2017/2018 ofishul orygun thread

**mattig** · 10-21-2018, 10:38 AM

Also curious about the claims. As AC said, would love a demo.

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**TBS** · 10-21-2018, 10:45 AM

^^^That was my interpretation as well Schralph. Great if you have cell service, pretty much worthless if you don’t. Sending a drone out to search for my phone is a needle-haystack exercise IMO. WiFi signal on my phone is maybe 30 meters; Bluetooth is about 10’ on a good day

I did some consulting for these guys about five years ago. Https://ubimodo.com

Very similar model only they also offer a search/evac insurance policy, and have some algorithms for quickly finding people based on thousands of SAR reports

If you need real backcountry location services get a delorme inreach

**mattig** · 10-21-2018, 12:01 PM

As far as "oh shit" buttons go, my understanding is that ACR is the way to go. Hope to never have firsthand feedback.

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**SchralphMacchio** · 10-21-2018, 05:08 PM

I think Delorme Inreach uses the same satellite network and indecent response center as Spot. Spot is picked up by Globalstar sat phone network, so there are areas outside of the continental 48 states with limited service windows based on satellite position. Spot’s private incident response center notifies the local authority having jurisdiction for SAR at the GPS location (or sat triangulated search area if the spot was not able to process and upload GPS data). When you register with Spot they keep relevant medical info on file.

ACR and McMurdo PLB devices use the 406 MHz government satellite network which is comprised of NOAA low earth orbit weather satellites in US and COSPAS SARSAT satellites internationally. In the US any rescue signal is picked up by the Air Force Rescue Coordination Center, which uses the GPS data or triangulated data to notify the proper SAR authority and forward the info on file (which you can populate with blood type, other medical info, and info about your craft or mode of travel). Because these are government services you as the user are not charged recurring fees, unlike Spot. But Spot and Inreach support other message types while this one is “oh shit send help” only.

I’ll have to do a little more homework on Ubimodo.

Knowledge disclaimers: I don’t volly for SAR work ... 8 years ago I discovered a congenital medical condition which could be fatal in the backcountry (left apical spontaneous pneumothorax) so I did a lot of research on how the various emergency notification systems work and talked with county SAR people, so that’s how I know some of this stuff. I also work with RF electronics professionally. I think I either started a thread on the various emergency notification products on TGR or bumped all the info into my “oh shit my lung exploded” trip report thread. Thankfully my lung surgery seemed to “fix the issue” and I haven’t sprung a leak in the last 8 years, so other than being in emergency incidents in areas with cell coverage I have no end-end firsthand experience with these emergency notification products.

**mattig** · 10-21-2018, 05:47 PM

Hadn't heard of McMurdo, but all the offshore fisherman run ACRs, which is why I got one and will probably get another for family. Wrestled with spending the money, but considering where we sometimes camp, fish, hunt, hike, etc. I've really enjoyed the peace of mind.

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**TBS** · 10-21-2018, 08:41 PM

Inreach uses Irridium network; spot uses Globalstar. Inreach has way more satellites.

Here’s a good summary of features for various units
http://www.gpscentral.ca/products/tr...omparison.html

Damn Spralph, a spontaneous pneumothorax must have been “interesting”. Good friend collapsed his lung last spring, but he belly-flopped on a ski which ruptured a bleb and started a slow leak. Spent a week in hospital and got the lesion stapled shut. We suggested Stan’s to seal it up but docs weren’t impressed.

**SchralphMacchio** · 10-21-2018, 09:00 PM

Sounds like your friend may have had a similar procedure as me. Normal treatment for a bleb is to install a Heimlich valve and allow the rupture to heal on its own - staples wouldn’t be used unless the rupture was pretty serious or they wanted to resect (cut out) a problematic area. I had all of the above done, Heimlich valve for a week and then emergency surgery and wedge resection closed with titanium staples, when my lung ruptured again as they were removing the Heimlich valve. Then a couple months later I had a high resolution helical CT scan done to see if they got all the unruptured blebs cut out. Knock on wood, so far so good (knock on wood) but since then I don’t travel more than 1 ridgeline deep from the TH or road, on skis foot or bike, without my PLB.

**jonesy** · 10-22-2018, 05:25 PM

https://www.ktvz.com/news/newly-foun...uake/818375869

**wyeaster** · 10-22-2018, 06:02 PM

ride it switch to the road

**jonesy** · 10-22-2018, 07:05 PM

Or the river.

**wyeaster** · 10-22-2018, 07:11 PM

that's even better

**Groomer Gambler** · 10-23-2018, 10:50 AM

Originally Posted by SchralphMacchio

Sounds like your friend may have had a similar procedure as me. Normal treatment for a bleb is to install a Heimlich valve and allow the rupture to heal on its own - staples wouldn’t be used unless the rupture was pretty serious or they wanted to resect (cut out) a problematic area. I had all of the above done, Heimlich valve for a week and then emergency surgery and wedge resection closed with titanium staples, when my lung ruptured again as they were removing the Heimlich valve. Then a couple months later I had a high resolution helical CT scan done to see if they got all the unruptured blebs cut out. Knock on wood, so far so good (knock on wood) but since then I don’t travel more than 1 ridgeline deep from the TH or road, on skis foot or bike, without my PLB.

I had a spontaneous pneum. about 6 years ago. No idea what it was at first and thought I was having a heart attack as I went a few hours with horrible chest pain and could barely breathe. Finally went to the ER and had the Heimlich valve. The worst part of the whole ordeal was the first time they set the valve it didnt seat right (which I didn't find out until a day later) so they had to go for it again (3 times) without any local anesthetic. Then a few months later I had another spont. collapse. At that point you are much more likely for recurring collapses so I opted for the surgery (they cut out a patch of blebs, stapled it shut with titanium staples, and then 'adhered' my lung to my lung wall so it theoretically can't collapse again).

I haven't had any collapses since, but I guess there's always a chance my other lung could have blebs. Sometimes I get light lung pains and I can't tell if it's heightened awareness, or if in fact I have a bleb but my lung now can't collapse because it's adhered to my lung cavity. Strangely too, heavy drinking makes my lungs feel a little uncomfortable (and both times my lungs collapsed I was drinking the night before), although impossible to tell if there's any correlation.

Out of curiosity what's your body type? There's not a lot of information on this online. I'm pretty tall and slim build, and this is purely anecdotal, but I think being tall your lungs are more elongated too to fill in space (thinner on the ends with blebs). My cousin is the same build and had the same pneumothorax issues too in his 20s which could also be genetic.

I don't think too much about this now, but something to always keep in mind. Since the surgery I've been much better about working out, running, biking for cardio and have cut back on drinking the past ~2yrs or so. Besides that, I'm not really sure what one can do to prevent spontaneous long collapses!

**Groomer Gambler** · 10-23-2018, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by SchralphMacchio

Knowledge disclaimers: I don’t volly for SAR work ... 8 years ago I discovered a congenital medical condition which could be fatal in the backcountry (left apical spontaneous pneumothorax) so I did a lot of research on how the various emergency notification systems work and talked with county SAR people, so that’s how I know some of this stuff. I also work with RF electronics professionally. I think I either started a thread on the various emergency notification products on TGR or bumped all the info into my “oh shit my lung exploded” trip report thread. Thankfully my lung surgery seemed to “fix the issue” and I haven’t sprung a leak in the last 8 years, so other than being in emergency incidents in areas with cell coverage I have no end-end firsthand experience with these emergency notification products.

My doctor said to always carry a needle when traveling or remote locations. If it collapses again stab yourself where they put the original valve in to relive chest pressure/air accumulation.

**TBS** · 10-23-2018, 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by jonesy

https://www.ktvz.com/news/newly-foun...uake/818375869

So how big a quake could those faults trigger if they'd never been found? Ima guessin' 7.2...

**SchralphMacchio** · 10-23-2018, 05:55 PM

Originally Posted by Groomer Gambler

My doctor said to always carry a needle when traveling or remote locations. If it collapses again stab yourself where they put the original valve in to relive chest pressure/air accumulation.

Wow that's extremely bold on part of your doctor to recommend needle thoracostomy procedure from an untrained person. I guess if you are sure you're going into tension pneumo and all by yourself, then it's better than dying, but if you're not going into tension that's pretty bold! I don't think that's trained in WFR, maybe in WEMT medical training ... I'm not even sure urban paramedics are allowed to perform that, but I think military medics are trained and allowed to do it. I have a note in my PLB file that says "Hist of spont pneumo, advise needle thoracostomy may be required." I do not carry a needle thoracostomy kit in my emergency bag of goodies, in retrospect it would have been good to have one when I was ski mountaineering in Svalbard 2-days by boat + 1 jet flight from the nearest hospital ...

I'm very skinny and by caucasian standards I'm not tall but by southeast asian standards I am moderately tall (5' 8", 135 lbs) ... and I have asthma with a history of asthma and lung problems in my family.

You and I both had the same surgery and pleurodesis procedure, that chest tube fucking sucks doesn't it? I'll send you a blog offline about a guy for whom mechanical and chemical pleurodesis procedures did not provide enough adhesion to prevent further collapses, and whose lungs are frequently rupturing blebs ... crazy stuff.

Anyways ... get yourself a PLB, Spot, or Inreach if you are going out somewhere without cell coverage!!!

A major collapse can lead to tension pneumothorax, when your heart shifts or veins become obstructed. Indicated by mediastinal shift - tell your partner to look for trachea deviating from midline or use your compass mirror. If that happens, you can go into cardiac arrest. No chance of self-evac, will want to manage condition wherever you're at and get thoracostomy and professional evac as soon as f'ing possible.

Fun stuff.

My friend just took a 90' groundfall a couple days ago due to a belay accident ... resulted in 8 broken ribs plus pneumothorax and multiple stable vertebrae fractures. No tension pneumo though and profesional carry out. Phew!

**::: :::** · 10-23-2018, 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by SchralphMacchio

My friend just took a 90' groundfall a couple days ago due to a belay accident ... resulted in 8 broken ribs plus pneumothorax and multiple stable vertebrae fractures. No tension pneumo though and profesional carry out. Phew!

holy shit, glad your friend is still around...!

mrs acinpdx had a spontaneous pneumo a few years ago...she was not a happy camper with the tube

**jonesy** · 10-23-2018, 07:40 PM

Originally Posted by TBS

So how big a quake could those faults trigger if they'd never been found? Ima guessin' 7.2...

Damn good guess bob.

**jonesy** · 10-24-2018, 09:19 AM

I finally completed my parole & probation time and moved on to a new life. Thing is getting a ski boot on over that monitoring device sucks.

**::: :::** · 10-24-2018, 09:31 AM

Good avy beacon, tho

**Bobcat Sig** · 10-24-2018, 01:28 PM

Originally Posted by k2skier112

Last couple of years we've been going out I84 and getting to HRM lot by 8:00.

Ski hard until 1:00 then bail before traffic gets bad.

Makes the weekends almost bearable.

Sadly, I think that's the move anymore. The death march up and down - which is the worst part - has become soul sucking. I was telling another native Portlander about how it's almost faster the I-84 thru Hood River route now than 26 and he was floored.

For someone who grew up skiing Hood, this is the new reality, unfortunately.

Originally Posted by SchralphMacchio

I think Delorme Inreach uses the same satellite network and indecent response center as Spot. Spot is picked up by Globalstar sat phone network, so there are areas outside of the continental 48 states with limited service windows based on satellite position. Spot’s private incident response center notifies the local authority having jurisdiction for SAR at the GPS location (or sat triangulated search area if the spot was not able to process and upload GPS data). When you register with Spot they keep relevant medical info on file.

ACR and McMurdo PLB devices use the 406 MHz government satellite network which is comprised of NOAA low earth orbit weather satellites in US and COSPAS SARSAT satellites internationally. In the US any rescue signal is picked up by the Air Force Rescue Coordination Center, which uses the GPS data or triangulated data to notify the proper SAR authority and forward the info on file (which you can populate with blood type, other medical info, and info about your craft or mode of travel). Because these are government services you as the user are not charged recurring fees, unlike Spot. But Spot and Inreach support other message types while this one is “oh shit send help” only.

I’ll have to do a little more homework on Ubimodo.

Knowledge disclaimers: I don’t volly for SAR work ... 8 years ago I discovered a congenital medical condition which could be fatal in the backcountry (left apical spontaneous pneumothorax) so I did a lot of research on how the various emergency notification systems work and talked with county SAR people, so that’s how I know some of this stuff. I also work with RF electronics professionally. I think I either started a thread on the various emergency notification products on TGR or bumped all the info into my “oh shit my lung exploded” trip report thread. Thankfully my lung surgery seemed to “fix the issue” and I haven’t sprung a leak in the last 8 years, so other than being in emergency incidents in areas with cell coverage I have no end-end firsthand experience with these emergency notification products.

Interesting discussion and timely. I hadn't considered such things for skiing... make total sense, though. In fact, I've already been considering an InReach Mini after having not one but two flat tires on Mt. Hood this weekend, riding motorcycles. Had I not been so damn lucky to flat out in cell service, it would've been a 5 or 6 mile walk out to cell service.

Most of what I've read, the InReach seems to be the better option compared to Spot, though I'm still in the info gathering stage.

Originally Posted by mattig

It's a 1st world problem. I'd take it as it is right now for the rest of my life and be quite happy about it.

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I admire your optimism and up-beat attitude. Perhaps we can ski again this year?

**jonesy** · 10-24-2018, 03:50 PM

It's only 15 min longer going 84/35 than 26.

**OregonDead** · 10-24-2018, 04:18 PM

Depends where you are coming from. Taking 84 adds at least an hour for me, usually more. I had to do it once last year when there was a fatality on 26. Otherwise it's usually not that bad just to adjust my timing. I really like to talk it up though because it's the best excuse to go night skiing. There is almost always a slow down at Govy and it's the perfect time to tell everyone in the car you're going night skiing until the traffic dies down. This works even when the traffic really isn't that bad. When people complain and get tired of skiing demand that your whole party go to the top of the upper bowl to look at the traffic. Chances are you will see some red brake lights and if you think your family still has some energy this can require a few more laps. If it's really time to quit you at least get one more solid run from the upper bowl.

Originally Posted by jonesy

It's only 15 min longer going 84/35 than 26.

**mattig** · 10-24-2018, 04:27 PM

Originally Posted by Bobcat Sig

Sadly, I think that's the move anymore. The death march up and down - which is the worst part - has become soul sucking. I was telling another native Portlander about how it's almost faster the I-84 thru Hood River route now than 26 and he was floored.

For someone who grew up skiing Hood, this is the new reality, unfortunately.

Interesting discussion and timely. I hadn't considered such things for skiing... make total sense, though. In fact, I've already been considering an InReach Mini after having not one but two flat tires on Mt. Hood this weekend, riding motorcycles. Had I not been so damn lucky to flat out in cell service, it would've been a 5 or 6 mile walk out to cell service.

Most of what I've read, the InReach seems to be the better option compared to Spot, though I'm still in the info gathering stage.

I admire your optimism and up-beat attitude. Perhaps we can ski again this year?

If I get enough energy chews in me, anything is possible!

Planning on BBI Bachy if nothing else.

Wifey is out most of this season recovering from a surgery, so we'll always have room for a +1 on Meadows weekends. My beater dodger game is nearly as strong as K2's, but I have a few twists.

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**Bobcat Sig** · 10-25-2018, 12:14 PM

Originally Posted by jonesy

It's only 15 min longer going 84/35 than 26.

Without traffic, which is almost a certainty on 26 these days. More so on the descent, it seems.

Originally Posted by OregonDead

Depends where you are coming from. Taking 84 adds at least an hour for me, usually more. I had to do it once last year when there was a fatality on 26. Otherwise it's usually not that bad just to adjust my timing. I really like to talk it up though because it's the best excuse to go night skiing. There is almost always a slow down at Govy and it's the perfect time to tell everyone in the car you're going night skiing until the traffic dies down. This works even when the traffic really isn't that bad. When people complain and get tired of skiing demand that your whole party go to the top of the upper bowl to look at the traffic. Chances are you will see some red brake lights and if you think your family still has some energy this can require a few more laps. If it's really time to quit you at least get one more solid run from the upper bowl.

Me? West side of I-5 on the 'other' side of the river. Basically, 14 to I-205 and hook into 84 and bypass everyone getting off at Wood Village. Though sometimes I'm a big dump animal an still take that ext and regret it at about Zig Zag. Hood River to 84 seems to be the play on the way home.

Originally Posted by mattig

If I get enough energy chews in me, anything is possible!

Planning on BBI Bachy if nothing else.

Wifey is out most of this season recovering from a surgery, so we'll always have room for a +1 on Meadows weekends. My beater dodger game is nearly as strong as K2's, but I have a few twists.

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Rad, let's do it.

What's the story on a BBI Bachelor whatev? I keep threaten to make one and have yet to do so.

**mattig** · 10-25-2018, 12:35 PM

Originally Posted by Bobcat Sig

Without traffic, which is almost a certainty on 26 these days. More so on the descent, it seems.

Me? West side of I-5 on the 'other' side of the river. Basically, 14 to I-205 and hook into 84 and bypass everyone getting off at Wood Village. Though sometimes I'm a big dump animal an still take that ext and regret it at about Zig Zag. Hood River to 84 seems to be the play on the way home.

Rad, let's do it.

What's the story on a BBI Bachelor whatev? I keep threaten to make one and have yet to do so.

I doubt there's a date yet, but last year it was the last weekend in March.

Re: other stuff, 26 up (if early). And 84 down (always).