WTB: Binding Freedom / Quiver Killer stuff

**margotron** · 04-18-2018, 12:07 PM

Looking for:

Inserts
Drill bit

Screws: anyone have experience using standard M5 screws from the hardware store with loctite? I don't see why special screws are needed (except for those skinny screws on pivot 14 toes and STH toes)

Don't need the tap nor the tap tool. Got those. And I don't know what the debur tool is for but interested if someone explains.

**cbrady21** · 04-18-2018, 12:37 PM

pm sent.

**Toddball** · 04-18-2018, 01:01 PM

Originally Posted by margotron

Screws: anyone have experience using standard M5 screws from the hardware store with loctite? I don't see why special screws are needed (except for those skinny screws on pivot 14 toes and STH toes)

Special screws can be nice if you need a low-profile screw head, e.g. for the rear screws in a Tyrolia AAAttack heel or all the screws in a Rad 2.0 heel, all of which mount the heel track or baseplate to the ski. These screw heads need to be low enough for the heel to slide over them on the track. For other screws (e.g. toe screws on Rad 2.0) I use M5 socket-head cap screws, which work fine. Never used thread locker on mine, although I have found that the aforementioned toe screws were loose at one point in the first tour on them this season. Bring a multitool.

**margotron** · 04-18-2018, 01:42 PM

Originally Posted by Toddball

Special screws can be nice if you need a low-profile screw head, e.g. for the rear screws in a Tyrolia AAAttack heel or all the screws in a Rad 2.0 heel, all of which mount the heel track or baseplate to the ski. These screw heads need to be low enough for the heel to slide over them on the track. For other screws (e.g. toe screws on Rad 2.0) I use M5 socket-head cap screws, which work fine. Never used thread locker on mine, although I have found that the aforementioned toe screws were loose at one point in the first tour on them this season. Bring a multitool.

word. hadn't thought of the Rad 2.0 - useful because i'm about to mount up a set of those and is one reason i'm moving to inserts!

where did you get the special screws for Rad 2.0s? i assume you don't mean these? because they make flathead machine screws

http://www.bindingfreedom.com/pozi-f...vidual-screws/

**Toddball** · 04-18-2018, 02:17 PM

Originally Posted by margotron

word. hadn't thought of the Rad 2.0 - useful because i'm about to mount up a set of those and is one reason i'm moving to inserts!

where did you get the special screws for Rad 2.0s? i assume you don't mean these? because they make flathead machine screws

http://www.bindingfreedom.com/pozi-f...vidual-screws/

I did indeed buy them from Binding Freedom, although I think I bought the Pozi smallheads, not flatheads. Smallheads no longer exist except in 8mm length, apparently.

You can indeed just buy flathead machine screws if that's what you need. Only reason I didn't is that it's relatively difficult to find Pozi flathead metric machine screws at the local hardware store, and I like Pozi better than Phillips. Friends use Phillips with good results, though.

**Iluvmoguls** · 04-18-2018, 02:20 PM

I have found no complications from avoiding the debur tool.

**Lahar** · 04-18-2018, 02:24 PM

Stainless m5 hex head machine screws work fine, but the head can strip out if you over tighten.

If you have a bench grinder you can grind down the outer edge of the head to fit in a Solly driver toe.

Vibra-tite VC3 is the preferred thread lock that does not degrade plastic binding parts.

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**caruzo406** · 04-18-2018, 03:51 PM

what is the difference b/t the quiver killers and binding freedom?

**grinch** · 04-18-2018, 04:38 PM

Bf inserts have a slot to install with a flat head or bf notched driver
I like the posi drive screws best. I find the Phillips and Allen key heads are easier to strip and Allen keys aren’t as ez to install unless you have a driver with an Allen key bit. Posi drive has the best purchase/torque
Also I’ve been ordering the “vibratite” tubes from bf in place of loctite. Loctite will break down the plastics on your bindings(ruined a couple afd’s on my sth’s)

**margotron** · 04-18-2018, 06:34 PM

Originally Posted by grinch

Bf inserts have a slot to install with a flat head or bf notched driver

The point of that is mainly to uninstall, right? because you can install using any long M5 screw

I like the posi drive screws best. I find the Phillips and Allen key heads are easier to strip and Allen keys aren’t as ez to install unless you have a driver with an Allen key bit. Posi drive has the best purchase/torque

Agree Pozi are the best. But I like torx screws as well and I thinkkk those can be had in machine screws? Thanks on the vibratite tip. Just picked some up.

**sethschmautz** · 04-18-2018, 07:27 PM

Margo, you're in Montana, right? Where at?

I am probably in the minority here, but I think the Allen heads strip far less, are easier to get into tight binding locations, and lighter/smaller if you want to put a tool in your pack. I have never stripped an Allen head ever and have had troubles with the pozis. I have a ton of M5 screws of caring length and head profiles and would be happy to send some your way, but they are Allen heads.

I have installed inserts for radical 1.0s, radical 2.0s and Beast 14s. Before that I was using binding freedom shift plates. I like the bf inserts and topical buy them from slidewright as Terry is a fellow Mag. Let me know if you have any questions.

Seth

**FiveLarge** · 04-19-2018, 12:00 AM

I have some inserts and the install kit, all new. Bought awhile ago, doesn't seem like all ever use it at this rate. I'll work on posting up exactly what I have.

**margotron** · 04-19-2018, 08:12 AM

Originally Posted by sethschmautz

Margo, you're in Montana, right? Where at?

I am probably in the minority here, but I think the Allen heads strip far less, are easier to get into tight binding locations, and lighter/smaller if you want to put a tool in your pack. I have never stripped an Allen head ever and have had troubles with the pozis. I have a ton of M5 screws of caring length and head profiles and would be happy to send some your way, but they are Allen heads.

I have installed inserts for radical 1.0s, radical 2.0s and Beast 14s. Before that I was using binding freedom shift plates. I like the bf inserts and topical buy them from slidewright as Terry is a fellow Mag. Let me know if you have any questions.

Seth

Oh word. I should hit up slidewright then, I didn't know he sold that stuff!

And yessir, I'm in the Zoo (Missoula). How about you?

I have stripped Allens. Do you have a method of tightening that does not strip them? If I over-tighten (which of course means I already blew it), but they slip and the hole gets deformed into a circle and then i'm really screwed.

Originally Posted by spthomson

I have some inserts and the install kit, all new. Bought awhile ago, doesn't seem like all ever use it at this rate. I'll work on posting up exactly what I have.

PMd

**Iluvmoguls** · 04-19-2018, 08:47 AM

Originally Posted by caruzo406

what is the difference b/t the quiver killers and binding freedom?

Also, QK ripped off BF. BF is the real deal.

**sethschmautz** · 04-19-2018, 08:55 AM

It might be your tool. I originally bought my tool from Jon at Binding Freedom. It also might be that you are overtightening. Or, maybe it is the screws themselves.

It sounds like someone already recommended vibra-tite as loctite was damaging some binding plastic. Definitely use vibra-tite.

I got a bunch of screws originally from McMaster Carr, but have since bought some from Ace and Amazon. I didn't even know Ace carried them, but found some a few weeks ago.

When l swap bindings I apply the vibra-tite and let it cure for 30 min. Then, I line up the screws and inserts and tighten part way. As I am only swapping dynafit radicals and beasts, I make sure the toe piece (locked) is adjusted so the boot heel drops right into the right spot on the binding pins.

I then tighten all screws in a star pattern (ish). I tighten a few times to ensure that the screws aren't moving, but try not to overtightening. I once broke a set of speed radical heel posts by overtightening.

I have never stripped an Allen in this application. I do try to make sure that my Allen wrench is really Vertical, however.

Seth

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**sethschmautz** · 04-19-2018, 08:55 AM

Originally Posted by margotron

Oh word. I should hit up slidewright then, I didn't know he sold that stuff!

And yessir, I'm in the Zoo (Missoula). How about you?

I have stripped Allens. Do you have a method of tightening that does not strip them? If I over-tighten (which of course means I already blew it), but they slip and the hole gets deformed into a circle and then i'm really screwed.

PMd

In Kalispell.

**margotron** · 04-20-2018, 01:27 PM

Originally Posted by sethschmautz

In Kalispell.

Awesome! You guys had an awesome year. Next time I'm up that way ill shoot a PM and we can grab beers. Thanks for the tips - im gonna give them a try. Have some mounting to do over the weekend.

**sethschmautz** · 04-20-2018, 01:52 PM

Originally Posted by margotron

Awesome! You guys had an awesome year. Next time I'm up that way ill shoot a PM and we can grab beers. Thanks for the tips - im gonna give them a try. Have some mounting to do over the weekend.

Feel free to PM me if you run into any issues/questions while installing. I'll keep an eye on it over the weekend.

Seth

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**Skirotica** · 04-20-2018, 01:57 PM

a word about hardware store screws: i did. they worked. I was able to grind them down a bit too when i couldn't find small heads. But i can tell you they aren't as hard as the fasteners from binding freedom. I saw little bits of damage from phillips driver. probably not a short term consequence, but maybe you deal with a stripped head someday and you can't get the damn thing out with out an extractor. When the screws i needed came back in stock, i bought them from BF. They are more expensive than hardware screws, but i consider it a minor consequence. i do my best to keep 4 or 5 extra of everything in stock. i have not lost a screw yet. but i have tightened a few on the way uphill last couple of seasons.

**Skirotica** · 04-20-2018, 02:01 PM

I have an opinion about BF versus QC inserts. The QC insert tool is far superior to the slot driver on the BF. It also works on BF inserts. I bought one after years of frustration with the BF insert tool. THe QC will screw in and hold on the BF insert no problem. release the nuts and back it out no problem. Very happy with my hybrid strategy.

Also, grinding heads: if you don't have a bench grinder, a drill and a dremel work pretty well. Put the threads of the screw in the drill, run it as slow as you can, grind the screw head with the dremel. makes it nice and even.