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  1. #251
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    Quote Originally Posted by iceman View Post
    Little theory of mine: SDC's will reinvigorate the outer suburbs.

    a counter force to the rampant urbanism, right at the time millenials are having kids, Assuming it's rolled out in say 2-4 years.
    Fuck that. That's where I bike.

  2. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by neufox47 View Post
    As complete adoption in urban areas is the only way we are solving traffic.
    That'd only "solve traffic" if it effects great changes in human movement patterns. As long as the pattern doesn't change, traffic won't. See how introduction of Uber etc. has increased traffic in NYC because there's more vehicles doing nothing on the road but looking for people to drive around better coordinating there movements (self driving) won't change the underlying problem of too many cars. And too many cars is the fatal flaw in the Musk/Silicon Valley prosperity gospel of self-driving EVs for everyone - there just isn't enough room. Or money to fund it.

  3. #253
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benny Profane View Post
    Fuck that. That's where I bike.
    Well at least you won't get run over. Probably.

  4. #254
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    But yeah I'm bullish on long-term real estate values in the exurbs for sure. Because of SDC's and internet everywhere. You can have a meeting and nobody knows where the fuck you are. That's exactly what got me in on pagers (yeah, dating myself) and car phones and then cell phones. It will happen.

  5. #255
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    I personally have driven one-eyed on way too many country roads. Happy to hand that chore off.

  6. #256
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    27 yr old girl texting hits a cement truck head on. 74 yr old dude dumps it into the river.

    this is in the middle of nowhere, w 8 foot shoulder lanes.

    i would have ran her the fuck over, call me callous.

    pics to follow..

  7. #257
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    Woman killed by self-driving Uber car

    Quote Originally Posted by dunfree View Post
    That'd only "solve traffic" if it effects great changes in human movement patterns. As long as the pattern doesn't change, traffic won't. See how introduction of Uber etc. has increased traffic in NYC because there's more vehicles doing nothing on the road but looking for people to drive around better coordinating there movements (self driving) won't change the underlying problem of too many cars. And too many cars is the fatal flaw in the Musk/Silicon Valley prosperity gospel of self-driving EVs for everyone - there just isn't enough room. Or money to fund it.
    When self driving cars are completely adopted in areas, you no longer need stop lights or any complete stops, ever. The highway always moves at top speed and no asshole decides to slam on his brakes and cut over at the last minute, stopping and slowing traffic for miles sometimes. Next time you are in 5mph traffic on the expressway note how many cars per lane per minute pass a given point. Then do the same when traffic is heavy but moving fast.

    Our current roads could handle multiples of current capacity if all cars are operating via a centrally controlled / intelligent system. It’s not hard to imagine. Cars bunch into packets of 4-8 cars and alternate passing through an intersection from different directions while barely slowing. Or even, when a light turns green all the cars start moving at the same time.

    Making self driving cars drive with other human drivers is more difficult than if all cars were self driving.

  8. #258
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    exactly. it's all or nothing. i'm 100% fine w all in. that's a big upgrade though. like burying telephone poles.

  9. #259
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    try to get a hemi cuda to behave.

  10. #260
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    Quote Originally Posted by neufox47 View Post
    When self driving cars are completely adopted in areas, you no longer need stop lights or any complete stops, ever. The highway always moves at top speed and no asshole decides to slam on his brakes and cut over at the last minute, stopping and slowing traffic for miles sometimes. Next time you are in 5mph traffic on the expressway note how many cars per lane per minute pass a given point. Then do the same when traffic is heavy but moving fast.

    Our current roads could handle multiples of current capacity if all cars are operating via a centrally controlled / intelligent system. It’s not hard to imagine. Cars bunch into packets of 4-8 cars and alternate passing through an intersection from different directions while barely slowing. Or even, when a light turns green all the cars start moving at the same time.

    Making self driving cars drive with other human drivers is more difficult than if all cars were self driving.
    We don't have the money to fill potholes.
    Lots of countries have bullet trains. Why don't we? California has been trying to build one for decades and getting nowhere.
    We have the technology to have flying cars. Why don't we? f
    Our trains keep crashing into each other because nobody has installed the accident avoidance systems the feds mandated years ago.
    The US deficit for 2020 is projected at 1.1 trillion.
    Last edited by old goat; 07-24-2019 at 09:00 AM.

  11. #261
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    Quote Originally Posted by byates1 View Post
    exactly. it's all or nothing. i'm 100% fine w all in. that's a big upgrade though. like burying telephone poles.
    Telephone poles buried in the ground is interesting. Do you take the wires off first?
    watch out for snakes

  12. #262
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    Quote Originally Posted by old goat View Post
    We don't have the money to fill potholes.
    Lots of countries have bullet trains. Why don't we? California has been trying to build one for decades and getting nowhere.
    We have the technology to have flying cars. Why don't we? f
    Our trains keep crashing into each other because nobody has installed the accident avoidance systems the feds mandated years ago.
    The US deficit for 2020 is projected at 1.1 trillion.
    Centrally controlled self driving cars should not cost anything close to what a national high speed rail system would. It uses existing infrastructure and new cars. Same roads, just makes them way more efficient.

  13. #263
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    Quote Originally Posted by neufox47 View Post
    Centrally controlled self driving cars should not cost anything close to what a national high speed rail system would. It uses existing infrastructure and new cars. Same roads, just makes them way more efficient.
    What about the potholes?
    At the moment they can't keep the lane lines painted around here.
    I haven't read this yet but it looks interesting.
    https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2...term=TNY_Daily

    SDC's aren't the high tech outside the box solution. Getting rid of cars is.

  14. #264
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    Quote Originally Posted by neufox47 View Post
    Centrally controlled self driving cars should not cost anything close to what a national high speed rail system would. It uses existing infrastructure and new cars. Same roads, just makes them way more efficient.

    So why ain’t the Chinese doing that then? Seems they’d be all into that their centrally controlled type of crap.

  15. #265
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    Quote Originally Posted by old goat View Post
    What about the potholes?
    At the moment they can't keep the lane lines painted around here.
    I haven't read this yet but it looks interesting.
    https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2...term=TNY_Daily

    SDC's aren't the high tech outside the box solution. Getting rid of cars is.
    Get rid of cars and replace them with...?

    I don’t see Americans eschewing the convenience of a individual vehicle anytime soon. I admit teleportation is a more attractive solution but it seems to be quite a bit more difficult to implement.

  16. #266
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    Quote Originally Posted by m2711c View Post
    So why ain’t the Chinese doing that then? Seems they’d be all into that their centrally controlled type of crap.
    they've got all kinds of smaller city EVs that are selling fast.

    people won't give up cars they'll get the traffic they deserve.

  17. #267
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    Paris, London, Barcelona and Stuttgart have announced plans to ban all combustion vehicles in those cities by 2030. Other major cities, even in 'Merica, are likely to follow suit. It would not be a big leap from there to ban all human-operated vehicles.

  18. #268
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    likelihood of a ban on ICE cars in any 'murican city is near zero. We can't even get congestion pricing passed or any minimal restrictions on vehicle movement. I think selfdriving/remote vehicle operation will occur on highways first with the caveat that there's a huge seasonality issue. Humans have trouble in snow/ice/rain - how long will it take to program computers to deal with that?

  19. #269
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    Quote Originally Posted by dunfree View Post
    Humans have trouble in snow/ice/rain - how long will it take to program computers to deal with that?
    The basics are simple--slow down, increase braking distance, modulate power delivery. But, yeah, it will probably take awhile. Humans are not going to get better at it, though. Even if the computers only get 1-2% better every year they'll be better than the humans in no time.

  20. #270
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    heh.

    I was thinking more along the lines of semi-trucks - like Starsky which is testing "autonomous" trucks with a driver remotely operating the tough parts - https://www.freightwaves.com/news/st...lorida-highway and the snow/ice is "driving through a blizzard" or "glare ice" or things where whatever sensor suite willl have to do a bit more work.

  21. #271
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    Just a thought on how fuel is taxed and now people will be charging their cars at home. Will electricity become so unaffordable (I know it's already expensive in Europe) because the government will have to make up the difference?
    So what the alternative. Use only charging stations so the tax will only be paid by users ? Don't think that will be realistic unless a vehicle can fully charge in 5 minutes.
    It will be interesting if becomes a total FUBAR because of trying to change something too fast when the technology isn't there yet.
    riser4 - Ignore me! Please!

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  22. #272
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    Quote Originally Posted by SB View Post
    Telephone poles buried in the ground is interesting. Do you take the wires off first?
    no. you hire and pay both government and private company's to do it. that way it costs a lot more.

  23. #273
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    Quote Originally Posted by dunfree View Post
    <snip> with the caveat that there's a huge seasonality issue. Humans have trouble in snow/ice/rain - how long will it take to program computers to deal with that?
    I dunno - but they are doing some *crazy* shit with autonomous RC cars:


  24. #274
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    The DARPA Challenge was won 14 years ago for off-road autonomy; the dynamics are easy compared to the whole "other drivers" thing. But inclement weather is still a problem for knowing exactly where you are and which way the road is pointed without infrastructure changes.
    At which point steel rails are pretty cheap and offer nice maintenance and efficiency advantages.

    If they can breakup AT&T why not BNSF? Think of the thread we could have if every railroad had a bike lane. The mind boggles!

  25. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by skaredshtles View Post
    I dunno - but they are doing some *crazy* shit with autonomous RC cars:

    Too much nerd.

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