Touring jacket: Trew Wander vs Strafe Cham2 vs Flylow Genius...

[full_zirkel]

Looking to update my backcountry touring jacket and pants. Considering these three options, which are all similar in intent, price and weight. Focused on light weight, durability, breathability and, specifically, tourability. Big fan of MINIMALIST design that keeps it simple. Can anyone with more experience in technical soft goods than myself provide any insight?

https://trewgear.com/collections/men...ander-jacket-1
https://trewgear.com/collections/men...roam-3-4-bib-1

I like the Trew culture, and supporting a direct-to-consumer business model. Their stuff gets high reviews, although difficult to find many current photos and reviews. Limited colors.
>proprietary stretch hardshell (uber breathable!)
>533 grams
>$419

https://strafeouterwear.com/product/cham2-jacket-2017/
https://strafeouterwear.com/product/cham2-pant-2017/

Again, small company making a killer product. Awkward colors, IMHO.
>neoshell
>550 grams
>$465

https://shop.flylowgear.com/collecti...nt=47184280196
https://shop.flylowgear.com/collecti...nt=47187332228

Like the design and colors. A little loose for long day tours, perhaps?
>neoshell
>470 grams
>$425

[STLHD]

I have those trew bibs and the genius jacket. I like the bibs because they aren’t super baggy. The boot cuff is a bit narrow as a trade off and can be a PITA. Durability is average. Had the IQ pant and found them to be way too baggy.

I’ve tried a bunch of touring shells over the years and the genius jacket is by far the best touring shell I’ve owned. Wicked breathable and the large is a good, not too baggy fit on me (6’; 200 lbs).


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[jckstein]

I got the Cham 2 this year based on great reviews and I personally think the orange/blue looks unreal good. Plan on using it for my everything jacket from resort to touring. Check out the blister review on it.

[sk8rat6587]

Of those I'd probably go Strafe or Trew. I really like Flylows color and style choices, but really dislike their fit and some zipper placements seemed off.

My current favorite in terms of construction and performance is Sweet Protection Supernaut. A little heavier than your other options, but bombproof and really good fit. Unfortunately hard to find in the states. I think they do have some more dedicated touring lines that would be lighter... Maybe Getaway or Salvation, but again tough to find in US.

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[Lindahl]

Unless you’re in the PNW or Tahoe, I’d seriously consider membraneless softshell (no gore, no neoshell, etc.) for both jacket and pants. I find both way more comfortable touring in any type of weather in the intermountain west.

[thewestisthefuture]

Membrane-free softshells don't cut the wind the way I'd like, which is a major flaw IMO. If it doesn't keep the wind out and doesn't keep the water out, why even wear a jacket? Maybe I haven't tried the right softshell but I've settled on a Rab Latok eVent hardshell for touring. Big pit zips, big well-located pockets. Might be worth a look. I still don't wear it on the skin track unless it's really nasty out. Of those three the Trew looks best to me.

[zion zig zag]

Membrane-free softshells don't cut the wind the way I'd like, which is a major flaw IMO. If it doesn't keep the wind out and doesn't keep the water out, why even wear a jacket?

Agreed 100%.

[North]

Trew:
I use the Roam pants for everyday touring (same fabric as the Wander). The fabric is light, breathes well, and held up to branches and other abrasives. That said, I developed holes on the front of the cuffs where the pants rub on the boot buckle ladders (after ~15 days touring). I sent them in for warranty, and while they eventually patched them, it took ~4 months. I sent multiple emails that were never responded to, hard to get anybody on the phone, etc. I had a seam failure on a different pair of Trew bibs after <5 days. In general, they make interesting product, but seem to be operating on a shoestring.

Strafe:
I own the Cham2. Great jacket, but too hot for me touring (used it 1x over a mid-weight Merino baselayer). I prefer an OR Ferrosi for touring with a shell in the pack. The Cham2 works well as a resort shell.

Flylow:
Haven't tried anything from them in a few years, but previous pieces were marginal. Neither Chemical(?) pants or Stash pants were effective at cutting out wind, and both would wet out frequently (hard to do in CO). They used a to be a more budget-friendly option, and I always considered it a "get what you pay for" scenario. Now that their prices are on par with everybody else, maybe the gear is too?

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Unless you’re in the PNW or Tahoe, I’d seriously consider membraneless softshell (no gore, no neoshell, etc.) for both jacket and pants. I find both way more comfortable touring in any type of weather in the intermountain west.

I agree. My favorite jacket for touring is a Marmot Tempo softshell for the up. Cuts the wind fine and sheds snow. On the descent I usually just through a puffy or heavier softshell over the top. Never could make a waterproof jacket work for touring.

[Lindahl]

Membrane-free softshells don't cut the wind the way I'd like, which is a major flaw IMO. If it doesn't keep the wind out and doesn't keep the water out, why even wear a jacket? Maybe I haven't tried the right softshell but I've settled on a Rab Latok eVent hardshell for touring. Big pit zips, big well-located pockets. Might be worth a look. I still don't wear it on the skin track unless it's really nasty out. Of those three the Trew looks best to me.

I think you might have had the wrong mentality and approach to softshells. You don’t need to keep the wind out. You just need to cut the heavy winds to a light breeze so it doesn’t sap ALL your warmth (only enough to keep you from overheating). I’m guessing you did something wrong along the way when you tried it.

And there is no water. There’s only snow, which out here isn’t wet enough to get through DWR and a softshell (unless you’re building a snow cave or something).

[plugboots]

I think you might have had the wrong mentality and approach to softshells. You don’t need to keep the wind out. You just need to cut the heavy winds to a light breeze so it doesn’t sap ALL your warmth (only enough to keep you from overheating). I’m guessing you did something wrong along the way when you tried it.

And there is no water. There’s only snow, which out here isn’t wet enough to get through DWR and a softshell (unless you’re building a snow cave or something).

I agree with this. Even on my dumping wet snow tour today, I climbed in my softshell. The shoulders and upper arms got wet, but I was climbing, so didn’t get cold. I just turned and skied today, but I keep a puffy and hard shell in the pack for when it’s too cold at the switch.

[zion zig zag]

And there is no water. There’s only snow, which out here isn’t wet enough to get through DWR and a softshell (unless you’re building a snow cave or something).

Sounds magical. Unfortunately it rains occasionally in the winter here. And if I’m going to be miles from shelter, being cold and wet isn’t a bet I want to lose.

[Lindahl]

Sounds magical. Unfortunately it rains occasionally in the winter here. And if I’m going to be miles from shelter, being cold and wet isn’t a bet I want to lose.

If you’re in the mountain states, pretty fucking obvious if its gonna rain, bring a shell. Duh. Still, it rarely does. Optimize for the majority?

[full_zirkel]

Location: Tahoe/Eastern Sierra.

Ruled out the Genius (found one at my local shop -- way too baggy). But added:

Westcomb Shift LT Hoody
https://westcomb.com/product/shift-lt-hoody/ (still creeped out by that model!)
>neoshell 250
>340 grams
>$450

Freeride Systems Antero 2 Plus (BLURPLE!)
http://www.freeridesystems.com/categ...series-jackets
>neoshell + hardshell laminate
>weight?
>$419

Leaning (in order):
1. Antero 2 Plus
2. Trew Wander
3. Stafe Cham2

Decisions...

[hafjell]

I have used the Cham2 pants as my only pant (except for rock guide pants for the late spring) and they are nearly flawless. Very light for the up, breath well, cover a huge range of temps, block the wind, great in rain, and have an excellent beacon pocket on the right side if you don't use a chest harness. Neoshell is the best, imho.

[Andyski]

If you can find an Arc Teryx Lithic Comp jacket, I’d add it to the list. I love mine deeply for touring. It’s discontinued, but I’m sure there are some out there.

[Peruvian]

For touring I wear the most breathable fabrics I can for the up and then put on an insulated layer and a shell for the down.

As a result, pack ability of the insulation and shell are key. I use a patty down vest or jacket and love my Freeride Systems Antero 2+ shell.

The Antero 2+ is light enough and has put zips that I could use it skinning on storm days, but I normally ride lifts on storm days and skin the following day once the resort is tracked out.

[milestogo]

I had an early version of the Genius jacket which leaked at the zippers. I contacted them and tried to sort it out, and they didnt really give a shit because I didnt have a receipt. Pretty much turned me off to Flylow, since many other companies will take care of you regardless...

[jdadour]

Has anyone used both the Dermizax NX and the Polartec neoshell, and can comment on which one is more breathable? Trying to decide between the Trew Wander and Flylow Genius.

[SupreChicken]

Has anyone used both the Dermizax NX and the Polartec neoshell, and can comment on which one is more breathable? Trying to decide between the Trew Wander and Flylow Genius.

I vote derzimax

[jdadour]

I vote derzimax

Thanks Supre. Anyone else have experience with both?

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[markcjr]

I don't have experience with both, I do own 2016 flylow compound pants with neoshell and they are so breathable they are cold on the lift and on the way down when it is chilly. Typically with a 3 layer pant I just wear a thin long-john underneath - with these I wear expedition weight almost all the time - location: Tahoe. - Pros: super breathable - Cons: wet out on the seat and quads the first storm I used them in and consistently wet out. I get that you have to wash and waterproof your stuff once a year, but from the factory that was a bit of a disappointment. Maybe their dwr has improved since?

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[jdadour]

I don't have experience with both, I do own 2016 flylow compound pants with neoshell and they are so breathable they are cold on the lift and on the way down when it is chilly. Typically with a 3 layer pant I just wear a thin long-john underneath - with these I wear expedition weight almost all the time

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I had those Compound pants in neoshell too, and also found them to be super breathable and cold! Trying to figure out if the Dermizax NX is equally breathable.

[meter-man]

Figured I'd report back since I harvested beta from here.

I bought a Trew Wander and a Black Diamond Helio. While I preferred the Wander's two huge internal drop pockets, overall, I liked the simplicity and extremely lightweight design of the Helio and I'm keeping that.

[North]

Has anyone used both the Dermizax NX and the Polartec neoshell, and can comment on which one is more breathable? Trying to decide between the Trew Wander and Flylow Genius.

Another vote for Dermizax

I don't have experience with both, I do own 2016 flylow compound pants with neoshell and they are so breathable they are cold on the lift and on the way down when it is chilly.....I get that you have to wash and waterproof your stuff once a year, but from the factory that was a bit of a disappointment. Maybe their dwr has improved since?

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I have been disappointed with every Flylow product I've ever owned with one exception. Their outer layers are consistently "drafty". Old chemical pants were the coldest "shell" I've ever worn. My latest item was a lab coat (I think), that had a major draft through the chest pocket or surrounding seams. I stopped purchasing their products years ago, but even my free Ski Journal hat has the logo sewn on upside down. Fitting.

Fine when they were a cheaper alternative to other brands, but their quality doesn't match newer price points IMO.