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  1. #51
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    Past tense?

  2. #52
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    Mar 2017
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    5
    Another one to consider would be the Arcteryx Argus as long as you have a shell to throw over it for colder days or higher speed descents. The really nice thing about it is that 80% of the insulation is up front and on top of the shoulders and it vents heat out the back when you are working.

    I wear mine more for running, down to -15C as an outer layer and colder than that as a mid layer. Itís great if you are one of those people who is prone to overheat/sweat and then freeze once wet. Blocks some of that wind from the front but still lets you keep a balance.

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by bodywhomper View Post
    Anybody remember the old Stephenson's catalogs?
    A quick search on Stephenson's Warmlite Catalog turned up this blast from the past (NSFW) pic in...TRG, of course:
    https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...072#post965072
    And I guess that I just don't know

  4. #54
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by bodywhomper View Post
    Past tense?
    whatever turns/turned ya on

  5. #55
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    Nov 2014
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    SLC
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    Quote Originally Posted by TG View Post
    can you share some brand specifics?
    how's the odor control?
    a Patagonia capilene one, a Dynafit something-or-other, am Under Armor 1/4 zip, a few one-offs from various races (one is Saucony)

    they all seem to work about the same. odor control is bad though, they stink after sweating in them. single use only for sure. thatís part of why I want to go merino, but itís just never dry enough for me.

  6. #56
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    Sep 2016
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbillie1 View Post
    they all seem to work about the same. odor control is bad though, they stink after sweating in them. single use only for sure. thatís part of why I want to go merino, but itís just never dry enough for me.
    Yes to single use. I've got a deal on some merino that I think will allow me to try to go without the synthetic base and midlayers for a season. We'll see if the dryness is an issue. Other problem with merino of course is durability. Ortovox has some cool looking blends, but haven't heard any reports. I think I can live with the dry problem, but the merino has to be able to withstand at least carrying a pack.

  7. #57
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    Nov 2007
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    Eburg
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    I often use a lightweight thin merino base layer top for lift-served skiing, but it would get soaking wet with sweat if I used it on a mid-winter ski tour at any temperature. My wife sweats very little and can get away with wearing a merino base layer top, but she prefers to use my N2S semi-VB method.

    A merino or synthetic base layer does sometimes find its way into my ski touring pack: Sometimes I strip down before the final run of the day and wear a base layer on the exit.

    Spring/summer touring is different.

  8. #58
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    Nov 2014
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIYSteve View Post
    I often use a lightweight thin merino base layer top for lift-served skiing, but it would get soaking wet with sweat if I used it on a mid-winter ski tour at any temperature.
    yeah this is my experience also. I wish there was a not-so-stinky wicking baselayer that stayed dry that I could wear, but when touring I would much rather smell bad and be dry than smell good and be cold and wet.

  9. #59
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
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    northern BC
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    You want merino cuz it doesnt stink but merino is expensive compared to plastic and it doesnt wear well atall

    SO the cheapest way to buy Merino is a simple cap sleeve round neck lightweight merino T-shirt and if yer skin is sensitive it won't be as bothered by the lightest stuff

    every layer after that can be plastic, wool or plastic there isnt really much insulating value from those base pieces
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  10. #60
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    Sep 2016
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    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    You want merino cuz it doesnt stink but merino is expensive compared to plastic and it doesnt wear well atall

    SO the cheapest way to buy Merino is a simple cap sleeve round neck lightweight merino T-shirt and if yer skin is sensitive it won't be as bothered by the lightest stuff

    every layer after that can be plastic, wool or plastic there isnt really much insulating value from those base pieces
    This is great in theory, but in practice, the sweat just seeps through the merino and into the synthetic and makes the synthetic smell terrible.

  11. #61
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    Mar 2008
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    northern BC
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    well 1st of all you wana manage your heat by not wearing insulation on the skin track ... If I do it right I don't sweat in the BC in BC
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  12. #62
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
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    878
    Get a breathable mid layer, it's a game changer! Save the wind "protection" for shells.

    The new TNF Ventrix is the TITS and has quickly become my favorite insulating layer above fleece level of warmth. I even sold my ultralight RAB xenon. Never really feel I need extra wind protection unless it's the kinda wind were you almost want to wear goggles the entire time.

  13. #63
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    Jan 2017
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    Austin, TX
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorCalNomad View Post
    Get a breathable mid layer, it's a game changer! Save the wind "protection" for shells.

    The new TNF Ventrix is the TITS and has quickly become my favorite insulating layer above fleece level of warmth. I even sold my ultralight RAB xenon. Never really feel I need extra wind protection unless it's the kinda wind were you almost want to wear goggles the entire time.
    Why? Everything you just said goes against the entirety of this thread...

    What makes it better?

  14. #64
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
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    bottom of the hobacks
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    484
    I seriously love my arcteryx atom SL hoody. It breathes wonderfully and has enough soft shell ish fabric to cut wind and light precip. It's all I hike in since picking it up
    Quote Originally Posted by The SnowShow View Post
    Keystone is the new Snowbird

  15. #65
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
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    878
    Quote Originally Posted by thejongiest View Post
    Why? Everything you just said goes against the entirety of this thread...

    What makes it better?
    Honestly didn't read the entire thread.

    I run really hot, and sweat super easily once I get moving so having breathable stuff for me is imperative. So my go to for going uphill is thin base layer (almost zero insulation value), then the Ventrix over that. If it is windy/ cold enough for the wind to blow out the heat that I'm putting out then usually a softshell will go over that. Even a non bonded softshell (schoeller 400) for me doesn't breath as well as the Ventrix.

    I don't even use any sort of synthetic/ down insulation for lift skiing most times. Usually it's thicker base layer, a 100-150 weight fleece, then a 2L Gore Shell. For the real cold days the mid fleece will get switched out for insulation.

    The RAB even though it was really warm and light as hell would trap body moisture almost better than Goretex. So it'd have to be REALLY cold for me to want to use it while Touring (which was almost never). Climbing/ Lifts was kinda a different thing, but not enough for me to want to keep it. Maybe if I'd bought it in a big enough size to be worn as my change over/ belay layer then it'd be worth keeping.

    Also on a day to day basis, if it's colder than just a 100 weight fleece day I use the Ventrix as my go to jacket.
    TLDR; Ski faster. Quit breathing. Don't crash.

  16. #66
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
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    Colorado Front Range
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    In keeping with your original question (OP), I became aware of another OR product (apart from the Cathode) - the Ascendant Hoody:

    https://www.outdoorresearch.com/us/e.../2500990561007

    The Ascendant is supposed to be a bit more breathable than the Uberlayer, which may not be what you're after.

    ... Thom
    Galibier Design
    crafting technology in service of music

  17. #67
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Austin, TX
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    Yeah I saw that, sounds just like slightly more wind-resistant high-tech fleece.

    I ended up keeping the Xenon-X for everyday wear plus as an outer layer while taking breaks, plus I picked up a OR Whirlwind Hoody.

    I have a Marmot M3 softshell which is on the heavier side and then the Whirlwind for warmer days, plus an R1-style fleece. I think it'll be a good quiver of jackets, but I'll report back (if I remember to) about how it all works out.

  18. #68
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Reno, NV
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    199
    There was some good info here so I thought I'd just revive the thread. I'm looking for a lightweight synthetic or down for primarily an outer layer for the down. Ideally 80-130g synthetic insulation with a higher denier/more abrasion resistant fabric. Current layer system is as follows:
    Capilene lightweight
    Nano Air Hybrid vest
    Ferrosi or Gamma LT Hoody
    Atom LT Hoody

    Looking for something a little warmer/weather resistant than the Atom LT and maybe a little longer in the torso. Ideally with internal drop-in pockets for skins/gloves. I have the Rab Xenon, NW Alpine Belay Jacket, Atom AR and OR Refuge Hooded Jacket on the radar. Any folks have experiences with any of these? Anything else that I should be looking at? Please no Patagucci recommendations, the Micro/Micro/Nano all seem too fragile for an outer layer, skiing through trees, etc.

  19. #69
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
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    northern BC
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    what do you expect to do with it and where ?
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  20. #70
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Reno, NV
    Posts
    199
    When I said "for the down" and "for an outer layer, skiing through trees" I meant I'll be using it to throw on over all other layers for descents. Mainly Tahoe/West Coast.

    Quote Originally Posted by XXX-er View Post
    what do you expect to do with it and where ?

  21. #71
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    Mar 2008
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    northern BC
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    https://www.wildsnow.com/27419/perfe...ouring-layers/

    here is another ^^ things that people wear thread

    I'm a proponent of the " puffy over " method talked about in the artical, so no mid layer just a thinner soft shell ( R1 ) and a puffy when I stop
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  22. #72
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    Sep 2016
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    I've been trying to go really slow on the up, nose breathing, and an R1 type of baselayer and a light shell with pitzips open has been working well. Puffy over at the top for the descent or, if friends are slow transitioning, and we're only doing one lap, I may take the time to get the insulation layer underneath the shell. Especially if there will be tight trees.
    Slow and steady has been a game changer for me.

  23. #73
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Reno, NV
    Posts
    199
    Thanks, ya I have my layering system pretty dialed - pretty similar to what was described in the wildsnow article. Just looking for recommendations on the "puffy over" layer as described or one of the models I listed in my post as my Atom LT got a little shredded by some trees and I'd like to dial up with warmth/weather protection just a tad from the Atom LT.

  24. #74
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
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    i usually wait till later in the season and buy whatever puffy I can buy locally at 40-50 % off,

    right now its -32 C ( -25F ) so one puffy isnt going to cover it all, right now I use a big fucking RAB Neutrino which is awesume and a lighter Faction above -10C,

    ten acious tape for fixing big holes in puffies for small one try liquid bandage or nailpolish

    the cool thing about the Rab is its warm enough for anything

    the cool thing about Faction is the huge inner pockets the size of the front of the jacket which every jacket should have, i pointed out to the store owner " bro these coats are great for shop lifting "
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  25. #75
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Zurich, Switzerland
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    5,626
    If the Micro and Nano stuff is too fragile, the Xenon will be too. It's essentially the same. Sounds like you need a hardshell puffy for durability reasons. Most of the non-hardshell ones are designed with low denier fabric for weight purposes and will shred. You'll probably land in the 16-20oz weight range.

    The Mountain Equipment Prophet is one suggestion.

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