Talk Dampness

[swissiphic]

It's kinda spendy. But I could mail you some if you don't need a whole roll

Man, thanks for the offer...but i think if i'm gonna experiment, i'd have to go all the way...full roll option...but that latest Dynamat suggestion could be gold. I used to install car stereos, that stuff works well for noise reduction, damping... Why the hell didn't i think of that! great tip for an experiment.

[waxoff]

@MnO should have details on a tape used for developing the Swedish "Project Opinion" ski... They may just have glued strips normally used in the layup to the topsheet though.

Just adding weight also leads to interesting results.

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I tried a couple of those strips on the shovels of my Opinion LDE's. They sure filtered high frequencies on hardpack. At least I perceived the skis to be quieter on certain hardish surfaces. Unfortunately it did nothing to how they flexed.

[old goat]

If someone wants to play around with this they could try the lead tape golfs use on clubs. It didn't do shit for my putting but maybe it would help un-damp skis. You could put the tape on or take it off depending on conditions. The next step would be adjustable skis--manufacturers could make skis with removable tungsten inserts to change the weight and vibration frequency as desired. It might be the biggest thing since parabolic skis. We could call them hyperbolic skis.

[Banh Mi]

What is this all about?

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[geo039]

What is this all about?

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Something to stab you with

[sf]

If someone wants to play around with this they could try the lead tape golfs use on clubs. It didn't do shit for my putting but maybe it would help un-damp skis. You could put the tape on or take it off depending on conditions. The next step would be adjustable skis--manufacturers could make skis with removable tungsten inserts to change the weight and vibration frequency as desired. It might be the biggest thing since parabolic skis. We could call them hyperbolic skis.

This exists. Norwegian manufacturer EVI makes skis with removable weights

[swissiphic]

If someone wants to play around with this they could try the lead tape golfs use on clubs. It didn't do shit for my putting but maybe it would help un-damp skis. You could put the tape on or take it off depending on conditions. The next step would be adjustable skis--manufacturers could make skis with removable tungsten inserts to change the weight and vibration frequency as desired. It might be the biggest thing since parabolic skis. We could call them hyperbolic skis.

Still kinda think a full component style ski would be the ultimate platform for versatility. Tip extenders, tail extenders, stiffening/damping attachable to topsheet bolt on carbon fiber/alu/visco elastic sandwhich flex pattern modifying layers for different ski styles, weights of skiers, etc....

I've stepped into the personal ski mod game with amazing results and even with home d.i.y. techniques, it's totally doable and realistic.

We can put a man on the moon, we can send probes to Mars, we do weird shit with particle accerators and quantum physics.

I'm sure we can brainstorm the 'adjustable for all skier preferences ski' Start with a basic platform and add from there...like constructing a lunch sandwhich...you start with bread...

I'm convinced that's the future.

[splat]

Where does K2 Four piezoelectric damping fit in here? Profound game changer before its time? Mere gimmick? Cure for common cold? Some combination of the above?

I wouldn't doubt it if K2 eventually reincorporates pizeoelectric chips for use with carbon fiber. I believe it's been proven the discharge of a pizeo chip can reactively stiffen carbon fiber. In theory, it seems it might arrest vibrations as they happen but, in practice, it could lessen dampness if done incorrectly, I'm sure.

[bodywhomper]

Has this article already been posted? Is it still relevant?
http://www.sandv.com/downloads/0712foss.pdf

[old goat]

Still kinda think a full component style ski would be the ultimate platform for versatility. Tip extenders, tail extenders, stiffening/damping attachable to topsheet bolt on carbon fiber/alu/visco elastic sandwhich flex pattern modifying layers for different ski styles, weights of skiers, etc....

I've stepped into the personal ski mod game with amazing results and even with home d.i.y. techniques, it's totally doable and realistic.

We can put a man on the moon, we can send probes to Mars, we do weird shit with particle accerators and quantum physics.

I'm sure we can brainstorm the 'adjustable for all skier preferences ski' Start with a basic platform and add from there...like constructing a lunch sandwhich...you start with bread...

I'm convinced that's the future.

Could bring new dimensions to the term "yard sale".

On the general subject--it's amazing to me to see how much skis vibrate and deform and how little time they spend in contact with the snow when you see super slow motion video of speed events. It makes me appreciate how strong racers are; for me the most tired I get skiing is absorbing rough snow and that's obviously at much slower speeds.

[swissiphic]

Could bring new dimensions to the term "yard sale".

On the general subject--it's amazing to me to see how much skis vibrate and deform and how little time they spend in contact with the snow when you see super slow motion video of speed events. It makes me appreciate how strong racers are; for me the most tired I get skiing is absorbing rough snow and that's obviously at much slower speeds.

What you want for rough snow at human speeds is the softer heavy tip attachment, stiffer underfoot component and the 8 flex tail extension. And, add the visco elastic topsheet layer for a cadilac smooth ride.

Keep that ball of foot pressure right underneath ya so you don't get bucked around by stiff tips/shovels and have a bit of tail support to finish turns.

Component ski, Old Goat... dial in your ride.

[old goat]

What you want for rough snow at human speeds is the softer heavy tip attachment, stiffer underfoot component and the 8 flex tail extension. And, add the visco elastic topsheet layer for a cadilac smooth ride.

Keep that ball of foot pressure right underneath ya so you don't get bucked around by stiff tips/shovels and have a bit of tail support to finish turns.

Component ski, Old Goat... dial in your ride.

Need to dial in my skiing first, but I'm running out of time.

[Mudfoot]

"A 170 ski but when you attach weights it skis like a 185, 195 or 205."


https://books.google.com/books?id=NC...eights&f=false

[swissiphic]

Much more refined concept than the hockey pucks I was taping onto ski shovels/tips back in the mid 80's.

Wouldn't do much for deep powder like a true component ski where you can add a huge, fat, rockered tip and a pintail if you want to tweak for optimum bottomless performance based on personal preference...but yeah,f for hard chop, groomers, ice, etc... the added weights look like a cool concept. These days, i'd figure some Rossi like VAS-like damping plates with some weight would do the trick.

"In addition, the Duo also features an exaggerated tip flare that enables quick initiation of turns."

props for early rocker/tip splay to Fritzmeier!

[splat]

Has this article already been posted? Is it still relevant?
http://www.sandv.com/downloads/0712foss.pdf

Sure. They're saying you can add a vibrational sink to a ski that will help keep it torsionally stable like metal layers. I chased damp in a different but very similar way on the bros, essentially layering elastomeric rubber and metal in the tips, tails and, to a lesser degree, underfoot.

[bodywhomper]

Sure. They're saying you can add a vibrational sink to a ski that will help keep it torsionally stable like metal layers. I chased damp in a different but very similar way on the bros, essentially layering elastomeric rubber and metal in the tips, tails and, to a lesser degree, underfoot.

Thanks for the response. I see that Pete is using some sort of fancy (and likely expensive?) vibra-elastic stuff woven in his carbon fiber for damping. I assume one can get his skis with metal and that carbon stuff. Which would result it a totally dead ski?

That 3M adhesive stuff linked upthread seems similar to what's in that research article, right?

[old goat]

"A 170 ski but when you attach weights it skis like a 185, 195 or 205."


https://books.google.com/books?id=NC...eights&f=false

Funny how weird 1977 skis look to us now, and how normal the boots look.

[splat]

Thanks for the response. I see that Pete is using some sort of fancy (and likely expensive?) vibra-elastic stuff woven in his carbon fiber for damping. I assume one can get his skis with metal and that carbon stuff. Which would result it a totally dead ski?

That 3M adhesive stuff linked upthread seems similar to what's in that research article, right?

Pete uses countervale, it's an elastomeric rubber woven in the carbon or coating the carbon.
It's used on military aircraft. Beyond that, I know nothing.

[liv2ski]

Need to dial in my skiing first, but I'm running out of time.

I had to laugh, as that is how I feel too.

[bodywhomper]

Pete uses countervale, it's an elastomeric rubber woven in the carbon or coating the carbon.
It's used on military aircraft. Beyond that, I know nothing.

It sounds expensive....

I doubt he’d share much details, even with an old friend.

[Gepeto]

Just got done laughing hysterically...

No wait, I'm not done

Something to stab you with

[LeoK]

I don't know if this has been discussed as I kind of lost track of this thread. But there are some skis that are marketed as getting damper when you speed up or if you get more vibration. I can not find the blister link anymore but there sure was something about such things this season.

Anyways: What I wanted to talk about is that there might be an option for a cheap mod for the interested and skilled modifier. IN you kitchen out of corn starch powder and water you can mix a nonlinear fluid that develops significant resistance when shaken or stirred up but is absolutely fluid as water when not disturbed.

So did anyone try to mix it up in the right ratio and put it in some tube or balloon or whatever and tape it so their skis? Any effects?

[Beyond]

FWIW, the most successful damping designs by majors is just the opposite of adding weights to the tips. Think cutout tips in Fischer's racing line and all Kastle models, markedly thinned tips in Stockli, others, and lighter tip materials in Rossi's. Point is to reduce mass, inertia, so vibrations from initial impact decay faster. Suspect also mismatched with resonance frequencies.

[toast2266]

I don't know if this has been discussed as I kind of lost track of this thread. But there are some skis that are marketed as getting damper when you speed up or if you get more vibration. I can not find the blister link anymore but there sure was something about such things this season.

Sounds like the Renoun skis. I'm just talking about their marketing - I haven't actually skied them.

[LeoK]

Sounds like the Renoun skis. I'm just talking about their marketing - I haven't actually skied them.

Yes, thank you. Here the Blister page I referred to: http://blistergearreview.com/gear-re...n-endurance-98