posted by acinpdx View Post
    rescue started on mt hood today
    not many details yet

    climber fell 200 ft, alive & breathing...hope they get him down safely

    https://www.kgw.com/article/news/loc.../283-558762745
    3 more yesterday...
    http://komonews.com/news/local/three...ll-at-hogsback
    When life gives you haters, make haterade.

  9. #59
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    inpdx
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    Seems to be helicopter season...

  10. #60
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    Dec 2004
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    Amherst, Mass.
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    And another one:
    July 13 rescue
    ... with an interesting twist.
    (Sure hope he didn't change his mind yet again after the rescue, otherwise all that effort would be for nothing!)
    For those stuck in the Northeast, check out the NE Rando Race Series and my avalanche course. (For other avalanche course providers anywhere, feel free to use any of my "homework" assignments for your own courses too.)

  11. #61
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    This has been happening year after year for decades. I have personally witnessed hundreds of roped climbers playing the mutual suicide game there. It's ridiculous. If this route were in Euroland and equally popular, somebody would nail in and maintain fixed protection at the fall prone area. I usually oppose fixed pro on glacier routes, but this is an exception because it gets so much use (IMO it's not a wilderness route) and the pressure of the crowds results in many (likely most) teams taking stupid risks that could be easily abated with running pro.

  12. #62
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    Jul 2016
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    Mostly the Elks, mostly.
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    As others have said here, ramifications for such a judgment would be huge. I also suspect this is an uphill battle for plaintiffs. But I'm no dentist.

    "particulars:
    (a) In failing timely request a helicopter to the fall site;
    (b) In failing to tell the climbers and rescuers to do a ground rescue;
    (c) In routing the calls on the mountain about plaintifr s rescue to improperly trained community services officer."

    my .02:

    (a) timely helicopter request:
    - the threshold for getting air ops approved is really high here. At first, even the people helping on scene (to include a doctor) did not know the seriousness of the injuries. Requesting a helicopter at that time of first call-in would have been neither reasonable nor approved.
    -From the filing, the first mention of a helicopter was made at 1137, and the Guard got the call at 1229. Ski patrol, rescue, the sheriffs office, and office of emergency management involved to varying degrees - 52 minutes to get through those layers of approval seems believable. Seems pretty decent, actually.


    (b) Failed to do a ground rescue:
    What about the '10 climbers who thought they could get him out' ...?Besides, Mountain Rescue guy 'Rocky Henderson' was on scene for most of this - who would have coordinated such a thing.

    Ground operations are probably why the first call routed to ski patrol - even though the guy wasn't skiing or in the resort area. Ski patrol here will often help with rescues/recoveries because it minimizes mobilization time. They have solid people, lifts, cats, sleds and trained medical staff. It's a huge asset to timely rescue capabilities anywhere near resorts. Happens here all the time.

    (c) routing calls to improperly trained staff: I seriously doubt this was the first rescue call to be routed to a community services officer. without knowing their SOP it's hard to say, but here I'm reading there are enough calls for help on Hood .. this couldn'ta been their first rodeo. And her actions don't seem unreasonable.

    Based on what I've read, I don't think anybody acted in such a way that they 'knew or reasonably should have known' that their actions would have caused this outcome.
    I don't believe anyone deliberately acted outside of agency policy.
    I don't believe anyone acted in bad faith or with deliberate indifference.

    OR will have some kind of qualified immunity for people and agencies involved based on that. Tort claim dismissed like Geezer said. Pretty easily I'd guess.

    Unfortunately people sometimes die waiting for help. It's a calculated and known risk we all take when we saddle up.
    Condolences to family and friends.

  13. #63
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    Jul 2016
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    Mostly the Elks, mostly.
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    Settled the $10M lawsuit for 25k.

    Maybe some mixed feelings, but I tend to wish the county didn't settle.

    https://www.oregonlive.com/news/2019/05/family-of-dead-mt-hood-climber-settles-lawsuit-over-delayed-helicopter-rescue-for-25000.html

  14. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by MiddleOfNight View Post
    Settled the $10M lawsuit for 25k.

    Maybe some mixed feelings, but I tend to wish the county didn't settle.

    https://www.oregonlive.com/news/2019/05/family-of-dead-mt-hood-climber-settles-lawsuit-over-delayed-helicopter-rescue-for-25000.html

    That makes two of us.

    No idea why people think they are entitled to a prompt heli rescue when they fuck up.

  15. #65
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    Dec 2002
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    I despise lawsuits of this nature (queue Scot Schmidt) but sounds like there were some blunders in their protocol if they in fact are responsible for some sort of rescue up there. Maybe this will help streamline procedures?

    "Jane Paulson, the Portland attorney representing Jenkins’ estate, said Jenkins’ family sued to determine what caused the delays and to prompt changes in the system.
    “This case has never been about money for the family,” Paulson said in an email. “Now that the county has agreed to make the necessary changes regarding how search and rescue operations are conducted, the family’s goal of making Mt. Hood safer for others is complete..."

  16. #66
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    May 2012
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    Kind of interesting if you read the entire article. In the settlement the county agreed to pay $5,000 to Portland Mountain Rescue and conduct a bunch interagency training to avoid delays in the future. Seems like an ok settlement to me.


    By Aimee Green | The Oregonian/OregonLive

    The family of a 32-year-old climber who died in 2017 after falling hundreds of feet down Mount Hood and then waiting hours for a helicopter rescue has settled a lawsuit against Clackamas County for $25,000.

    The family of John Thornton Jenkins had originally sought $10 million -- faulting the Clackamas County Sheriff’s Office and Clackamas County 911 for a series of missteps that the family’s lawsuit says contributed to a more than four-hour wait before Jenkins was rescued off the mountain.

    The suit had been scheduled to start trial Tuesday in Clackamas County Circuit Court, but a settlement was reached in recent weeks.

    Clackamas County Sheriff Craig Roberts told The Oregonian/OregonLive in a written statement this week that he hadn’t wanted the county to settle even if it was for “a nominal sum to avoid the costs of litigation.”

    “Death is an inherent risk any climber takes, especially in an environment as dangerous as Mt. Hood,” Roberts wrote. “I was surprised and deeply disappointed to be sued by the deceased’s family after our search and rescue teams made every effort to save Mr. Jenkins' life. Tragedy can happen without fault.”

    Roberts said the settlement “sets a troubling precedent for all Sheriff’s Offices required by law to conduct search-and-rescue operations in their counties.”

    Roberts offered his condolences to Jenkins’ family.

    The county, through its spokesman, also offered condolences.

    “This was a tragic accident and a reminder of the dangers of climbing Mount Hood or any of our iconic Cascade peaks,” said county spokesman Tim Heider.

    Jenkins, an experienced climber, tumbled about 600 feet from the area near the mountain’s summit at about 10:40 a.m. on May 7, 2017, according to the lawsuit and news reports at the time.

    The lawsuit states that eight minutes later, another climber reached Jenkins and called 911 for help, but an Oregon Army National Guard Black Hawk helicopter didn’t arrive until 3:11 p.m. As rescuers tried to secure Jenkins in a basket to lift him off the mountain, he stopped breathing, lost his pulse and ultimately was pronounced dead at Legacy Emanuel Medical Center in Portland, according to the suit and news reports.

    Mount Hood climber died after delays slowed rescue
    Man died just as helicopter arrived. Now, rescuers wonder what they could have done differently
    The lawsuit described an alleged bungled response to repeat calls for help -- stating that the first 911 caller was transferred by a dispatcher to the Sheriff’s Office, which told the caller to contact Timberline’s ski patrol. That’s even after being told Jenkins wasn’t a skier and had fallen outside the ski area, according to the lawsuit.

    The ski patrol called the county’s 911 center, which again transferred the call to the sheriff’s office, the suit states.

    The helicopter was requested about 1 hour and 40 minutes after the initial 911 call, and arrived 2 hours and 40 minutes later, according to a timeline laid out in the lawsuit.

    At approximately 11,239 feet, Mount Hood is Oregon’s most attempted climbing peak.

    The Oregonian/OregonLive wrote extensively about the fall and rescue attempt.
    The Oregonian/OregonLive wrote extensively about the fall and rescue attempt.
    Under the terms of the settlement, the county will make a $5,000 donation to Portland Mountain Rescue, a volunteer nonprofit search-and-rescue organization that responded to Jenkins’ fall. A team leader from the organization was by Jenkins’ side as he was loaded into the helicopter.

    The settlement agreement also calls for more training and refined communication procedures for the county’s emergency responders. Among those changes:

    -- Sometime in the next year, the sheriff’s office will hold a mountain search-and-rescue training conference dedicated to the memory of Jenkins. The conference will train the county’s team members, along with other groups that respond to calls for rescue on Mount Hood.

    -- Search and rescue coordinators with the sheriff’s office shall be “promptly notified” of all search and rescue calls for help in their service area.

    -- County officials will meet with the Oregon Office of Emergency Management, Portland Mountain Rescue, Timberline ski patrol and other groups to make sure everyone is familiar with “best practices” for requesting helicopter rescues on the mountain.

    -- The county will create a plaque in memory of Jenkins and place it somewhere on county property.

    Jenkins lived in Mukilteo, just north of Seattle. He is survived by his two parents, who live in Kansas.

    Jane Paulson, the Portland attorney representing Jenkins’ estate, said Jenkins’ family sued to determine what caused the delays and to prompt changes in the system.

    “This case has never been about money for the family,” Paulson said in an email. “Now that the county has agreed to make the necessary changes regarding how search and rescue operations are conducted, the family’s goal of making Mt. Hood safer for others is complete and is the best method for the family to honor the memory of their son.”

  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeezerSteve View Post
    This has been happening year after year for decades. I have personally witnessed hundreds of roped climbers playing the mutual suicide game there. It's ridiculous. If this route were in Euroland and equally popular, somebody would nail in and maintain fixed protection at the fall prone area. I usually oppose fixed pro on glacier routes, but this is an exception because it gets so much use (IMO it's not a wilderness route) and the pressure of the crowds results in many (likely most) teams taking stupid risks that could be easily abated with running pro.
    I saw a sobering video of people trying to ice-ax arrest a partner's crevasse fall. The guy trying to arrest the fall was backed up by a second rope on a fixed anchor. Without exception the arrester was unable to hold the fall and was caught by the fixed rope.
    It might make sense for a pair to stay roped without protection on an easy section to avoid having to unrope and rope up again on harder terrain but certainly not on terrain where there is any risk of fall.

    On the first ascent of the Matterhorn 4 were killed on the descent when 1 fell and dragged off the other 3. Whymper and the 2 guides survived because the rope broke between them and the 4 who died. Some people think the rope was cut.

  18. #68
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    May 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by old goat View Post
    I saw a sobering video of people trying to ice-ax arrest a partner's crevasse fall. The guy trying to arrest the fall was backed up by a second rope on a fixed anchor. Without exception the arrester was unable to hold the fall and was caught by the fixed rope.
    It might make sense for a pair to stay roped without protection on an easy section to avoid having to unrope and rope up again on harder terrain but certainly not on terrain where there is any risk of fall.

    On the first ascent of the Matterhorn 4 were killed on the descent when 1 fell and dragged off the other 3. Whymper and the 2 guides survived because the rope broke between them and the 4 who died. Some people think the rope was cut.
    Could you post the link? What angle slope this on? What was the snow surface like?

    I've done a handful of simulated partner arrests and one real one (the real one with knots in the rope) and with the friction of the rope over the lip of the crevasse I was very surprised at how easy it was to arrest and hold a partner, so I can only assume some different conditions caused the failed arrests you mention.

    Obviously on a really steep and icy slope all bets are off.

  19. #69
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    here's one. flat soft snow surface. On a firmer surface maybe better purchase with ice ax. On a steeper slope with belayer below victim gravity will help.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxArSDMsiQI

  20. #70
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    May 2010
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    163
    Quote Originally Posted by old goat View Post
    here's one. flat soft snow surface. On a firmer surface maybe better purchase with ice ax. On a steeper slope with belayer below victim gravity will help.]
    Thanks. Yea soft snow is a tough one for arrest of a partner. Knots in the rope might help, as might having some more room between the two (longer time to arrest the fall).

  21. #71
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    Apr 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by lazyasian View Post
    Thanks. Yea soft snow is a tough one for arrest of a partner. Knots in the rope might help, as might having some more room between the two (longer time to arrest the fall).
    ...and proper self-arrest technique, only guy who came close to catching the fall was the guy that had some decent technique 55 seconds into the video.

  22. #72
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    Dec 2008
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    cottonwood heights
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    Somethings weird up there

    Ski Resorsts usually have the Fastest connection to any local Heli rescue & some personal connections ,usually

    And, the 1st caller was super aloof about the call actually being an "emergency" ;his casual calm attitude was good for the Patient/ it did not help stress the importance of the call to the operator.
    ski paintingshttp://michael-cuozzo.fineartamerica.com" horror has a face; you must make a friend of horror...horror and moral terror.. are your friends...if not, they are enemies to be feared...the horror"....col Kurtz

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