54t Star Ratchet upgrade?

[milestogo]

So I've serviced my own hubs and I've always pulled my cassette when doing the rear. Wouldn't I have to have a chain whip and a cassette tool to swap this on the trail?

Where are you seeing the mixed reviews - would like to read those.

Seth

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Forgot that. You are Correct. You can pop off the hub cap by hand once the cassette is off. If you keep the 18t one (the 2 pieces) with a light coat of grease and the two springs in a ziplock, you’d be good to go. They might even use the same springs, but I dunno.

I’m planning on upgrading two wheel sets that have the 18t.!Another one of my bikes already has the 54t and I love it, esp for technical sections where I need to be a little careful with my cranks due to a low bb

mixed reviews here:
http://forums.mtbr.com/wheels-tires/...e-1019715.html

I have not tried the 36t, so I might go that route, or get the Chinese ones. $100 for each wheelset might be overkill, but I'm sure between now and when I do purchase them I will have come up with a good rationalization to buy the OEM ones...

[Nwsno]

Shouldn’t need to pull the cassette to remove the FH body and swap the star ratchet. It should just pull off. Buddy of mine ran a number of DT hubs over the years and would always carry a spare set. When they slip you are done and stuck walk/coasting back. Also saw him have a spring fail once too. Faster than a flat fix and way better than walking. He had a ziplock baggie with a already greased set and a spring and another ziplock with a rag to clean up before installing replacement. He only used DT ones, but giving the Chinese a go for half price and a carry the originals would be a solid route to go.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8wtA72zCryo

Cassette and FH body off in one piece at 1:24


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[cmcrawfo]

IMO the dropper is the most significant improvement to MTB in the last decade.

Unless your ratched is broken, I would not replace.

[sethschmautz]

Shouldn’t need to pull the cassette to remove the FH body and swap the star ratchet.

Video didn't work for me on my phone but going to try to pull off the cassette at home this weekend. If so, that would with great.

I've heard others talk about this field repair being feasible but I could never figure out exactly how without removing the cassette. Might be easier than I thought.

The Chinese option seems more feasible if this works.

Seth

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[Nwsno]

IMO the dropper is the most significant improvement to MTB in the last decade.

Unless your ratched is broken, I would not replace.

Dropper post absolutely is......but really only on a bike that see’s trails that warrant it. I couldn’t imagine riding any trail bike with out it.

His TallBoy already has one and I assume is the bike that sees more rugged trail riding.

Hubs that approach instantaneous engagement are also a significant improvement IMO. And $50 to reduce your engagement motion by 2/3s pretty good. Also with the DT hubs the failure mode on the star ratchet system is typically sudden and complete. Once they slip they usually don’t engage with reliability again. Don’t get me wrong they are great hubs, but for such a small weight penalty I would definitely consider carrying the parts. It’s like not carrying tire repair/tube because you’ve never had a flat.

And considering the Kona is a rigid fat bike that may also double as a bike packing rig I would argue that a dropper is not warranted and money could be spent better elsewhere. If it were me drivetrain and tires would be places for investment on that bike.

[reynolds.trailrun]

As noted not necessary to remove cassette for hubs with slip-fit endcaps (hope, dts, Stan’s, to name a few.

My dropper is stealth

[bagtagley]

I recently sported for a high engagement hub. Prior to that, a Hope Pro II was the highest engagement hub I've owned. I don't really get it. Besides the lack of the typical ping when the freehub engages, I haven't notice much of a difference. I've got a pretty low BB and ride plenty of technical, ratchety stuff. If that stuff got any easier, I didn't notice. Maybe I'll have a revelation when I ride a lower engagement hub.

[sethschmautz]

Looks like I can pick up a seat tube adapter from 30.9 to 31.6 for $10 so I can try the dropper on the fat bike and make a more educated guess. Because everything is externally routed, moving the dropper will be easy for the rest of this winter and in the future. If I decide the dropper is not necessary for the bikepacking/loaner bike, I may go the route of the Chinese ratchet + 11-46 cassette, or southpaw. I can add the NW ring and goatlink or cage later.

[toast2266]

In order, I would go:

1) dropper post. No bike should ever not have a dropper post. This includes road bikes.

2) star ratchet. 18 point engagement is terrible, and DT Swiss should be ashamed of themselves for continuing to offer an expensive hub that requires an expensive upgrade to get half the engagement of other worthwhile options. You don't need a tool to replace this, by the way - take the wheel off and the cassette / freehub body should pop right off. I've heard of stories of the 54t failing - you might consider settling for the 36t upgrade.

3) 1x conversion. Seems like it'd be moderately beneficial in the snow. But I'm also of the opinion that fat bikes are a novelty and very little money should be spent on them.

4) Ramp control. They work, and they're neat. But tokens work too and they're a lot cheaper. Just not as quick to change.

[PhishingME]

Droppers are necessary for big drops and super steep rollers, but the tech isn't there. Who's dropper has lasted a full season? If so what brand model. Mine lasted a month. I just went to the 54t.

[toast2266]

Who's dropper has lasted a full season? If so what brand model. Mine lasted a month.

I've had multiple reverbs last a couple years. Also had one or two reverbs die, but they were warrantied without hassle. I have a Gravity Dropper that's going on 5 years. I've had various others (Fox, Raceface, Specialized) that lasted at least a season, but I sold them, so no idea if they're still functioning for more than one season.

Most hydraulic droppers are essentially the same as the damper in a fork, and I'd say their durability is about the same. Over the last ~8 years, I've probably blown up roughly the same number of dropper posts and fork dampers.

[sethschmautz]

Who's dropper has lasted a full season? If so what brand model. Mine lasted a month.

I bought my bike used with the KS i950r (Supernatural) in the fall of 2016. It was not a new dropper, and I have no idea whether the previous owner spent much time working on it.

The cartridge could possibly benefit from a little more pressure (maybe a rebuild?) as it rebounds a little slow, but it's still working fine. I just keep it clean and well lubed.

I just went to the 54t.

And. . . what do you think?

[Dantheman]

Droppers are necessary for big drops and super steep rollers

Much more than that, actually.

but the tech isn't there. Who's dropper has lasted a full season?

Many, many people.

[toast2266]

Many, many people.

I don't think you understand. His sample size of 1 has a 100% failure rate. That's obviously representative.

[cmcrawfo]

for all reverb hate, I gotta say.... they are actually super simple to service. Service tools are cheap from Jensen's, and so are seal kits.... I think the problem is most people don't want to consider them a service item... How many times do you bleed your brakes or service your suspension? There are some droppers that do require less of a service interval, but when they do need service it's often not something that can be done by the end user.

If anyone is holding a 150mm Reverb in 30.9 that they would rather sell than pay to service, hit me up.

[cmcrawfo]

I have been on a Thomson post for 3 season now, but it need to go back for service, and with the price of service and the exchange rate, that's just not a feasible option right now.

The Giant posts are also really good from a longevity stand point... I only service a handful of my friends posts, and I haven't seen the massive reverb failure rates that the internet is talking about.

[PhishingME]

I bought my bike used with the KS i950r (Supernatural) in the fall of 2016. It was not a new dropper, and I have no idea whether the previous owner spent much time working on it.

The cartridge could possibly benefit from a little more pressure (maybe a rebuild?) as it rebounds a little slow, but it's still working fine. I just keep it clean and well lubed.



And. . . what do you think?

Havn't gotten out on it. Of the five guys I ride with, no one has had a dropper last a whole season. They're cool but not durable. I'm in once they get the tech sorted.

[toast2266]

If anyone is holding a 150mm Reverb in 30.9 that they would rather sell than pay to service, hit me up.

I might have a stealth 125 for sale. Last I checked, no service needed...

[cmcrawfo]

Havn't gotten out on it. Of the five guys I ride with, no one has had a dropper last a whole season. They're cool but not durable. I'm in once they get the tech sorted.

You either had a bad batch, or you ride with the 5 most technically inept individuals in the world.

Dropper tech is pretty well sorted... the only thing that will improve their longevity is the move to wider diameter seat tubes.

[jm2e]

In order, I would go:

1) dropper post. No bike should ever not have a dropper post. This includes road bikes.

2) star ratchet. 18 point engagement is terrible, and DT Swiss should be ashamed of themselves for continuing to offer an expensive hub that requires an expensive upgrade to get half the engagement of other worthwhile options. You don't need a tool to replace this, by the way - take the wheel off and the cassette / freehub body should pop right off. I've heard of stories of the 54t failing - you might consider settling for the 36t upgrade.

3) 1x conversion. Seems like it'd be moderately beneficial in the snow. But I'm also of the opinion that fat bikes are a novelty and very little money should be spent on them.

4) Ramp control. They work, and they're neat. But tokens work too and they're a lot cheaper. Just not as quick to change.

Agree. Though I may put Southpaw (or other shifter style lever) as #2.
And really, most people agonizing over $100 bike upgrades are reluctant to service or get their suspension serviced. That’s definitely something to focus your funds on.


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[sethschmautz]

Agree. Though I may put Southpaw (or other shifter style lever) as #2.
And really, most people agonizing over $100 bike upgrades are reluctant to service or get their suspension serviced. That’s definitely something to focus your funds on.


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I think that's a valid point. I typically either do the service myself or not at all. Last year I had the DPS shock tuned and serviced professionally and it made a huge difference.

Seth

[Nwsno]

I think that's a valid point. I typically either do the service myself or not at all. Last year I had the DPS shock tuned and serviced professionally and it made a huge difference.

Seth

Yes! Suspension and dropper service is so critical to performance and longevity. People riding $3000+ bikes and complaining about dropping coin once year to have a fork, shock and dropper professionally serviced is crazy. I agree do it your self if you can, or have it done if you can’t, but in the end make sure it is getting done. Running these things for multiple years without is nuts. Coating get shot, performance drops significantly and eventually they just fail.

Any body in the PNW needs shock or post service check out ButterSuspension. Buddy of mine and his work is top notch.

https://www.buttersuspension.com/

[Rossymcg]

The only thing that really makes me cringe is the idea of being on a bike without a dropper.

i couldnt ride a bike with it a dropper. I don't know how folks do it

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[Nwsno]

i couldnt ride a bike with it a dropper. I don't know how folks do it

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damn, dropper sprung a leak Wednesday just a bit from the car........almost called it a day, but then realized I have tools and spent decades raising and lowering my seat.....meh.....first world problems. At least it was stuck down.

[sethschmautz]

damn, dropper sprung a leak Wednesday just a bit from the car........almost called it a day, but then realized I have tools and spent decades raising and lowering my seat.....meh.....first world problems. At least it was stuck down.

You should send that post in for service. :-)