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  1. #1176
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Squamish, BC
    Posts
    898
    Quote Originally Posted by jdadour View Post
    Guys, was thinking about this on the drive to work this morning, and we MAY be thinking about Ramp and Stack Height incorrectly for the Shift. Does the height position of the toe lug in the toe piece change alpine vs grip walk vs wtr vs touring? And the moving AFD is just making up for the gap of thicker vs thinner sole types? Correct me if I'm wrong, but then doesnt the ramp delta stay the same despite the differences in stack height of the different sole types?
    you're probably right. I thought the mags already figured this though? I don't want to go back and read 48pgs, but your logic makes sense to me.

  2. #1177
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Los Angeles/Mammoth
    Posts
    1,317
    Quote Originally Posted by Judo Chop! View Post
    you're probably right. I thought the mags already figured this though? I don't want to go back and read 48pgs, but your logic makes sense to me.
    Just thought I would bring it up, because from what I can recall from previous posts in this thread people have been equating the difference in sole stack height to equal ramp delta.

  3. #1178
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Nottingham, UK
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by jdadour View Post
    Guys, was thinking about this on the drive to work this morning, and we MAY be thinking about Ramp and Stack Height incorrectly for the Shift. Does the height position of the toe lug in the toe piece change alpine vs grip walk vs wtr vs touring? And the moving AFD is just making up for the gap of thicker vs thinner sole types? Correct me if I'm wrong, but then doesnt the ramp delta stay the same despite the differences in stack height of the different sole types?......
    No, the delta does change. You just have to measure from the base of the ski to the underside of the sole at the toe and the heel and compare that to the boot sitting on a flat surface (the boot sitting on a flat surface would be zero delta).

  4. #1179
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Nottingham, UK
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by LeeLau View Post
    What? I was off by 1mm?
    If you're going to do a job...............

  5. #1180
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    NW WA
    Posts
    329
    Quote Originally Posted by Spyderjon View Post
    No, the delta does change. You just have to measure from the base of the ski to the underside of the sole at the toe and the heel and compare that to the boot sitting on a flat surface (the boot sitting on a flat surface would be zero delta).
    If were going to be that particular wouldn't you measure from the surface of the sole on the inside of the boot? Easiest way to test would be to put an L-square in the boot (as if it were a foot) and then measure the angle of the vertical portion when the boot is on the ground vs. in the binding.

  6. #1181
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Colorado Front Range
    Posts
    4,644
    At the end of the day, you're looking at the boot board surface, but you'd need to take x-rays to make truly valid comparisons.

    Since every manufacturer has a different interpretation of all of the dimensions comprising the various standards (whether it be 9523 or otherwise), the best we can do is to make an educated guess as to measuring points that translate across boots.

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  7. #1182
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    Tahoe>Missoula>Fort Collins
    Posts
    1,798
    Quote Originally Posted by Spyderjon View Post
    If you're going to do a job...............
    Speaking of job, did I do a hack job here? Threw inserts on another set of skis. Kept the toe but moved the heel back 1.0cm back to avoid some conflicts. My boot is 327mm so these are technically mounted for 337 therefore. Thus when mounted with correct forward pressure, the heel is 10 mm forward of “middle.”

    On a napkin plus eyeball, this looked fine knowing the 30mm of adjustment. But mounted, I’m leery.

    Pic 1: red line showing where my mount puts me in relation to the STOP

    pic 2: my assumption for the 30mm of adjustment

    pic 3: my mount clicked in
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  8. #1183
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    5,531
    The bindings are ruined. Pm me and I'll give you my address so you can send them to me for proper disposal.
    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    the situation strikes me as WAY too much drama at this point

  9. #1184
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    1,218
    Quote Originally Posted by margotron View Post
    Speaking of job, did I do a hack job here? Threw inserts on another set of skis. Kept the toe but moved the heel back 1.0cm back to avoid some conflicts. My boot is 327mm so these are technically mounted for 337 therefore. Thus when mounted with correct forward pressure, the heel is 10 mm forward of “middle.”

    On a napkin plus eyeball, this looked fine knowing the 30mm of adjustment. But mounted, I’m leery.

    Pic 1: red line showing where my mount puts me in relation to the STOP

    pic 2: my assumption for the 30mm of adjustment

    pic 3: my mount clicked in
    You're in the window. I think you're good.

  10. #1185
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Nottingham, UK
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by margotron View Post
    Speaking of job, did I do a hack job here? Threw inserts on another set of skis. Kept the toe but moved the heel back 1.0cm back to avoid some conflicts. My boot is 327mm so these are technically mounted for 337 therefore. Thus when mounted with correct forward pressure, the heel is 10 mm forward of “middle.”

    On a napkin plus eyeball, this looked fine knowing the 30mm of adjustment. But mounted, I’m leery.

    Pic 1: red line showing where my mount puts me in relation to the STOP

    pic 2: my assumption for the 30mm of adjustment

    pic 3: my mount clicked in
    Quote Originally Posted by lucknau View Post
    You're in the window. I think you're good.
    Your pics are exactly what I'd expect given the criteria you've used and yes, you're good to go - albeit that you're at the shortest end of the adjustment range.

  11. #1186
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Whistler, BC
    Posts
    1,495
    Day one on the shifts today, feel awesome on the down.

    They are way less harsh than my kingpins and have stopped some juddering or chatter when my carbo katana’s are on an extreme edge dumping speed on firm.

    They do, however, seem prone to icing under the brake pedal which makes clicking in, and latching the brakes up hard. Worse icing than my kingpins for sure.


    Click image for larger version. 

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  12. #1187
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    23
    The first time out I also had this issue with ice under the brake. Since then I have been much more careful to shake out the snow prior to clicking down and it has helped significantly.

    The issues I have so far (1 major, 2 minor):

    1. Brakes falling down (major) - this can get very annoying depending on the day
    2. Snow under brakes - as you mentioned, this happens but is easy to deal with, I just stick my pole in a clean it out
    3. Riser - I would like a higher riser for certain days, especially when the skin track is already set.

    Overall, the binding is amazing, but the rise/brake interface could be much improved. I don't know why they couldn't of spent more time sorting this system out. The toe piece is amazing, but the brake/riser system seemed like it could easily improved.

  13. #1188
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    PNW -> MSO
    Posts
    7,889
    Hmm.

    Can the plastics of the brake area handle a shot of silicone spray?

  14. #1189
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    5,531
    Quote Originally Posted by Norseman View Post
    Hmm.

    Can the plastics of the brake area handle a shot of silicone spray?
    My question also...
    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    the situation strikes me as WAY too much drama at this point

  15. #1190
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    SW CO
    Posts
    5,588
    Brakes deploying while skinning up were a major issue with the kingpin (under-reported here on TGR IMHO), and I really hope the shift doesn't have the same issue.
    "Alpine rock and steep, deep powder are what I seek, and I will always find solace there." - Bean Bowers

    photos

  16. #1191
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    Tahoe>Missoula>Fort Collins
    Posts
    1,798
    Quote Originally Posted by mg. View Post
    The first time out I also had this issue with ice under the brake. Since then I have been much more careful to shake out the snow prior to clicking down and it has helped significantly.

    The issues I have so far (1 major, 2 minor):

    1. Brakes falling down (major) - this can get very annoying depending on the day
    2. Snow under brakes - as you mentioned, this happens but is easy to deal with, I just stick my pole in a clean it out
    3. Riser - I would like a higher riser for certain days, especially when the skin track is already set.

    Overall, the binding is amazing, but the rise/brake interface could be much improved. I don't know why they couldn't of spent more time sorting this system out. The toe piece is amazing, but the brake/riser system seemed like it could easily improved.
    Easily improved? Curious, please go on


  17. #1192
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Golden
    Posts
    1,023
    Quote Originally Posted by galibier_numero_un View Post
    At the end of the day, you're looking at the boot board surface, but you'd need to take x-rays to make truly valid comparisons.

    Since every manufacturer has a different interpretation of all of the dimensions comprising the various standards (whether it be 9523 or otherwise), the best we can do is to make an educated guess as to measuring points that translate across boots.

    ... Thom
    And if you are in Tecnica Cochise, the boot board in that has probably around 7mm (just a guess) of delta that isn't planar, but a big dramatic step in heights, occuring at the back of the arch. Where a mach 1 is flatter and planar.

    It is all guessing in the end. But the numbers are relevant if you are keeping the same boot and switching bindings.

  18. #1193
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    North Vancouver/Whistler
    Posts
    13,985
    Quote Originally Posted by rob stokes View Post
    Day one on the shifts today, feel awesome on the down.

    They are way less harsh than my kingpins and have stopped some juddering or chatter when my carbo katana’s are on an extreme edge dumping speed on firm.

    They do, however, seem prone to icing under the brake pedal which makes clicking in, and latching the brakes up hard. Worse icing than my kingpins for sure.
    Stokes I sprayed some cooking spray on the spot where the ice builds up. Helped a lot

    Also whenever I used them I would pick up the ski and whack it on the base under the brakes while holding ski upside down and dislodged snow. Just made it a habit.

  19. #1194
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Queen City
    Posts
    809
    Quote Originally Posted by auvgeek View Post
    Brakes deploying while skinning up were a major issue with the kingpin (under-reported here on TGR IMHO), and I really hope the shift doesn't have the same issue.
    This happens non stop with my kingpins. Was there ever a fix? It hasn't happened with my shifts though and they seem very locked in place while up.

  20. #1195
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    SW CO
    Posts
    5,588
    Quote Originally Posted by toastybroski View Post
    This happens non stop with my kingpins. Was there ever a fix? It hasn't happened with my shifts though and they seem very locked in place while up.
    you can adjust the set screw that holds them up. Details in the kingpin thread. I’ve had mixed luck — worked alright on my pair, didn’t help at all on a friend’s. Only failsafe way is to get the brakeless afd.
    "Alpine rock and steep, deep powder are what I seek, and I will always find solace there." - Bean Bowers

    photos

  21. #1196
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Down East
    Posts
    265
    Has anyone had any experience mounting the shift on a ski that pervisioly had look pivots 14 mounted? I am woundering if I would have issues with the new screw holes conflicting with the old ones

  22. #1197
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Nottingham, UK
    Posts
    1,289
    Quote Originally Posted by phatboy64 View Post
    Has anyone had any experience mounting the shift on a ski that pervisioly had look pivots 14 mounted? I am woundering if I would have issues with the new screw holes conflicting with the old ones
    Assuming the same bsl for both you'll get a clash with the rear toe locations on the Pivot with the central toe holes on the Shift. You'll need to mount the Shifts at either -8mm or +12mm to get 10mm centre-to-centre separation etc:
    Click image for larger version. 

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  23. #1198
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    2,282
    quality reply! Full score - 5 outta 7!

  24. #1199
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    5,531
    Quote Originally Posted by Spyderjon View Post
    Assuming the same bsl for both you'll get a clash with the rear toe locations on the Pivot with the central toe holes on the Shift. You'll need to mount the Shifts at either -8mm or +12mm to get 10mm centre-to-centre separation etc:
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Quote Originally Posted by kid-kapow View Post
    quality reply! Full score - 5 outta 7!
    Yup. This place rules.

    I had the same question (didn't post it), and I'm sure there are others out there too.

    Spyderjon nails the landing.

    Thanks!
    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    the situation strikes me as WAY too much drama at this point

  25. #1200
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    PNW -> MSO
    Posts
    7,889
    Lol, my study material this morning is similar.

    Pivot at 315mm BSL, Shift at 305, both dead on the line.


    Holes of interest (new band name?) are .32 inch apart on center, 8.1mm... close... but a couple mm movement would be comfy and not quite noticable on ski.



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