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  1. #51
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    Apr 2016
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    211
    Quote Originally Posted by Danno View Post
    One would assume that they have rather expensive insurance, with quite a bit of coverage, considering the business they're in. But again, it's not in the article so I prefer to assume that they don't.
    I wouldn't expect the article to discuss whether they have insurance coverage, particularly as the paper of record in a small-ish jurisdiction. If they have insurance, the rules of evidence would generally keep the jury from knowing about it so that the knowledge wouldn't pollute the verdict.

    I don't know if they have insurance either, but they're dumb if they don't. I'm aware of the coverage carried by a few Colorado resorts, and it's in the multi-millions of dollars. And the Colorado Ski Safety Act has made it easier for CO resorts to get insurance because it limits the types of actions you can bring against a ski resort in Colorado. Here's some more info for you armchair lawyers.

  2. #52
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    Dec 2011
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    PNW
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    Quote Originally Posted by smartyiak View Post
    Or perhaps: the ski area is correct. The lady was responsible for her own injury, but fuck it, let’s sue...it couldn’t possibly be her responsibility. No one else has ever unloaded this lift without injury, so obviously it’s the ski areas fault.


    These suits frequently lead to more regulation which, yes, impacts your freedom. All regulations do....some are worth the trade off and others aren’t worth it at all.

    But b/c someone was seriously injured, that large evil corporation that is Silverton....they should pay!!!
    So you have never unloaded a fixed chair running 500fpm on foot huh, mmm, ok.

  3. #53
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    Sep 2004
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    Ten Mile Vistas
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    Why wasn't there an attendant at the top terminal to slow/stop the lift? Exiting that lift is bad enough on skis....can't imagine having to race down the ramp on foot. Silverton Mountain sure fucked that up.
    Quote Originally Posted by mikdes26 View Post
    I used to hike 2 hours for 10 minutes of turns on 207 gs skis, without needing “skins” or “hike mode.” Tell me again how I’m a gaper.

  4. #54
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    Jul 2005
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    Moose, Iowa
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    Wouldn't the BLM permit be contingent on them having and proving liability insurance? Our local water ski club can't spit on the bank without proving liability coverage.
    Last edited by uglymoney; 11-30-2017 at 04:04 PM.

  5. #55
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    May 2009
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    pdx
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cravenmorhead View Post
    I don't know if they have insurance either, but they're dumb if they don't
    in an entirely different industry, I've heard it asserted that it's better to not be insured and to not show a profit because it's just a target for lawsuits (from a business oriented hide-the-assets discussion)

    without the target, the expectation of lucrative suits drops enormously

    that all said, if there is no liquidity to cover a true accident, that would wipe out the business

  6. #56
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    Mar 2011
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    Magically whisked away to...Delaware
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    Quote Originally Posted by k2skier112 View Post
    So you have never unloaded a fixed chair running 500fpm on foot huh, mmm, ok.
    I’m not clear on what you’re saying.

    All I’m saying is that, maybe, Silverton has a valid defense:
    1) lift passed inspection and was certified by State;
    2) others have gotten off lift without injuring themselves;
    3) injured person didn’t follow instruction for proper disembark;
    4) improper disembarkation led to injury;
    5) injured person > 51% at fault for her injury.

    Plaintiff’s Complaint looks bad for Silverton...and it should. Silverton’s prolly looks bad for plaintiff.





    Sent from my iPad using TGR Forums
    It makes perfect sense...until you think about it.

  7. #57
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    Aug 2007
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    Bottom feeding
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    Quote Originally Posted by acinpdx View Post
    in an entirely different industry, I've heard it asserted that it's better to not be insured and to not show a profit because it's just a target for lawsuits (from a business oriented hide-the-assets discussion)

    without the target, the expectation of lucrative suits drops enormously

    that all said, if there is no liquidity to cover a true accident, that would wipe out the business
    Wouldn't they just keep going down the line? This is what happened with Chuinard and the guy who forgot to clip in, I thought. Well, I guess in Silverton's case there isn't anybody down the line with deeper pockets.
    Well maybe I'm the faggot America
    I'm not a part of a redneck agenda

  8. #58
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    Jul 2005
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    Moose, Iowa
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    4-25 from the original amended permit app indicates that they should have insurance and as I suspected the insurance also covers government entities.

    https://books.google.com/books?id=5A...urance&f=false

  9. #59
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    May 2009
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    pdx
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    Quote Originally Posted by plugboots View Post
    Wouldn't they just keep going down the line? This is what happened with Chuinard and the guy who forgot to clip in, I thought. Well, I guess in Silverton's case there isn't anybody down the line with deeper pockets.
    well, that's just it...if there's nothing to go after, why spend the money pursuing an empty ruling in your favor? [ie, a judgement that can't be paid]

    i have no idea who deserves to pay in the OP

    but it is always interesting that insurance companies, who receive premiums over time specifically to cover an individual in an accident, try to get out of their responsibility to be the one who pays

    didn't they sign up to cover catastrophic unforeseen losses?

  10. #60
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    Apr 2010
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    Kings Beach
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    they really might be fucked on this one

  11. #61
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    Dec 2003
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    Seattle
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    Quote Originally Posted by acinpdx View Post

    but it is always interesting that insurance companies, who receive premiums over time specifically to cover an individual in an accident, try to get out of their responsibility to be the one who pays

    didn't they sign up to cover catastrophic unforeseen losses?
    By relying on the lame waiver on back of ticket?
    Quote Originally Posted by Downbound Train View Post
    And there will come a day when our ancestors look back...........

  12. #62
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    Apr 2010
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    Kings Beach
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    338
    Ive been there a few times and theres rarely a top lift attendant... they even make a big deal to tell you that if your pack gets stuck and you cant get off the chair they will make fun of you
    I always thought it was funny but really bad business wise and that they better not make fun of a rich attorney when he gets stuck or falls off

  13. #63
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    Feb 2005
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    Vancouver BC
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    I feel for the lady. Even getting off a high speed detachable quad in the Whistler Bike Park in the summer requires a quick walking pace, and that is at slower lift speed with a wider radius bull wheel and you are walking on a flat dry surface. Having to get off a fixed grip double and then run down a 30 degree snow covered ramp with no railings is absurd... Silverton are morons for allowing foot traffic especially in the winter.

  14. #64
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    Sep 2004
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    Ten Mile Vistas
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    Quote Originally Posted by tahoearmada View Post
    Ive been there a few times and theres rarely a top lift attendant...
    Skied there back in January and there was definitely a top lift attendant, possibly a new policy as a result of this accident. Buddy did exactly what you were talking about.......got his pack caught and stopped the lift.
    Quote Originally Posted by mikdes26 View Post
    I used to hike 2 hours for 10 minutes of turns on 207 gs skis, without needing “skins” or “hike mode.” Tell me again how I’m a gaper.

  15. #65
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    Feb 2008
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    Summit North
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    Quote Originally Posted by k2skier112 View Post
    So you have never unloaded a fixed chair running 500fpm on foot huh, mmm, ok.
    Not taking issue with this statement...

    However it reminds me that, when I have ever been on a fixed grip chair (locally) where I noticed people walk-on, for up or down loading, it appeared that operators on both ends were in communication, regarding things like which chair(s) and how many, and they slowed the chair down so the people could safely dismount. I am curious what the SOP was at Silverton, for chair related foot traffic?

    I can't remember ever riding a chair (during public operation) where there wasn't an operator at both top and bottom.
    Alpental Indigenous

  16. #66
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    Oct 2005
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    Wasatch
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Chupacabra View Post
    I assume Silverton has insurance, which would provide a defense and indemnity. The accident and the newspaper article sound like a standard negligence claim, which would be covered.

    I have no idea how much coverage a ski area typically carries.
    Thinking back to sitting through risk management trainings - 10-20MM, but that was a few years ago at a well-run, risk-averse place.

  17. #67
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    May 2009
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    pdx
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    Quote Originally Posted by PNWbrit View Post
    By relying on the lame waiver on back of ticket?
    i guess i was thinking about the health insurance co, but your point about the resort liability insurance co is taken...

  18. #68
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    561
    Silverton's off-ramp is awkward, to say the least. You get off the chair and down the ramp into an immediate uphill off-camber lefthander. People can seize-up at this turn and make for some anxious off-loads.

    A couple years back during spring unguided, the liftie stopped me to check my lift ticket after I had already been up a few times. He tells me Jen was pissed that I snubbed her as I walked to the chair. I don't even know Jen I told the liftie and showed him my ticket. I was kind of miffed by the situation but returned to full-concentration 3 towers out from unloading.
    Last edited by permnation; 11-30-2017 at 07:48 PM.

  19. #69
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    Jan 2010
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    In the swamp
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    4,699

    Silverton being sued -- time to hurry up and get down there

    Why the fuck would they run the risk of something happening with that rickety old platform and awkward ramp. Seems so easy to cheaply fix it. Now they have to hope not to go under.
    Poor woman. That freaking sucks.

  20. #70
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    1,252
    We should start a TGR vulture fund to buy them out of the bankruptcy.

  21. #71
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    Feb 2006
    Location
    Montrose, CO
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    496
    Quote Originally Posted by Skistack View Post
    We should start a TGR vulture fund to buy them out of the bankruptcy.
    I have no pity for Brill if this thing goes sideways.
    I used to tour up in Velocity Basin before that guy even thought of putting in for the use permit. I've skied there a half dozen times or so and had good experiences. However, I do know of many people who made reservations, showed up and were denied getting on the hill because they said they were full-after driving many hours to get there.
    I've had ski patrol buddies show up there from afar and be screwed by Brill-having to pay full price to get on the chair and such-the guy's a dick.

    I'm surprised he hasn't had a major catastrophic incident with some 18 year old stoner "intern" driving the bread truck into the creek and rolling the thing full of people or a major avalanche disaster.

    Unfortunately, for the town of Silverton, this could be a hard hit. So many local businesses rely on the tourist dollars from Brill's business to make it through the winter. This doesn't effect just him, it may really impact Silverton.

  22. #72
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    Jan 2008
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    truckee
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    I've never seen a fixed grip lift onload or off load someone on foot without at least slowing down. Doesn't mean it doesn't happen, especially for ski area personnel who are used to it but to require a tourist to do it seems like a massively bad idea. I can't imagine a jury looking at a picture of that ramp and not thinking the same thing, unless they are all true expert skiers. This will settle, probably quietly.

    Passing a state inspection is meaningless unless the inspection specifically addressed the issue of offloading on foot.
    Last edited by old goat; 12-01-2017 at 11:31 PM.

  23. #73
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
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    561
    Rite of Passage
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  24. #74
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    Mar 2008
    Location
    Aloft
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    Quote Originally Posted by bovine View Post
    I have no pity for Brill if this thing goes sideways.
    I used to tour up in Velocity Basin before that guy even thought of putting in for the use permit. I've skied there a half dozen times or so and had good experiences. However, I do know of many people who made reservations, showed up and were denied getting on the hill because they said they were full-after driving many hours to get there.
    I've had ski patrol buddies show up there from afar and be screwed by Brill-having to pay full price to get on the chair and such-the guy's a dick.

    I'm surprised he hasn't had a major catastrophic incident with some 18 year old stoner "intern" driving the bread truck into the creek and rolling the thing full of people or a major avalanche disaster.

    Unfortunately, for the town of Silverton, this could be a hard hit. So many local businesses rely on the tourist dollars from Brill's business to make it through the winter. This doesn't effect just him, it may really impact Silverton.
    So many "buddys" and "people i know" and never any first hand accounts of problems in this thread. Interesting.

  25. #75
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    cordova,AK
    Posts
    2,214
    I work at a hill with a fixed grip. we often take foot passengers. The lift does not stop. The bottom station contacts the top with the chair number. The lift operator slows down the chair and is outside to assist. When I am there on patrol I meet the chair. If the above picture is accurate I am amazed at the location of the lift shack. I have not been to many resorts but I always thought the lift shack is on the same side as the offload to assist easier. Our lift shack is located in the center.
    That top station is a joke it is in no way set up for foot travel.
    off your knees Louie

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