Opinions on the Ski Visions base flattener???

[gregorys]

Sweet idea!

Some concern about the magnets.
I'm no expert on the subject matter, but I've heard quite a number of discussions that the magnets will gather the swarf onto the file and it will be hard to remove - because the file itself will be magnetized.

Though it's hard to argue with a successful outcome. So, if it works long-term for you, it's probably a theoretical concern, not a real-life one. I just know I've heard it mentioned often when talking about magnets and tools. (And marble, music-playing machines.)

IMO, the "plane" carrier will make using the tool to really flatten the base way more consistent, and less likely to add bevel to the edges (unintentionally), or otherwise do unintended damage to the base. Plus it's going to be easier to use than just a plain file, IMO.

[XXX-er]

I like that, so obviuosly the slot you routered into the flat piece is a little shallower than the thickness of the file ?

so how much of the file sticks up above the bottom of the hickory ??

[Meadow Skipper]

I really like the flattener and wanted to get the file tool, however, Mark from Ski Visions doesn't seem very confident that the file tool will be available any time soon.
I went ahead and made my own version. I just routered a groove in a piece of hickory I had (very hard wood so it will remain flat) and epoxied a couple magnets in place to hold the file.

Attachment 313210

Attachment 313211

Attachment 313212

Attachment 313213

It works pretty well, especially dealing with edge-high issues. I run it over the entire base first and use the flattener tool after I'm sure the edges are level with the base. This should also save a lot of wear on the flat steel cutter.

FKNA!

[Alpinord]

It works pretty well, especially dealing with edge-high issues. I run it over the entire base first and use the flattener tool after I'm sure the edges are level with the base. This should also save a lot of wear on the flat steel cutter.

One tweak you might consider is a shorter 'knob' across the base so your palm is laying over the file:



With another in the back, you can use two hands like a carpenter's plane.

[Roxtar]

Sweet idea!

Some concern about the magnets.
I'm no expert on the subject matter, but I've heard quite a number of discussions that the magnets will gather the swarf onto the file and it will be hard to remove - because the file itself will be magnetized.

Though it's hard to argue with a successful outcome. So, if it works long-term for you, it's probably a theoretical concern, not a real-life one. I just know I've heard it mentioned often when talking about magnets and tools. (And marble, music-playing machines.)

IMO, the "plane" carrier will make using the tool to really flatten the base way more consistent, and less likely to add bevel to the edges (unintentionally), or otherwise do unintended damage to the base. Plus it's going to be easier to use than just a plain file, IMO.

Yeah, I can see that happening. I really just stole the idea from the SkiVisions tool. Pretty sure that's what they used. I just use a file brush to swipe it and I havent had any issues with build-up yet.

I like that, so obviuosly the slot you routered into the flat piece is a little shallower than the thickness of the file ?

so how much of the file sticks up above the bottom of the hickory ??

The file ends up about a 1/16" higher than the base

[Roxtar]

One tweak you might consider is a shorter 'knob' across the base so your palm is laying over the file:



With another in the back, you can use two hands like a carpenter's plane.

Good idea,
Thanks

[Alpinord]

I started this thread regarding a new development regarding the Ski Visions File Flattener.

[singlesline]

Does anyone actually notice a difference between the more linear structure provided by this tool and something like a crosshatch pattern from a stone grind?

I like to take care of my skis myself, and I've had bad experiences with careless stone grinds in the past.

Seems like this tool would let me take care of flattening and structuring myself and would give me a way more pro-looking finish on ptex repairs.

[Alpinord]

Does anyone actually notice a difference between the more linear structure provided by this tool and something like a crosshatch pattern from a stone grind?

I like to take care of my skis myself, and I've had bad experiences with careless stone grinds in the past.

Seems like this tool would let me take care of flattening and structuring myself and would give me a way more pro-looking finish on ptex repairs.

IMO, you can 'cross hatch/swirl' with the tool if you want to experiment. Just be careful about nailing the edges with the stones.

All of my ski bases have not been ground in over 15 years and their performance have not disappointed me. YMMV

[gregorys]

IMO, you can 'cross hatch/swirl' with the tool if you want to experiment. Just be careful about nailing the edges with the stones.

All of my ski bases have not been ground in over 15 years and their performance have not disappointed me. YMMV

+1

I usually use sandpaper around a 1.5 or 2" thick-wall PVC pipe - but yeah, I'm too cheap to do regular base-grinds on my skis. I'd be pretty shocked if any mere mortal could tell a difference between that and a fancy base-grind, in a blind test. And since I don't think there's any real performance justification, why waste the time and money on a base grind, just to get a dubious performance benefit?

Just the time savings of not having to drive them to a shop and pick them up is a big bonus.

Yes, I'd be modestly unsurprised if Mikaela Shiffrin or Bode Miller or some top level skier on a race-course could tell, given the right limitations of variables. But for even high-level skiers (like people here), in wildly varying conditions - I don't think it's likely.

In either case, (if it's noticeable or not) like Terry, I've been happy with the results. So, yeah, I think the SV tool (which I have) or something like I do works well enough - and I'd do what makes sense for you, and I think you'll find it works just fine.

But if you want to base-grind, I'm not going to grind my gears about it. You do you.

[Alpinord]

+1

I usually use sandpaper around a 1.5 or 2" thick-wall PVC pipe - but yeah, I'm too cheap to do regular base-grinds on my skis. I'd be pretty shocked if any mere mortal could tell a difference between that and a fancy base-grind, in a blind test. And since I don't think there's any real performance justification, why waste the time and money on a base grind, just to get a dubious performance benefit?

Just the time savings of not having to drive them to a shop and pick them up is a big bonus.

Are you using aluminum oxide sandpaper or silicone carbide? I believe the SC paper cuts cleaner with few ‘hairies’.

Here are a couple images from 2 different skis with a combination of original structure, SkiVisions stones and silicone carbide. One has a little cross hatching:









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[singlesline]

Those bases look fantastic to me!

Will be giving the tool a try for sure.

[El Chupacabra]

Anyone use this tool for addressing base burn (white edges) caused by icy snow?

I have the Ski Visions tool and several skis that need base attention. Thought I might try it and see if it helps.

[Alpinord]

Anyone use this tool for addressing base burn (white edges) caused by icy snow?

I have the Ski Visions tool and several skis that need base attention. Thought I might try it and see if it helps.

It's been a while since I watched Mark's SkiVisions videos, but either there or in a discussion he addresses 'refreshing the bases periodically' to deal with issues like base burn, 'battle scars' & restructuring. Skim a little with the steel blade and then restructure with the stone, wax, scrape & brush.

[bodywhomper]

Doesn’t he suggest refreshing the bases after every day or two of skiing and not waxing?

I tried this last season on my work skis. It seemed to worked well for me except in sticky snow or spring slush, with the medium grit stone.

[anotherVTskibum]

With race skis on hard snow and regular tuning, refreshing the bases periodically is necessary to keep them flat. For skis without damage, it's a necessary evil (skis generally get faster the more wax and brush cycles since the last grind, so long as they are still flat).

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[Alpinord]

Those bases look fantastic to me!

Will be giving the tool a try for sure.

Aesthetics may be different than performance. Those bases literally sucked today in transforming, wet/slurpy & gritty snow. Time to break out the coarse stone and sandpaper for a very aggressive structure, with graphite and yellow wax over purple.

[Alpinord]

Doesn’t he suggest refreshing the bases after every day or two of skiing and not waxing?

I tried this last season on my work skis. It seemed to worked well for me except in sticky snow or spring slush, with the medium grit stone.

I think he does say that, but I don't have the time to do it that frequently and my head would explode if I didn't wax. Having said that, for wet snow, the structure is the most important step to break the suction and allow channeling of water. Without it, the wax may do nothing. Manky/slurpy/mash potato snow is tough to mange even with aggressive structure IME.

[El Chupacabra]

It's been a while since I watched Mark's SkiVisions videos, but either there or in a discussion he addresses 'refreshing the bases periodically' to deal with issues like base burn, 'battle scars' & restructuring. Skim a little with the steel blade and then restructure with the stone, wax, scrape & brush.

Thanks - I'll give it a try in the next couple of days and see how it does.

[dcpnz]

Alpinord and gregorys

What grit silicon carbide paper are you using?

Looks fairly fine in Alpinords pics above, wondering if coarser might be better in current spring slop.

[Alpinord]

Alpinord and gregorys

What grit silicon carbide paper are you using?

Looks fairly fine in Alpinords pics above, wondering if coarser might be better in current spring slop.

Absolutely, coarser would be better and don’t be shy.

I just banged out a 3d sanding block for my planer to test that idea. In 5-10 minutes, using 150 & 60 grit, coarse stone, followed by the steel blade to smooth out any ‘hairies’ and high points, I’m currently here and thinking coarser still based on past success.














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[bodywhomper]

Is that sandblock thing 3D printed? That’s pretty rad!!

I think he does say that, but I don't have the time to do it that frequently and my head would explode if I didn't wax. Having said that, for wet snow, the structure is the most important step to break the suction and allow channeling of water. Without it, the wax may do nothing. Manky/slurpy/mash potato snow is tough to mange even with aggressive structure IME.

My experience has been that the time spent frequently touching up the bases and not waxing is MUCH faster than if I only wax. It makes my head explode a bit, too, and my iron gets sad with infrequent use.

For me, outside of warm snow conditions, it’s been a good strategy for better daily performance with minimal time having skis on the bench. (Not to discourage spending large amounts of time futzing with skis in the garage or basement)

[Alpinord]

Is that sandblock thing 3D printed? That’s pretty rad!!

Thanks. It's been an idea I've been kicking around. Yesterday's horrible prompted me to finally make one and test out. It works great and I'm tweaking the dimensions a little today. It could also be useful for general sanding for home projects.

The beauty of the clamping system of the SkiVisons Base Flattener and the feel of the planer body is highly versatile and there are endless possibilities for uses and add-ons.

One being a scraper holder I posted a couple days ago.

[Alpinord]

My experience has been that the time spent frequently touching up the bases and not waxing is MUCH faster than if I only wax. It makes my head explode a bit, too, and my iron gets sad with infrequent use.

For me, outside of warm snow conditions, it’s been a good strategy for better daily performance with minimal time having skis on the bench. (Not to discourage spending large amounts of time futzing with skis in the garage or basement)

I know I should at least try this, but I don't wax very frequently when using durable waxes and I can't imagine the glide would be better than how these skis were running until yesterday. Plus with some quick waxing techniques I can bang out the waxing pretty fast when needed.

[El Chupacabra]

I realized I didn't update this after trying the ski visions tool on base burn - short answer, yes, it helps. Did a few light-ish passes with the metal bar, then soaked in a layer of wax for summer.