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  1. #326
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Dystopia
    Posts
    21,053
    Quote Originally Posted by Spyderjon View Post
    Tune edges for the next season and then give them a light rub with a block of wax. The very thin film of wax will repel moisture/prevent rusting but will ski off in a run or two. Zardoz Notwax/Base Boost is also a good rust preventative on edges.

    Do not use oil/grease/petroleum jelly etc on the edges. Every season I get a few pairs in for service and the owners have applied Vaseline the edges which penetrates in to the p-tex adjacent to the edge and is nigh on impossible to get out and it seems inhibit future wax absorption etc.
    Quote Originally Posted by fleaches View Post
    I have started doing this after almost every time I ski since moving somewhere damp and salty. Way faster than waxing every time but does a good job keeping the rust away.

    Sent from my Pixel XL using TGR Forums mobile app
    Thank you!

    Years ago when I learned storage waxing it was always a heavy and unscraped hot wax.

    The fact that a light wax rub does the same thing (for the edges) makes me happy. So much easier. Thx.

    I know summer waxing helps bases not dry out. But if you recently waxed them, they’re fine. (And UV not wax treatments shouldn’t dry out).

    But I’ve been burned before taking out a pair in late fall and having rusty ass edges. Some brands really like to rust.

    Also cool idea of warm season edge wax rub. Sometimes the skis want to rust inside the roof box.
    . . .

  2. #327
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
    Posts
    30,879
    YMMV but i never do storage wax and i never get rusty edges,

    the ony time a ski has rusted IME is if they are put away wet with the edges touching

    so they gotta be taken in doors and put up against the wall to dry after being separated
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

  3. #328
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,963
    Quote Originally Posted by Spyderjon View Post
    Do not use oil/grease/petroleum jelly etc on the edges. Every season I get a few pairs in for service and the owners have applied Vaseline the edges which penetrates in to the p-tex adjacent to the edge and is nigh on impossible to get out and it seems inhibit future wax absorption etc.
    What about k-y and other water based lubes. For many of us, that’s more handy




    :P

  4. #329
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Posts
    1,279
    If you're a Phantom fan boy, just ignore this post, ok?
    I'm wondering what a "real" mag has to say after a few seasons of Phantom.

    I'm probably most interested in spring glop performance.
    (You know the face-planting glory that's sunny spring, 50-degree,day, "goodness," after noon. Bestest when it was 20, and snowed yesterday. LOL)

    How good do you really feel it is after at least one, preferably 2-3 seasons? Would you do it again?
    Do you _really_ not wax, ever? Or is it more like - "Well I wax, but half as often as before. And if it's going to be a good day I wax anyway."

  5. #330
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,063
    My bro that's phantomed a few of his skis still waxed over the top of phantom and also liberally used Zardoz in springtime. Fucker was definitely fast.
    Zardoz for spring is a must!

  6. #331
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    on the banks of Fish Creek
    Posts
    7,512
    si.

  7. #332
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Posts
    1,279
    Quote Originally Posted by tuco View Post
    My bro that's phantomed a few of his skis still waxed over the top of phantom and also liberally used Zardoz in springtime. Fucker was definitely fast.
    Zardoz for spring is a must!
    Still, it sounds like waxing is "better" in general. Perhaps substantially so.
    And I've had very good luck with crayon-ing on the wax (Moly Wintersteiger or Graphite KUU) for the worst spring days. (Even then, there's a few days, after noon, where it's really just not worth it, unless you're super desperate for the vert. There's just not anything (wax, phantom, zardoz, etc) that's going to make it "good" just varying levels of suck - from bad to unbelievably bad.)

    [Editing to add: This last year, I had a locker (shared with a buddy) and didn't often haul skis home to wax. (And I'm WAY to cheap to pay for a wax at the resort.) I had very good success with crayon-ing on most all the time. Occasionally I'd cork them a bit after crayon - but not often. Probably not as good as hot wax, but I was still pretty happy. Phantom would work well in that situation, which is partly why I asked. But given all the details, I'm probably just going to stick with wax. It takes me 2-3 minutes to crayon up, a bit more to hot wax, if they're not stuck in the locker. I can pay for a lot of wax for $85/pair of skis. And it's only a minimal use of my time on days when I'm not working anyway.]

    Thanks for at least some beta!

    @mc2711c
    Eh? Por que?
    Last edited by gregorys; 08-08-2022 at 07:57 AM.

  8. #333
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    my own little world
    Posts
    5,838
    Phantom is on my radar as maybe a good solution for a “travel ski”…
    focus.

  9. #334
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    The Backcounty
    Posts
    534
    I did it to my new set of skis last year. Very fast when I was on colder snow in wy, ut, co. I never waxed all season like 50-60 days. It really preformed well on days when the snow temp was rapidly warming. I wouldn't notice as much slowdown or sticky as my friends on the really warm days. It seems like it just helps keep a higher baseline. The skis never really fall off to the super slow category. I plan to wax again before this season. I think I would definitely do it again next time. Apply in peak summer or pay for UV curing as I hear if it doesn't go off properly the performance suffers.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    4 Time Balboa Open Champion

  10. #335
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    564
    I’ve been using Phantom for several years. I have it on a couple of pair that I use often. They are bigger/fatter so more of a pain to wax and scrape. It works well but I also wax them occasionally. I bought some more on sale this year and plan to do a couple more pairs. (If that gives you any indication if I like it or not)

    FWIW, I started experimenting with liquid wax this year. I am a convert. It’s real quick & easy to apply, even in the morning before I leave, so I used it quite a bit last year. You still need to hot wax occasionally but it lengthens the time between sessions.

  11. #336
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,063
    Quote Originally Posted by gregorys View Post
    Still, it sounds like waxing is "better" in general. Perhaps substantially so.
    And I've had very good luck with crayon-ing on the wax (Moly Wintersteiger or Graphite KUU) for the worst spring days. (Even then, there's a few days, after noon, where it's really just not worth it, unless you're super desperate for the vert. There's just not anything (wax, phantom, zardoz, etc) that's going to make it "good" just varying levels of suck - from bad to unbelievably bad.)

    [Editing to add: This last year, I had a locker (shared with a buddy) and didn't often haul skis home to wax. (And I'm WAY to cheap to pay for a wax at the resort.) I had very good success with crayon-ing on most all the time. Occasionally I'd cork them a bit after crayon - but not often. Probably not as good as hot wax, but I was still pretty happy. Phantom would work well in that situation, which is partly why I asked. But given all the details, I'm probably just going to stick with wax. It takes me 2-3 minutes to crayon up, a bit more to hot wax, if they're not stuck in the locker. I can pay for a lot of wax for $85/pair of skis. And it's only a minimal use of my time on days when I'm not working anyway.]

    Thanks for at least some beta!

    @mc2711c
    Eh? Por que?
    We'll, when I watch the dude pull away from me in the gliding circumstances, yeah, I'd say it works. But, the dude does own a ski shoppe and is a tuner too, so his skis are always super clean! He waxes his phantomed skis
    and then basically pours Zardoz on and spreads it around (not just wipe) and let's it sit and absorb in. Seems to work pretty good from what I've witnessed.

  12. #337
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    No longer somewhere in Idaho
    Posts
    1,990
    I’ve been disappointed, but maybe my cure wasn’t great. WA sunlight in april might not have been strong enough. I still wax a lot; i was hoping for a silver bullet for the travel skis


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    Gravity always wins...

  13. #338
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    SLC
    Posts
    2,455
    Quote Originally Posted by riff View Post
    I’ve been disappointed, but maybe my cure wasn’t great. WA sunlight in april might not have been strong enough. I still wax a lot; i was hoping for a silver bullet for the travel skis
    Did you apply it this April for the first time or do you have experience with it in winter? I would imagine it is much less effective in warm conditions, and Washington spring is about as brutal as it gets for destroying wax

  14. #339
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Rossland BC
    Posts
    1,879

    DPS Phantom Glide

    Quote Originally Posted by gregorys View Post
    If you're a Phantom fan boy, just ignore this post, ok?
    I'm wondering what a "real" mag has to say after a few seasons of Phantom.

    I'm probably most interested in spring glop performance.
    (You know the face-planting glory that's sunny spring, 50-degree,day, "goodness," after noon. Bestest when it was 20, and snowed yesterday. LOL)

    How good do you really feel it is after at least one, preferably 2-3 seasons? Would you do it again?
    Do you _really_ not wax, ever? Or is it more like - "Well I wax, but half as often as before. And if it's going to be a good day I wax anyway."
    I have Phantom applied to both pairs of my touring skis. The “factory” application (2 seasons) seems to work better than the home (3 seasons), so my comments are for the newer (they keep tweaking the formulation) and factory applied Phantom.
    It’s definitely not as slick as a fresh and temperature specific wax and base prep. Not even close. I’ve been waxing skis forever, and getting up early and prepping my skis is part of my routine for a great day on the lifts. They claim, that Phantom plus wax is better than just wax, but I have no way of quantifying this. For ski touring, I’m less concerned about high performance glide, I just want them to work, and almost all of the time that’s the case with Phantom. I appreciate that I can head off for a week in the mountains, or encounter a range of snow conditions at different elevations and aspects, and that my bases will work well enough. I also have endless issues with skin glue durability, and I imagine that minimizing the skin glue:ski wax interaction might be a good thing. I’ll still wax on the Phantom occasionally, for exceptionally cold conditions, or just because I have time and want to give my skis some love, but I’m sure a less discerning skier could get away with never waxing. For touring skis, especially if you have the opportunity to get it applied professionally, or for someone that doesn’t or can’t wax their skis on a regular basis and isn’t concerned with maximum performance, or for anyone paying for waxes and who can probably save on waxing less regularly, I think Phantom makes a lot of sense. If you’re already waxing regularly, and the price is significant, it’s not going to make enough of a difference to be worth it.

  15. #340
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    西 雅 圖
    Posts
    5,359
    Quote Originally Posted by kootenayskier View Post
    I have Phantom applied to both pairs of my touring skis. The “factory” application (2 seasons) seems to work better than the home (3 seasons), so my comments are for the newer (they keep tweaking the formulation) and factory applied Phantom.
    It’s definitely not as slick as a fresh and temperature specific wax and base prep. Not even close. I’ve been waxing skis forever, and getting up early and prepping my skis is part of my routine for a great day on the lifts. They claim, that Phantom plus wax is better than just wax, but I have no way of quantifying this. For ski touring, I’m less concerned about high performance glide, I just want them to work, and almost all of the time that’s the case with Phantom. I appreciate that I can head off for a week in the mountains, or encounter a range of snow conditions at different elevations and aspects, and that my bases will work well enough. I also have endless issues with skin glue durability, and I imagine that minimizing the skin glue:ski wax interaction might be a good thing. I’ll still wax on the Phantom occasionally, for exceptionally cold conditions, or just because I have time and want to give my skis some love, but I’m sure a less discerning skier could get away with never waxing. For touring skis, especially if you have the opportunity to get it applied professionally, or for someone that doesn’t or can’t wax their skis on a regular basis and isn’t concerned with maximum performance, or for anyone paying for waxes and who can probably save on waxing less regularly, I think Phantom makes a lot of sense. If you’re already waxing regularly, and the price is significant, it’s not going to make enough of a difference to be worth it.
    Exactly what kootenayskier says.

    I have Phantom on 4 pairs of skis, and even though I don't really "pay" for it other than trying to fit into the shop schedule so I'm not in their way while I apply it, I'm pretty much just doing it on my travel skis now. That means skis I'll take for more than 3 days when I can't get to my waxing bench. If you wax a bunch and know what you're doing, that's always going to be faster, but after 3-4 days, especially on hard snow, the worst performance you'll get will be substantially better than a non-Phantomed ski, especially in high water content snow.

  16. #341
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    西 雅 圖
    Posts
    5,359
    Quote Originally Posted by gregL View Post
    Exactly what kootenayskier says.

    I have Phantom on 4 pairs of skis, and even though I don't really "pay" for it other than trying to fit into the shop schedule so I'm not in their way while I apply it, I'm pretty much just doing it on my travel skis now. That means skis I'll take for more than 3 days when I can't get to my waxing bench. If you wax a bunch and know what you're doing, that's always going to be faster, but after 3-4 days, especially on hard snow, the worst performance you'll get will be substantially better than a non-Phantomed ski, especially in high water content snow.
    PS If you live anywhere other than the desert, I'd think twice about trying to DIY - something as minor as clouds going overhead can cause the Phantom solution(s) not to "take." The DPS curing stations are ideal, and the duration has come way down since the product was introduced, plus the current formula requires only one chemical application, not two.

  17. #342
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    No longer somewhere in Idaho
    Posts
    1,990
    Dang. This might be a cause of my lackluster results.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    Gravity always wins...

  18. #343
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    2,185
    Quote Originally Posted by gregorys View Post
    If you're a Phantom fan boy, just ignore this post, ok?
    I'm wondering what a "real" mag has to say after a few seasons of Phantom.

    I'm probably most interested in spring glop performance.
    (You know the face-planting glory that's sunny spring, 50-degree,day, "goodness," after noon. Bestest when it was 20, and snowed yesterday. LOL)

    How good do you really feel it is after at least one, preferably 2-3 seasons? Would you do it again?
    Do you _really_ not wax, ever? Or is it more like - "Well I wax, but half as often as before. And if it's going to be a good day I wax anyway."
    I was a tester for Phantom before they started retail sales. Since then, I've used it as a base treatment on all new race skis, on every pair of resort and backcountry skis, and I've used it in every possible ski condition. It's fantastic in spring conditions, times where water content is super high, etc. I was at Bridger the last day of the season and it was extremely warm (water under the snow) and I got in and had a beer ordered before the rest of my crew. So for the conditions you asked about it's fantastic. The only time I have waxed over it was for race days with extremely cold and dry conditions. My daughter was a college racer and used a powder overlay on really cold days.

    My coaching skis were the first pair I had Phantom on and they have 300+ days on them, they're shot, but they still glide like day one. I have done zero waxing of those over the years. I frankly haven't waxed my other resort or BC skis. I have a couple new pair in the box right now getting their Phantom so yeah I would absolutely do it again. Another plus is it makes removing skins a lot easier FYI.
    Five minutes into the drive and you're already driving me crazy...

  19. #344
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Park City
    Posts
    5,013
    It’s just such a financial hit to do the whole family’s skis. I’d need to do 20 plus pair


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    I rip the groomed on tele gear

  20. #345
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Basalt
    Posts
    4,944
    With the 2023 version of Phantom....still worth having Phantom done at a shop with a UV box?
    "We had nice 3 days in your autonomous mountain realm last weekend." - Tom from Austria (the Rax ski guy)

  21. #346
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    307
    I have found the reduced time in the sun, once versus twice, a lot easier to manage.

    on another note, the new phantom base care package? is it something more than a wet-wipe, and a rough then a fine fibertex pad? I'm a bit confused by that product.

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