Public Comment on peak season fee increases at 17 highly visited parks

[Jong Lafitte]

Sorry if someone posted this, a quick search didn't show anything...


anyway...Looks like a proposal for major day-pass fee hikes in 17 National Parks and there is a public comment period open at the moment. (Arches, Bryce Canyon, Canyonlands, Denali, Glacier, Grand Canyon, Grand Teton, Olympic, Sequoia & Kings Canyon, Yellowstone, Yosemite, and Zion National Parks with peak season starting on May 1, 2018; in Acadia, Mount Rainier, Rocky Mountain, and Shenandoah National Parks with peak season starting on June 1, 2018; and in Joshua Tree National Park as soon as practicable in 2018.)

https://www.nps.gov/orgs/1207/10-24-...s-proposal.htm

from the release:

"If implemented, estimates suggest that the peak-season price structure could increase national park revenue by $70 million per year. That is a 34 percent increase over the $200 million collected in Fiscal Year 2016. Under the Federal Lands Recreation Enhancement Act, 80% of an entrance fee remains in the park where it is collected. The other 20% is spent on projects in other national parks.

During the peak season at each park, the entrance fee would be $70 per private, non-commercial vehicle, $50 per motorcycle, and $30 per person on bike or foot. A park-specific annual pass for any of the 17 parks would be available for $75.

The cost of the annual America the Beautiful- The National Parks and Federal Recreational Lands Pass, which provides entrance to all federal lands, including parks for a one-year period, would remain $80. Entrance fees are not charged to visitors under 16 years of age or holders of Senior, Military, Access, Volunteer, or Every Kid in a Park (EKIP) passes. The majority of national parks will remain free to enter; only 118 of 417 park sites charge an entrance fee, and the current proposal only raises fees at 17 fee-charging parks"


same release notes earlier that: "A public comment period on the peak-season entrance fee proposal will be open from October 24, 2017 to November 23, 2017, on the NPS Planning, Environment and Public Comment (PEPC) website https://parkplanning.nps.gov/proposedpeakseasonfeerates. Written comments can be sent to 1849 C Street, NW, Mail Stop: 2346 Washington, DC 20240."

[doebedoe]

While gut reaction is that this is going to reduce visitation, I wouldn't be surprised to see it increase visitation. People will buy the America the Beautiful pass for $10 more and come back.

I'm okay with this -- make it expensive to visit once. But not expensive to use regularly. It's the Vail Resorts model -- which hate it for the crowds it produces, fucking makes a ton of money.

Hookers and blow ain't cheap these days either.

[hatchgreenchile]

More than anything, I'm bummed it's come to this. Neither side of the aisle is particularly interested in fully funding and supporting the Interior Department. Without getting too political, I hope public lands get the funding, maintenance and improvements they need for a growing population.

I also buy the $80 all parks pass, so I'm indifferent to the daily rates. It's still a smoking deal for visitors, and cheaper than a night out eating and drinking downtown . I don't expect this to change visitation numbers. While it does suck that certain areas of parks are complete shitshows for months at a time and essentially not worth visiting(Here's looking at you, Bear Lake Rd) during peak season, I guess I'd selfishly prefer that 80% of the people remain in 20% of the places.

[brutah]

More than anything, I'm bummed it's come to this. Neither side of the aisle is particularly interested in fully funding and supporting the Interior Department. Without getting too political, I hope public lands get the funding, maintenance and improvements they need for a growing population.

Ya it's definitely a bummer that protecting and funding public lands, something that recieves a ton of public support, has become a partisan issue. Public lands need rangers and stewardship or they get trashed and loved to death. I blame rob bishop, the utah congressman that sits at the head of the natural resources board who receives almost all his campaign financing from oil & gas companies, he constantly introduces bills to cut funding for natural resources and reducing public lands like the current "HR 3990 - National Monument Creation and Protection Act." If you like to recreate outdoors on public lands, this dude is public enemy number one.

I don't think the price increase will lower admissions, National Parks are still cheaper for a family vacation than heading to an amusement park or Vail resorts. It does make the annual pass that much more appealing. the one thing I wish they would do, which they won't, is lower campground fees. I get that a lot of campgrounds are sold out throughout most of prime season nowadays, so they probaly won't lower fees, but holy shit, $30ish a night for a spot on the ground? I can find hostels and hotel rooms for cheaper than that.

[Dantheman]

I'm pretty indifferent to the vehicle fees. These parks need the money, it makes the annual pass a no-brainer, and I generally avoid these places peak season anyway. However, $30/person on bike/foot? Get the fuck out of here. They should be cutting those prices.

[GeezerSteve]

Neither side of the aisle is particularly interested in fully funding and supporting the Interior Department.

Check your facts. NPS and USFS decreased funding correlates with GOP-controlled Congress. The only years for which NPS and USFS have increased (adjusted for inflation) in the past 30 years were Dem-controlled Congress.

However, $30/person on bike/foot? Get the fuck out of here. They should be cutting those prices.

+1

[plugboots]

I kinda feel like the National Parks, (& the fact that they exist), benefit all Americans. Even if people don’t go there directly, we all benefit by having that land set aside & the animals protected etc.
To me it’s almost like having cheap healthcare for all Americans because we all benefit by having every American healthy.
It’s really unfortunate it’s become partisan.

[GeezerSteve]

It’s really unfortunate it’s become partisan.

Indeed, for all the reasons you state. NPS and USFS funding is but a relatively small part of the bigger partisan issue re nearly all domestic discretionary spending.

[hatchgreenchile]

Check your facts. NPS and USFS decreased funding correlates with GOP-controlled Congress. The only years for which NPS and USFS have increased (adjusted for inflation) in the past 30 years were Dem-controlled Congress.

+1

Yet, here we are, woefully underfunding our most popular scenic attractions.
I don't think either side of the aisle has anything to be proud of. Trail volunteers aren't enough. It takes $$$.
I'm just waiting until all the popular NP corridors are reservation only.

[brutah]

I'm just waiting until all the popular NP corridors are reservation only.

That's what they're proposing doing in Zion currently.
Gonna be a total bummer, I hate the current reservation system that makes you plan a backpacking trip a year in advance. I don't have that kind of foresight!

[dunfree]

I don't get how it will help. $80 for an America the beautiful pass vs. $70 for a single car entrance? They need to raise the "season pass" price too.

[doebedoe]

I don't get how it will help. $80 for an America the beautiful pass vs. $70 for a single car entrance? They need to raise the "season pass" price too.

Because people will end up spending $80 instead of $20 it costs now -- thinking they may as well buy the annual in case they get close to another. Same way vail makes more money now on passes then when it had cheap day passes.

[GeezerSteve]

Yet, here we are, woefully underfunding our most popular scenic attractions.
I don't think either side of the aisle has anything to be proud of.

Again, check your facts. Of the past 15 Congresses, 2 were controlled by Dems and both increased NPS and USFS funding. Gutting of NPS and USPS funding lies squarely on the shoulders of GOP-controlled Congresses who promised over and over again that smaller government (except defen$e, of course) will make us free. Those are the facts. The "all politicians are the same" meme is tired and inaccurate bullshit re the issue of NPS funding.

[doebedoe]

That's what they're proposing doing in Zion currently.
Gonna be a total bummer, I hate the current reservation system that makes you plan a backpacking trip a year in advance. I don't have that kind of foresight!

There is a huge federal contract that was recently awarded to overhaul the reservation system / technology. Not sure this means it won't still suck, or will let you plan later, but at least its probably changing.

[Dantheman]

That's what they're proposing doing in Zion currently.
Gonna be a total bummer, I hate the current reservation system that makes you plan a backpacking trip a year in advance. I don't have that kind of foresight!

Embrace trail running?

[hatchgreenchile]

No interest in that Steve, I'll take a hard pass on detail political conversation on the intertoobz.
I'm bummed that it's come to this, and I'm not happy with the results on either side on the aisle. I'll leave it at that.

Anyway, I bet this passes. People will pay $70 for a week of access.

[The SnowShow]

I think it's pretty disgusting to not make the parks accessible to all Americans. Again, more and more things are only for the upper class.

[GeezerSteve]

No interest in that Steve, take it to the Rubble.

You started it with your erroneous "neither side of the aisle" claim. If you want to avoid politics, don't open the door by making a obviously political statement.

[PNWbrit]

Absolutely obscene.

[hatchgreenchile]

You started it with your erroneous "neither side of the aisle" claim. If you want to avoid politics, don't open the door by making a obviously political statement.

OK, I do have to laugh at "You started it". We're rich dentists, not 8 years olds. Thank you for the chuckle.
Anyway, I apologize for taking the crazy stance of disappointment in the current state of affairs.

[grskier]

It needs to be more $$, this might be a tad too much.. but working with these entities (well, not the NPS) I see how short on resources they are, sadly.

[dunfree]

Because people will end up spending $80 instead of $20 it costs now -- thinking they may as well buy the annual in case they get close to another. Same way vail makes more money now on passes then when it had cheap day passes.

Vail sells season passes to make lots of non-refundable revenue before the season opens and offload risk. Then it makes money on everything else they sell for the vacations. Le$$ons, food, rooms, gear, etc. Not the same idea.

The parks have the problem they are swamped in peak season. A 3-hr wait to enter Yosemite on 4th of July weekend https://www.nps.gov/yose/learn/news/...ly-weekend.htm means it's not accessible to all as it is, and there will eventually have to be some way to limit access, or just spread utilization.

I'd gladly spend more just to fund repairs on what's there.