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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    332

    School me. Need some advice on bindings.

    This year I grabbed my buddies skis that had some older Fritchi Freerides. Really starting to like earning my turns.

    Next year I want to do some more, get out a little more. Starting to think of ski set ups... I always get stuck on what bindings.

    I keep leaning towards frame bindings because I can use them in the resort and tour with them. Are these that bad of an option?
    #parentposse

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Gaperville, CO
    Posts
    3,838
    Frame bindings are a compromise. They weight a ton going up -- more than Freerides typically. At least the ones that ski well like Guardians.

    If you're serious about earning your turns you're gonna be on a tech setup in the near future. Salomon Shift is the next-year answer to double duty bindings.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    449
    Quote Originally Posted by eddiecut View Post
    This year I grabbed my buddies skis that had some older Fritchi Freerides. Really starting to like earning my turns.

    Next year I want to do some more, get out a little more. Starting to think of ski set ups... I always get stuck on what bindings.

    I keep leaning towards frame bindings because I can use them in the resort and tour with them. Are these that bad of an option?
    Assuming your have AT boots then for sure get the shift that is coming out in the fall. Basically is going to make frame bindings completely obsolete. Tech for the way up, regular alpine binding for the way down. Will be wayyyyyy lighter than a frame binding and should ski better with a lower stack height than something like a Duke.


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  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    whistler
    Posts
    998
    Welcome to ski touring, a world of compromises. It's up to you to figure out where on the compromise spectrum you'd like to sit.

    A few things of note: the comparative difference in uphill performance between frame vs pin bindings is light years.

    How much abuse in resort can be handled by pin bindings is limited by your weight and how aggressive you ski.

    If Salomon's new shift lives up to the hype and doesn't go through a first year product grenading cycle then it will likely be the beginning of the end for frame bindings.

    If your use is less than 50% touring then don't get pintech.

    Lastly, inserts for alpine bindings and pin bindings is a good way to get more mileage out of the same ski with limited compromise. The trade-off is that spur-of-the-moment excursions out of bounds are out. Trips must be premeditated.

    Good luck. If you legitimately enjoy touring, you will end up on some kind of pin tech at some point. Its just a question of when.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Tahoe City
    Posts
    632
    they are not that bad an option especially before you use a lighter kit that skis very well.

    Frame plus: one set up can work for a while and allow you to get out there and worry about getting tech binders AND TECH COMPATIBLE BOOTS later if you decide to do longer bigger days and want the lighter/more efficient kit (the big long days on the frames will just make you stronger ;-). If you are in traditional alpine boots with no tech fitting/no walk mode don't underestimate the change to a tech compatible boot, it can suck. A lot of people love them but a lot grin and bear it.

    frame minus: weight and efficiency
    Like I told my last wife, I never drive faster than I can see, besides it's all in the reflexes.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    449

    School me. Need some advice on bindings.

    If you do want to go the frame route and donít need a 16 din binding look into the Marker F12 Tour which is much lighter than something like a duke which is super heavy.


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    Last edited by PNW_Skier206; 03-27-2018 at 10:36 AM. Reason: Typos

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Eburg
    Posts
    12,909
    Get tech bindings and compatible boots, but do not buy first generation new technology tech bindings. Every year or two, a new tech binding hits the market, hyped by claims that it's the holy grail. Without exception, problems emerge, often catastrophic failures, e.g., toe pin shear failures, exploding top plates. Let others do the field testing of new bindings. Buy tech bindings with a reliable history of a couple years or more.

    There are numerous threads re selecting tech bindings. My favorite, Dynafit Speed Turn 2.0, happens to be inexpensive, lightweight and reliable. There are other good solid tech bindings. And there are lemons. Do the research.

    Happy touring

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
    Posts
    18,462
    Quote Originally Posted by eddiecut View Post
    This year I grabbed my buddies skis that had some older Fritchi Freerides. Really starting to like earning my turns.

    Next year I want to do some more, get out a little more. Starting to think of ski set ups... I always get stuck on what bindings.

    I keep leaning towards frame bindings because I can use them in the resort and tour with them. Are these that bad of an option?
    Its a good time to do more than think cuz spring & summer is the best time to buy a good used setup skis/binding/skins cuz people who need money want to get rid of stuff they don't reallt need so you can save > half off of list IME

    frame binding is a good start but be aware frame bindings need to be bought with the boot sole length in mind cuz they come in different sizes

    I got an FR+ setup but frankly its getting a bit long in the tooth, I have a couple pair of Marker Barons which I use at the hill and several tech setups for the BC but getting into Tech is probably better left for down the road when you know that you want to spend a lot of money to go for lighter gear, frame bindings end up weighing about twice as much as Tech but they have their uses

    SO I would look for a used ski/binding/skin setup in your size that is a couple of years old with a frame binding
    Last edited by XXX-er; 03-27-2018 at 11:49 AM.
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    332
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Burton View Post
    they are not that bad an option especially before you use a lighter kit that skis very well.

    Frame plus: one set up can work for a while and allow you to get out there and worry about getting tech binders AND TECH COMPATIBLE BOOTS later if you decide to do longer bigger days and want the lighter/more efficient kit (the big long days on the frames will just make you stronger ;-). If you are in traditional alpine boots with no tech fitting/no walk mode don't underestimate the change to a tech compatible boot, it can suck. A lot of people love them but a lot grin and bear it.

    frame minus: weight and efficiency
    This has been my thinking... I have the cochise boots right now with walk mode.
    #parentposse

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Missoula, MT
    Posts
    20,071
    I guess there's always inserts. And swiss cheese. Or maybe CAST.
    Guardians seem to ski like a normal, high end alpine binding. So they tour like shit. No flat mode = slow, fat stucky is even slower. Skins still look like new, if ya catch my drift.
    No longer stuck.

    Quote Originally Posted by stuckathuntermtn View Post
    Just an uneducated guess.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
    Posts
    18,462
    Quote Originally Posted by eddiecut View Post
    I have the cochise boots right now with walk mode.
    well that changes the advice one might give ... thanx for letting that slip out
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    whistler
    Posts
    998
    you already have tech boots. Get ions.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    581
    My first backcountry setup was an old frame setup I bought off CL that toured like a set of boat anchors.

    When I was looking to upgrade I was shopping a local shop that has a good reputation and a fair amount of consignment gear. When I mentioned that I was shopping for a touring setup and was leaning towards a frame bindings, his questions were (1) do you huck cliffs? No. (2) Are you doing over 50% of your skiing on these skis inbounds? No. "Then you should be on a tech binding."

    He was right. If you're foot isn't lifting a frame with every step, the difference in weight in-motion is going to be worth a full lap of skiing on a "standard" day of touring.

    As others have said, there are compromises to deal with. But if you hunt for one you can get a touring setup (tech bindings, skis, skins) for $500 or so. Unless you're super strapped for cash, spring for a touring setup and an inbounds setup.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
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    ID
    Posts
    736
    Quote Originally Posted by nickel View Post
    you already have tech boots. Get ions.
    Why do you recommend Ions?


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  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    voting in seattle
    Posts
    4,160
    IMO, a tecton and the new Shift both ski better than any frame binding. Durability for daily abuse in a resort is less sure. I have never been impressed by the durability of the Duke, Freeride, Ambition, Adrenaline, or even Guardian. While they don’t hold up as well as a P18 or STH16, they do seem to last longer than tech bindings.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Missoula, MT
    Posts
    20,071
    WTF are you doing to your Guardians?!
    No longer stuck.

    Quote Originally Posted by stuckathuntermtn View Post
    Just an uneducated guess.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    whistler
    Posts
    998
    Quote Originally Posted by hafjell View Post
    Why do you recommend Ions?


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    Proven track record of durability. Strong toe clamping force. Not the most modern or feature laden but also not bare bones.

    I want to want tecton but after getting burned on my 2016 kingpins, I'm thinking one year might not be enough for new product teething issues to show themselves. I certainly won't be jumping on the shift bandwagon even though the concept is appealing.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Posts
    727
    Quote Originally Posted by PNW_Skier206 View Post
    If you do want to go the frame route and don’t need a 16 din binding look into the Marker F12 Tour which is much lighter than something like a duke which is super heavy.


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    Interesting....still fairly heavy, but 1.5 lb lighter than the Duke.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    600
    I have some Dukeís on a pair of skis that I donít really like or ski that often. Iím considering mounting them on some unmounted 4FRNT Hojis. Theyíd be a 95% resort or mech assisted ski, but want to have the option for a 30 minute skin.

    Bad idea? Just buy some shifts? CAST system, jong?

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    in the trench
    Posts
    9,470
    Yes, id sell the skis/dukes complete and invest in CAST or pinding for an 80/20 ski. Drilling fresh hojis with dukes seems like desecration. CAST and pinding are bofh ligter than dukes and will feel half the weight because of the pivot placement of pin tech. Plus theyll ski way better than dukes and be safer. Embrace the dildo!

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  21. #21
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    600
    Quote Originally Posted by grinch View Post
    Yes, id sell the skis/dukes complete and invest in CAST or pinding for an 80/20 ski. Drilling fresh hojis with dukes seems like desecration. CAST and pinding are bofh ligter than dukes and will feel half the weight because of the pivot placement of pin tech. Plus theyll ski way better than dukes and be safer. Embrace the dildo!
    Dammit. I know deep inside you're right. Was hoping to save some $$$.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    306
    Quote Originally Posted by gnarbro365 View Post
    I have some Dukeís on a pair of skis that I donít really like or ski that often. Iím considering mounting them on some unmounted 4FRNT Hojis. Theyíd be a 95% resort or mech assisted ski, but want to have the option for a 30 minute skin.

    Bad idea? Just buy some shifts? CAST system, jong?
    Another way of looking at it, besides what you'll end up putting on the Hoji's; With a different pair of binders on the skis that you don't like with the Dukes, there's a chance you might start liking them...

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Stumptown
    Posts
    5,871
    I would have a hard time putting dukes on anything. I think sell them and buy some shifts. Would be a great combo with the HOJI

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    600
    It sounds like my real problem is finding anyone who wants to buy Dukes.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    in the trench
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    9,470
    Quote Originally Posted by gnarbro365 View Post
    Dammit. I know deep inside you're right. Was hoping to save some $$$.
    Sorry. Maybe youll get some good coin for the current duke setup

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