Show us yer Touring Quivers!

[galibier_numero_un]

That's an awesome quiver.

How do you like the MVP 119s? I have the Praxis FRS (almost a MVP 119) with alpine bindings - I commented that it would be a sweet shape for backcountry pow touring.

This has my attention.

Also, follow along with the question I just posted to the Praxis thread (Ullr vs. FRS).

... Thom

[grrrmountainman]

-Day to day are the DPS wailer 112's. Fun ski.
-Extrem Opinion 108's I had to buy in Chamonix after a pair of wailers broke - they are my rock ski/shitty conditions
-BMT 122's. Awesome ski - we just don't get powder deep enough in the north rockies to warrant them. They are for sale... (canada land)

I run G3 70/30 skins and LaSportiva Spectre boots. Not a fan of pin bindings (tried both dynafit and G3's) so hence the kingpins.. but now, after reading all the shit on this forum, maybe its the ramp angle I don't like about pin bindings. Something to look into.

[Benneke10]

186 Kitten Factory Carbon Pow with Vipecs
178 Hagan Boost 99 with Hagan Pure
170 Hagan Ultra with Helio 200 LT

Atomic Hawx XTD 130
Roxa RX 1.0
Scarpa Alien RS

A ridiculous amount of research and money went into this quiver and I'm pretty happy with it for now.

[meter-man]

Stoked on the Revisions.

187 Praxis Protest (carbon/MAP) with Alpinists. 2448g/ski.
190 Moment Wildcat Tour 108 with Voyager XIVs. 2300g/ski.
183 BD Helio Carbon 95 with Alpinists. 1810g/ski

Crazy how light stuff is. Can't believe I dragged around some mega boat anchors when I was younger and much dumber. My old touring setup 185 Blizzard Cochise with Duke EPFs -- Only 3640g/ski! lol. dumbass

Tecnica ZeroG Pro, 28.5. 1535g/boot (as skied). Will swap in a Booster, and may swap out the liner.




But missing my Tectons. **sniff**

[kid-kapow]

That is a very well tought out quiver! Awesome - well done man.

[mc_roon]

190 Bibby Tour with MTN
192 Spoon 150 with Ions
192 Gen 1 Lotus 138 with Comforts (toe shimmed for ramp angle adjustment)

Scarpa Maestrale RS with booster straps

[dub_xion]

Finally got the 122s mounted! Been really digging the Katanas, though, and getting used to riding them in-area, perfect epic day inbounds ski. 176 BMT 122/Alpinists, 184 VW Katana/Ion LT12, 177 BMT 90/Alpinists

[Benneke10]

I made a very un-TGR move and started touring on shorter skis this season, and I love it. I'm rarely nuking downhill (especially on this lightweight gear) and I enjoy the improved maneuverability on the up and down.

Voile Objective 171
Lightweight Solis clone from Wovn 175
Dynafit Beast 108 173

Ski Trab Titan Vario 1 bindings with ATK heel plates and Contour Hybrid Pure skins on everything

La Sportiva Skorpius every day. I also own Hawx XTD 130 which I used to ski a lot but haven't used since I got the Skorps.

[TG]

Ski Trab Titan Vario 1 bindings with ATK heel plates and Contour Hybrid Pure skins on everything

probably should be in another thread, but since you mention them here :
how are the Contour skins working for you?
does the glue have enough stick over the day/laps to think about going tail-less?

[Benneke10]

probably should be in another thread, but since you mention them here :
how are the Contour skins working for you?
does the glue have enough stick over the day/laps to think about going tail-less?

The Hybrid holds up better than traditional glue over long days, especially when its cold. You do need to clean the adhesive semi-regularly to maintain performance. The Hybrid skins I have for the Objectives have tip notches and tiny fixed tail hooks. There was a day when I had used the skins a lot without cleaning them, and after a few transitions the adhesive wasn't sticking as well and both skins came off the skis and got covered in snow. I was able to scrape the snow off and kept skiing a few more laps without problems, cleaned the adhesive when I got home and haven't had issues since. I think the tail clips are probably good to have with hybrids. I also own some Kohla mohair mix skins for the Objectives, but that is mostly for extra grip when skinning on ice and the more waterproof plush with the nylon. I only use them in spring.

[dub_xion]

How're those Objectives on hard snow?

Working on dialing in the Skorps I got from your buddy. The toe/heel insert positioning create a very reduced ramp angle compared to my Dynafits (Vulcans & TLT6). I'll try to put a ruler up to see what the total effect is. Was thrown wayyy in the back seat on Alpinists which was never a problem in the Dynafits; adding a foam heel wedge under the footbeds should help. Anyway, I think the effective boot ramp angle might be a big part of why some people aren't liking the Alpinist RA.

[turnfarmer]

How're those Objectives on hard snow?

Working on dialing in the Skorps I got from your buddy. The toe/heel insert positioning create a very reduced ramp angle compared to my Dynafits (Vulcans & TLT6). I'll try to put a ruler up to see what the total effect is. Was thrown wayyy in the back seat on Alpinists which was never a problem in the Dynafits; adding a foam heel wedge under the footbeds should help. Anyway, I think the effective boot ramp angle might be a big part of why some people aren't liking the Alpinist RA.

As you’ve found boots are part of the binding delta equation for tech bindings. There no standard height of toe and heel inserts. In addition AT boot internal ramp angles vary more than Alpine which have evolved to be mostly about 4 degrees.

This makes it even trickier than Alpine. Although WTR and Gripwalk have now muddied the Alpine delta set up.

Re heel lift in boots-
Heel lifts inside the boot are different than binding delta.

Inside the boot affects the foot and ankle.

Outside the boot the biomechanics above the ankle- tib-femur, torso/leg ratios.

If you have limited ankle dorsiflexion, a heel lift inside will allow your knee to get forward more getting you out of the backseat.

If you have normal ankle dorsiflexion a heel lift inside will likely bring your knees forward as your body tries to pressure the ball of the foot, probably putting you in the back seat.

If you have excessive ankle dorsiflexion a heel lift will really over flex your knees, putting you in the backseat.

[Benneke10]

How're those Objectives on hard snow?

Working on dialing in the Skorps I got from your buddy. The toe/heel insert positioning create a very reduced ramp angle compared to my Dynafits (Vulcans & TLT6). I'll try to put a ruler up to see what the total effect is. Was thrown wayyy in the back seat on Alpinists which was never a problem in the Dynafits; adding a foam heel wedge under the footbeds should help. Anyway, I think the effective boot ramp angle might be a big part of why some people aren't liking the Alpinist RA.

The Objectives are not very good on hard snow. They are pretty soft with a fair amount of sidecut. I don't take them out when I expect steep firm snow, and when I end up in those conditions on the Objectives I often scare myself. They carve well on consistent, lower angle firm snow but contrary to their name they are not well suited to ski "objectives." I kinda use them as a daily driver because they are amazing in soft snow for such a small ski. They float unbelievably well, and are fun and easy to toss around in forgiving snow. I take the Solis clones when I plan on skiing steep firm snow, they are very stiff and straight and well suited to those conditions. I like having a softer ski for most other days so end up skiing the Objectives most.

The Skorps definitely put your foot in a very flat position compared to other boots. I tried some skis with completely flat ramp bindings and could barely ski, felt like I was doing a wheelie. All my skis have 8mm ramp now, while before I had the Skorps I preferred 5mm or less. You can also increase your forward lean by adjusting the position of the little yellow spoiler on the back of the cuff, I didn't realize that until recently.

[dub_xion]

Nice, thanks turnfarmer! Great info. This might be an empirical process based on budget and "easiest solution first". I've got pretty ok dorsiflection (no injuries/hardware), although probably less than most in this category with tight achilles. I'm very bow-legged. I tend to drive from the shins in the absence of deep pow and prefer as much forward lean as I can get, and the BMT90s seem to like it when I do that. I'll start messing with binding shims if this solution doesn't seem to work well enough. Your comments help narrown down what might be happening as I'm experimenting, so I appreciate it.

On paper, the Skorps have a max forward lean of 16, I think I'd previously tried at the upper spoiler position with probably at 14 (12 is no spoiler I think), so those will go to the lower/steeper position. Vulcans were at the max (18 on paper). I might try some add'l foam behind the calf if the current position isn't good.

As you’ve found boots are part of the binding delta equation for tech bindings. There no standard height of toe and heel inserts. In addition AT boot internal ramp angles vary more than Alpine which have evolved to be mostly about 4 degrees.

This makes it even trickier than Alpine. Although WTR and Gripwalk have now muddied the Alpine delta set up.

Re heel lift in boots-
Heel lifts inside the boot are different than binding delta.

Inside the boot affects the foot and ankle.

Outside the boot the biomechanics above the ankle- tib-femur, torso/leg ratios.

If you have limited ankle dorsiflexion, a heel lift inside will allow your knee to get forward more getting you out of the backseat.

If you have normal ankle dorsiflexion a heel lift inside will likely bring your knees forward as your body tries to pressure the ball of the foot, probably putting you in the back seat.

If you have excessive ankle dorsiflexion a heel lift will really over flex your knees, putting you in the backseat.

[Climbers Right]

I think another thing is the support of the cuff. I've had F1LTs at 13? Degrees (most forward) and scorps without the spoiler. With the cuff fit I found both to be similar stiffness overall. The difference was the skorps start ranking up immediately. 1 degree of shin pressure and I could start to feel supported. The F1LT took a good bit more before the spine engaged and I felt supported. It gave the feeling of having way more effective forward lean and made the skorps feel very upright, which i liked given the right binding pairing.
There's also cuff volume where the skorps are actually snug enough for my chicken legs so some people might be almost in a vice with those things. No slop=no extra lean before the cuff engages for me.

It's all a system. Also the hybrid skins are the best winter skins I've used. They do suffer a bit when things get wet though. It's why i like the pure. Pure hybrids winter, more traditional glue/ nylon mix for spring is ideal. That said I'm usually trying to do more one and done to peaks in spring vs yoyo a few laps in winter where I'm saturating the skin in the wetness more

[turnfarmer]

Nice, thanks turnfarmer! Great info. This might be an empirical process based on budget and "easiest solution first". I've got pretty ok dorsiflection (no injuries/hardware), although probably less than most in this category with tight achilles. I'm very bow-legged. I tend to drive from the shins in the absence of deep pow and prefer as much forward lean as I can get, and the BMT90s seem to like it when I do that. I'll start messing with binding shims if this solution doesn't seem to work well enough. Your comments help narrown down what might be happening as I'm experimenting, so I appreciate it.

On paper, the Skorps have a max forward lean of 16, I think I'd previously tried at the upper spoiler position with probably at 14 (12 is no spoiler I think), so those will go to the lower/steeper position. Vulcans were at the max (18 on paper). I might try some add'l foam behind the calf if the current position isn't good.

If you like a lot of forward lean, that may be a clue that you have excessive dorsiflexion or too high a ramp angle inside your boots. You flex far forward with your shin to pressure the ball of your foot.

Fore aft balance, especially binding delta is my soapbox as dialing it in within a mm or two is needed for some skiers, while others can blissfully ignore it.
Unfortunately I’m in the first group, I’m completely ut of balance if it is wrong.

[rod9301]

As you’ve found boots are part of the binding delta equation for tech bindings. There no standard height of toe and heel inserts. In addition AT boot internal ramp angles vary more than Alpine which have evolved to be mostly about 4 degrees.

This makes it even trickier than Alpine. Although WTR and Gripwalk have now muddied the Alpine delta set up.

Re heel lift in boots-
Heel lifts inside the boot are different than binding delta.

Inside the boot affects the foot and ankle.

Outside the boot the biomechanics above the ankle- tib-femur, torso/leg ratios.

If you have limited ankle dorsiflexion, a heel lift inside will allow your knee to get forward more getting you out of the backseat.

If you have normal ankle dorsiflexion a heel lift inside will likely bring your knees forward as your body tries to pressure the ball of the foot, probably putting you in the back seat.

If you have excessive ankle dorsiflexion a heel lift will really over flex your knees, putting you in the backseat.

Heel lift or not, the angle of your tibia is governed only by the angle of the spine of the boot.

The heel lift helps with limited ankle flexion, do when you bend the boot, your heel doesn't lift up.

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[SoVT Joey]

I’m with turnfarmer in being thrown out by one or two mm of delta. I can ski a dynafit st or a plum guide right out of the box no problem. I had to put a 3/8” shim under the heel of my alpinist to match it to what I needed. If I had known they were so flat I wouldn’t of mounted them. But now that they are shimmed out they ski awesome. I also used my 50/50 boots to set my deltas from my royals to my alpinists and my kingpins. All three of my boots are langes though and share fairly similar ramps and angles.

[gregL]

I’m with turnfarmer in being thrown out by one or two mm of delta. I can ski a dynafit st or a plum guide right out of the box no problem. I had to put a 3/8” shim under the heel of my alpinist to match it to what I needed. If I had known they were so flat I wouldn’t of mounted them. But now that they are shimmed out they ski awesome. I also used my 50/50 boots to set my deltas from my royals to my alpinists and my kingpins. All three of my boots are langes though and share fairly similar ramps and angles.

You're the outlier. I skied bindings with 13 to 18 mm differential for years (Dynafit and Plum) for years and thought I was skiing fine. Then I got a pair of Atomic Backlands and discovered I skied way better with a 8.5 mm ramp. Alpinists are too flat for my tastes.

[SoVT Joey]

You're the outlier. I skied bindings with 13 to 18 mm differential for years (Dynafit and Plum) for years and thought I was skiing fine. Then I got a pair of Atomic Backlands and discovered I skied way better with a 8.5 mm ramp. Alpinists are too flat for my tastes.

for sure. I tried 8mm and it felt like marbles. I can’t get the shovel to hook up.

[waveshello]

I guess it's purely preferential, or physiological. I was touring almost exclusively on cast w/ lupos earlier this year, which is a very flat/upright combo--i love it.

The first time I skied my setup with Dynafit verticals and mercurys this year I almost couldn't figure it out, so hard to get pressure on the front of the skis. Lupos + verticals isn't too bad, but I think I'll shim those toes this summer.

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[Climber Joe]

I guess it's purely preferential, or physiological. I was touring almost exclusively on cast w/ lupos earlier this year, which is a very flat/upright combo--i love it.

The first time I skied my setup with Dynafit verticals and mercurys this year I almost couldn't figure it out, so hard to get pressure on the front of the skis. Lupos + verticals isn't too bad, but I think I'll shim those toes this summer.

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The verticals and speed radicals have an insane amount of ramp angle, I can’t stand it. Here’s a handy chart for angles: https://skimo.co/pin-heights

[Stuntmonkey]

Good place for this question; I'm a touring noob. Does anyone feel strongly about brakes or leashes? I have MTN Pures with no brake on Corvus Freebird that I got off another mag as a starter pack. Lol.

[John_B]

Good place for this question; I'm a touring noob. Does anyone feel strongly about brakes or leashes? I have MTN Pures with no brake on Corvus Freebird that I got off another mag as a starter pack. Lol.

To me it depends on how much you lose skis. As a fairly conservative bc skier I'm fine with leashes as long as they've got a breakable "fuse" in them.

184cm DPS Lotus 124 Tour1s with SuperRadicals
184cm Wailer 99s in Pure2 with Speed Radicals.

It's funny that my setup that is 25mm wider is also my lighter setup but my god those are a nice mid winter ski! I got them midway through the winter and am pumped to get some more miles on them this year.

Toes are shimmed on the SpeedRads and the heels of the SuperRads have a B&D adjustment plate so pin deltas are about the same and I have an easy time switching between skis.

[caulfield]

Does anyone feel strongly about...

haha have you met the internet?

For me, same answer as John_B. I have b&d leashes that are long enough to leave connected to my boots during exposed transitions or sketchy bootpacks. I like that, and probably wouldn't want short leashes. But also brakes would be fine. On brakeless MTNs specifically, you can decrease the toe-heel delta by losing the plastic piece under the heel. I also like that, but it's another strong opinion topic.