Results 26 to 50 of 72
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05-17-2018, 12:01 PM #26
So, you believe that 911 call center should have full immunity if through it's obvious that its negligence or worse (gross negligence or recklessness) causes a 4-hour delay in responding to a duly reported traffic collision and an innocent traffic accident victim bleeds out as a result of the delay?
That's irrelevant. The issue here is duty of governmental entities, i.e., 911 call center and sheriff's office. That has nothing to do with the duties MV operators owe to each other.
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05-17-2018, 12:03 PM #27
I would think so, possibly the public duty doctrine aka special duty doctrine. Maybe an OR attorney can chime in. As I mentioned above, AFAIK OR does have a hard cap on personal injury damage claims against local governments, although I don't know whether that applies here.
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05-17-2018, 12:09 PM #28
Ya gotta figure 911 calls from Hood aren't a new thing, though. In or out of the ski areas. Someone should definitely be fired.
But there has to be some sort of discretionary immunity. Maybe that's why Officer Hide in the Bushes in Parkland, FL still gets a full pension.
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05-17-2018, 12:11 PM #29Registered User
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I agree with all of this. Unfortunately though - governments sometimes need to get kicked in the ass before they do anything. All the good intentions won't convince gov'ts to invest in properly training their people.
The way it is going here, all our dispatch will be going to Mumbai within 10 years.
Again, no idea if the dispatch was negligent or not, or if that negligence was the cause of the damages - just that if they can't get it together to dispatch properly on Mt. Hood - which I gather is fairly popular, what about more remote areas?
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05-17-2018, 12:20 PM #30
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05-17-2018, 01:13 PM #31Banned
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Delays aren't unusual on Hood, either. In the early 2000s Eric Pollard had to wait about the same period of time, after I believe patrol declined to rescue (he was out of bounds).
If someone was for instance intoxicated, which no reports suggest, discipline could in that case be warranted. But, confusion, and or a delay in rescue? It is what it is.
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05-17-2018, 01:37 PM #32Registered User
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From the complaint:
At 12:11 pm Portland Mountain Rescue told Clackamas County Sheriff's office that a helicopter was needed. At 12:29 pm Oregon office of Emergency Management called Oregon Army National Guard to request a helicopter.
Also part of the complaint is that the defendants didn't inform the rescue team that they should do a ground rescue - given the climber's condition (especially in retrospect), would a ground evac down over 4000 vertical feet really have been a good idea?
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05-17-2018, 01:51 PM #33
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05-17-2018, 02:02 PM #34
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05-17-2018, 02:38 PM #35Registered User
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I’ll probably get flak for saying this, but it feels to me like the family is trying to cash in on the death of their loved one, which I find distasteful.
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05-17-2018, 03:54 PM #36Banned
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05-17-2018, 04:07 PM #37guy who skis
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05-17-2018, 04:09 PM #38guy who skis
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Reminds me a little of one of the Columbine shooting lawsuits that survived a motion to dismiss; the basic argument was that because the police's approach at the time was to blockade the building and wait, a teacher bled out after the shooters had committed suicide.
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05-17-2018, 04:13 PM #39
Wow. 600 feet is like 50-60 stories. Even if it’s not shear vert, that’s a tough one to make it through, no?
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05-17-2018, 04:14 PM #40
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05-17-2018, 04:48 PM #41
You guys have a lot of legal opinions for dentists
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05-17-2018, 05:19 PM #42Registered User
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Dentists get sued a lot.
Mostly sexual stuff
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05-17-2018, 05:43 PM #43Registered User
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Looking at the time line actual time lost is about 45 minutes from the time the initial 911 call was made to T-line patrol connecting with Clackamas county, then requesting a helicopter. If you look at other real life rescue events 45 minute delays probably isn't too uncommon when working with multiple agencies and requiring mountain rescues. It's not like 911 dispatchers receive heli rescue requests frequently. A few judgments against agencies like this and they'll just say fuck it and tell people their on their own in the wilderness. Keep in mind every joker with a NF jacket and a REI card climbs Mt Hood in Oregon and considers themselves an experienced climber.
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05-17-2018, 07:08 PM #44
With a couple of ropes any climber can set up a lowering system on that terrain and at least start moving the injured towards help. In my own opinion climbers should know the basics of self evac and first aid as part of their basic skills. I also think most people don’t understand how 911 works once you are away from populated areas
“I have a responsibility to not be intimidated and bullied by low life losers who abuse what little power is granted to them as ski patrollers.”
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05-17-2018, 07:16 PM #45
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05-17-2018, 08:17 PM #46Registered User
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this^^ 911 will ask you for your address because 99% of the time they need an address to typ into a screen so if you give them A spot on A mountain or A river in the wilderness they haven't a clue
I was in an incident where the pilot was called directly and we got a really quick response and I know of another rescue where the guy definitely lived cuz they got ahold of a pilot and rescue tech directlyLee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know
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05-17-2018, 09:00 PM #47
I believe part of the problem is a lot of the software for 911 hasn’t caught up with current cellphone technology and the upgrades for these systems can be very costly any many systems like you say are based around street addresses and less so trying to pin point you on your phone and some of the dispatchers themselves are unfamiliar with response areas outside of city limits
“I have a responsibility to not be intimidated and bullied by low life losers who abuse what little power is granted to them as ski patrollers.”
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05-17-2018, 09:10 PM #48
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05-17-2018, 09:24 PM #49
Correct
My thought too. Life insurance co trying to weasel out of paying.
From what I can see plaintiff is grasping at straws. Helo was dispatched 90min after first call. Those on the scene said they thought they could get the injured guy down on their own, then changed their mind. Don’t know why it took 2.7 hrs for helo to get there - aircraft must have not been at PDX base - but that seems the big delay.
I’m also mystified about why routing the call to Tline patrol is a bad thing. They have cats that can get personnel & equipment to at least Silcox Hut, and farther if they can cross into wilderness during an emergency. That’s way faster than trying to deploy a PMR or Crag Rats team
Here’s a helo rescue on Mt Hood gone wrong. The narrative is a little overwrought but it’s still one of those holy shit moments. And it illustrates the “suicide pact” Steve described upthread.
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05-17-2018, 10:16 PM #50
Our team got sued in 2011 because we didn't find a body in a river fast enough:
"The failure to conduct the search in a proper manner resulted in his body not being found for some seven weeks, thereby prolonging the emotional pain and suffering of the plaintiffs"
https://www.ksl.com/?nid=960&sid=15973887
We spent a week on that fucking sewage pipe of a river with dive teams, sonar, people in zodiacs with probe poles, and multiple helicopters flying the shore. We had divers in the water in 30 mins, and grid poles up with in an hour of him going in. When I got out every day and got the pleasure of getting decontaminated by fire. Some people just suck.When life gives you haters, make haterade.
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