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  1. #101
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
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    northern BC
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    17,393
    I'm gona go with a materials issue, some bad/wrong steel but thats just the toe thing

    not sure why along time alpine binding MFG can't make an alpine style heelpiece ?
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  2. #102
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    whistler
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    939
    I don't think so at all. I think the pins are made of a substandard metal. I am in no way qualified to offer up such an opinion so feel free to discard it.

    This has kind of always been the way with releasable tech anyways hasn't it? Vertical/rad1, ion etc etc all have some "elasticity" in the heel and a completely rigid toe. The kingpin just holds the heel down. If anything, I'd think your foot would move less as the heel connection is much more rigid.

  3. #103
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    whistler
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    939
    I think the heel piece is failing because the risers are connected to it. The torque from levering on them is wearing out the connection on the rails. That's just my WAY though.

  4. #104
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    42

    ANOTHER ONE BITES THE DUST - PART III

    Nyskirat,

    Not sure if you sent out the letter already or if you're still compiling data and pics; if it's the later, well here's some pics of my 3rd Kingpin failure.

    How it happened will be hard to believe, but this is it: I stepped in the binding this morning on my way for the first run of the day and felt a little weird wobble at the heel. I pulled back the heel piece - with my pole; not by stepping on it - and this happened (the best explanation so far seems to be plastic fatigue):

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20180417_083711.jpg 
Views:	153 
Size:	1.08 MB 
ID:	232633

    Click image for larger version. 

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Views:	163 
Size:	1,022.8 KB 
ID:	232634

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20180417_083738.jpg 
Views:	159 
Size:	1.02 MB 
ID:	232635
    Last edited by Bragelonne; 04-17-2018 at 05:18 PM.

  5. #105
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
    Posts
    17,393
    Quote Originally Posted by nickel View Post
    I think the heel piece is failing because the risers are connected to it. The torque from levering on them is wearing out the connection on the rails. That's just my WAY though.
    I hadnt thot of that but it could ^^ be a pretty good WAG !

    All the exploding dynafit heel pieces were all due to the skin up and so could the kingpin situation

    ergo the skiers who never use their lifters on Kingpin should not break heel pieces, but would still likely break pins ?!
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  6. #106
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    20sickness
    Posts
    485
    Do you need that part?

    Seriously though, wtf

  7. #107
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    voting in seattle
    Posts
    3,972

  8. #108
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Co
    Posts
    1,175
    Quote Originally Posted by nickel View Post
    I don't think so at all. I think the pins are made of a substandard metal. I am in no way qualified to offer up such an opinion so feel free to discard it.

    This has kind of always been the way with releasable tech anyways hasn't it? Vertical/rad1, ion etc etc all have some "elasticity" in the heel and a completely rigid toe. The kingpin just holds the heel down. If anything, I'd think your foot would move less as the heel connection is much more rigid.
    Or a manufacturing defect, possibly from the assembly process? Some of these sound like they are failing too quickly for even a pin made of dog shit.

  9. #109
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    1,399
    Metal... breaking? No way...

  10. #110
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    36
    Quote Originally Posted by nyskirat View Post
    It's not meant to be a letter to Marker, my mistake with the title.

    It's meant to go out to influential media players in the ski world. They can run it as-is or they can take the pictures and data and do what they'd like with it.

    Hopefully one or two of them actually bites and runs it.

    I imagine Newschoolers would. If they do, perhaps it starts spreading around the web and marker has to address it.

    I'll finally have time to work on it tonight/this weekend. A saddle sore is keeping me off the bike and I'll have nothing else to do.
    My first thought was NS as well.....might be the way to go to get the ball rolling. I know there are quite a few newschoolers on here including myself.

  11. #111
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    whistler
    Posts
    939
    Quote Originally Posted by Bragelonne View Post
    Nyskirat,

    Not sure if you sent out the letter already or if you're still compiling data and pics; if it's the later, well here's some pics of my 3rd Kingpin failure.

    How it happened will be hard to believe, but this is it: I stepped in the binding this morning on my way for the first run of the day and felt a little weird wobble at the heel. I pulled back the heel piece - with my pole; not by stepping on it - and this happened (the best explanation so far seems to be plastic fatigue):

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20180417_083711.jpg 
Views:	153 
Size:	1.08 MB 
ID:	232633

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20180417_083723.jpg 
Views:	163 
Size:	1,022.8 KB 
ID:	232634

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	20180417_083738.jpg 
Views:	159 
Size:	1.02 MB 
ID:	232635
    That's not likely to buff out. Congratulations on finding a new failure mode for the paper machť bindings.

    Quote Originally Posted by XavierD View Post
    A+

  12. #112
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    4,914
    I've been swamped with work and studying for graduate school exams but this is on my to-do list that is growing by the day.

    It hasn't been forgotten.

  13. #113
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Santa Cruz CA and Seattle
    Posts
    524
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	DSC_0020.JPG 
Views:	137 
Size:	312.3 KB 
ID:	233821

    Did this to two toe pieces in two months... only got one warrantied by the shop, once I broke the second they said sorry tough luck

    Both failed in tour mode either that day or the day after I had a long section of touring when i had to kick steps into a hard crust, 200 lb skier

  14. #114
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    Dec 2010
    Location
    whistler
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    939
    Go back and tell them tough luck, warranty your shit.

  15. #115
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    676
    Quote Originally Posted by nickel View Post
    Go back and tell them tough luck, warranty your shit.
    ^^ this.

  16. #116
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Sonoma & Truckee
    Posts
    11,211
    And start going to a different shop after that.

  17. #117
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    the Can-Utardia / LMCC VT
    Posts
    10,997
    Quote Originally Posted by nickel View Post
    Go back and tell them tough luck, warranty your shit.
    Are you the one that got a used pair for warranty replacement?

    Sent from my SM-G955U using TGR Forums mobile app
    Quote Originally Posted by Hohes View Post
    I couldn't give a fuck, but today I am procrastinating so TGR is my filler.
    Quote Originally Posted by skifishbum View Post
    faceshots are a powerful currency
    get paid

  18. #118
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Co
    Posts
    1,175
    Quote Originally Posted by LiveLarger View Post
    ^^ this.
    X3. Fuck that, talk about a shitty shop.

  19. #119
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    whistler
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    939
    Quote Originally Posted by My Pet Powder Goat View Post
    Are you the one that got a used pair for warranty replacement?

    Sent from my SM-G955U using TGR Forums mobile app
    I would make the biggest scene. I most certainly am not.

  20. #120
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    1,634
    Even though I seriously think everyone is over reacting and less then 5% (my guess, no proof behind this) of Kingpins are failing, I Just traded my Kingpin 13s for a pair of Dynafit TLT Speeds. A buddy ordered a few pairs of Speeds and they are too much for his GF so Iím getting the Speeds

  21. #121
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Co
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    Quote Originally Posted by skibrd View Post
    Even though I seriously think everyone is over reacting and less then 5% (my guess, no proof behind this) of Kingpins are failing, I Just traded my Kingpin 13s for a pair of Dynafit TLT Speeds. A buddy ordered a few pairs of Speeds and they are too much for his GF so Iím getting the Speeds
    If youíre right a 5% failure rate is huge for something that is safety related, affects the primary function of the binding and fails without warning. High severity, high probability of occurrence, low probability of detecting a pending failure. Hmmmm.

  22. #122
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    493
    Quote Originally Posted by skibrd View Post
    Even though I seriously think everyone is over reacting and less then 5% (my guess, no proof behind this) of Kingpins are failing, I Just traded my Kingpin 13s for a pair of Dynafit TLT Speeds. A buddy ordered a few pairs of Speeds and they are too much for his GF so Iím getting the Speeds
    5%.........jeeeez. Anything above, I dunno, 0,1% would be a fucking scandal. I don't think DIN would accept anything close to that either.

    Hi, we're Marker, and we guarantee our binding will get you home safely on 19 out of 20 tours

  23. #123
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    676
    Imagine being on top of some often skied no-fall zone. Eg Galcier rond, Comsmique Couloir, etc in Chamonix.

    "Hey, this binding has a 5% failure rate" That translate to "Hey, you have an added 5% chance of dying here" ..

    Sounds ok? uh?

  24. #124
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    whistler
    Posts
    939
    Quote Originally Posted by skibrd View Post
    Even though I seriously think everyone is over reacting and less then 5% (my guess, no proof behind this) of Kingpins are failing, I Just traded my Kingpin 13s for a pair of Dynafit TLT Speeds. A buddy ordered a few pairs of Speeds and they are too much for his GF so Iím getting the Speeds
    I suppose you're just as entitled to your opinion as I am.




















    My opinion is that you're an idiot.

  25. #125
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Den/Baltimore
    Posts
    5,136
    Quote Originally Posted by LiveLarger View Post
    Imagine being on top of some often skied no-fall zone. Eg Galcier rond, Comsmique Couloir, etc in Chamonix.

    "Hey, this binding has a 5% failure rate" That translate to "Hey, you have an added 5% chance of dying here" ..

    Sounds ok? uh?
    Exactly. Just got back from two weeks in Cham -- I saw lots of Dynafit, Plum, and ATK binders. The few Kingpins I saw were either on pro freeriders or (mostly) gapers. YMMV and those are obviously just anecdotal observations.
    "Alpine rock and steep, deep powder are what I seek, and I will always find solace there." - Bean Bowers

    photos

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