Blizzard Gunsmoke vs Line Supernatural 115

**SkiDaddy970** · 08-09-2017, 01:19 AM

Trying to decide between the Gunsmokes (193cm) and the Supernatural 115 (192cm). Anyone skied both and can help me decide?

I ski in Colorado and am an advanced type 3 skier. I'm looking for a wide all mountain ski that would be considered a playful charger - more freeride than freestyle. I am 40 years old, 6'2", 200 pounds and an aggressive skier.

Skis I like - my everyday ski, which I love, is the Atomic Alibi (187cm).

Don't like - (don't hate on me TGR) Mr Pollards Opus 192cm. I mounted it on Erics Choice ... It doesn't fit my style of skiing ... not enough ski in front of me and way too soft. (They are for sale).

Thanks for the advice and insight.

**doebedoe** · 08-09-2017, 07:28 AM

Why are you limited to just those two skis?

Because the correct answer for you is the set of 191 ON3P Billy Goats for sale on Denver Craigslist. https://denver.craigslist.org/spo/d/...225680528.html

Sincerely,
Probably the only other person you'll ever see on 187 Alibis in the front range.

**SkiDaddy970** · 08-09-2017, 09:26 AM

I limited myself because of a couple "good deals" that I found on the SN and Gunsmokes ... Back to the drawing board, I guess.

The ON3P BG sounds interesting, but a pretty long turning radius.
I'm sure no problem blasting through anything and great at going mach schnell, but would you consider it a wide all mountain? Is it turny enough?

**doebedoe** · 08-09-2017, 09:43 AM

SuperNatural and Gunsmokes are both very good skis. I didn't meant to bang them. Definitely options worth exploring. I've only skied the smaller version of the Supernatural and found it really well balanced and workable.

The Billy Goat's radius looks long than it skis. It is quite a nimble ski for 114mm waist -- more so than similar skis like the Bibby Pro. The slight pintail makes it very easy to swing around in tight spaces. If you went down the path of the CL post you'd want to know which year BGs they are as the older ones are less forgiving than the newer. I would say it is a wide all mountains ski. If it is too deep for your Alibis, then it is deep enough for Billy Goats.

**SkiDaddy970** · 08-09-2017, 01:42 PM

Thanks doebedoe - the CL post is for 2014s and I found some 2015s online new for $405. Thoughts on these? Newer better?

I think I can pick up the SN's for $300 and the Gunsmoke's for $400.

I'd put FKS 140s on any of em.

Thanks!

**doebedoe** · 08-09-2017, 02:36 PM

Not sure of differences between the 14/15 -- there are some ON3P mega threads around here that would detail that.

I've only demo'd the narrower SN and have demo'd Billy Goats each of the last 3 years. My take is that if you're getting it for powder/tree skiing then BG is worth the $100 over the SN. If you're more focused on just raging downhill and like a more traditional ski (more carving, less smeary) then I would grab the SN.

Someone else will have to comment on the Gunsmokes.

**skibrd** · 08-10-2017, 04:45 AM

I skied the shorter Supernaturals and I wasn't a fan. I am a fan of the 193 Gunsmokes. They are a ton of fun and became easy to ski once I mounted them at +1.5. They were my go to powder/soft snow ski for a season and a half. But my Gunsmokes have fallen out of the rotation and I'll probably try to sell them this fall. My buddies spend more time on them now they I do.

Just to throw another ski out there because this is TGR, I put the 193 Gunsmokes away in favor of the 193 Volkl Shiro. Everything I like about the Gunsmokes, the Shiro does better. The only thing the Gunsmokes does better is carve on hardpack, but that's not what we have 115mm underfoot skis for...

Side not, please don't shoot me ON3P fans, but I just don't mesh with them. I tried the BG's and the Kartel 122s and they felt pingy, sort of hallow? A buddy (ex-bump racer) was only skiing on ON3P but after I got him on my Gunsmokes, I almost didn't get them back. I think he is looking at either borrowing my Gunsmokes next winter or a pair of Rustler 11s. I've found that the smaller brands make their skis how they like to ski, and if you ski like they do, you'll love the skis. If you don't, it won't work. Praxis skis and I get along great, not so much with Moment or ON3P.

**happytimefunbox** · 08-10-2017, 01:14 PM

I ski like ON3P builders do. 6'3" 220lbs and ski fast enough to keep SFB in sight. I am on a 2013 BG 191 "ak fishstick" and it is my most favoritest ski ever and my daily driver. It'll fucken truck and kill all small animals on the mountain then shut down that mach looney and give reasonable variation in turn radius without slarve turning. And it slarves like a mofo when its needed. If I can beat this thing up bad enough to downgrade it to rock ski (doubtful) I will be buying the new version.

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**SkiDaddy970** · 08-10-2017, 07:46 PM

You all have me really considering the Billy Goats. I've read a lot of mixed reviews about the Gunsmokes - I'm thinking it's a little softer than what I'm searching for.

Still considering the Supernatural 115s. If you have experience on these - good or bad - please weigh in.

Thanks,
Matt

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**undertow2** · 08-10-2017, 08:28 PM

The 193 Gunsmoke is not to soft... I own it along with the 192 Line Influence 115, 191 Billygoat and 191 116 Kartel... If you are looking for a playful charger go with the ON3P 191 116 Kartel...

**NW_SKIER** · 08-10-2017, 08:30 PM

And if you're a more traditional mount skier, the Billygoat.

/Endthread

**2FUNKY** · 08-10-2017, 08:36 PM

194 Praxis Quixote

Just to make things more interesting.

**undertow2** · 08-10-2017, 08:40 PM

Originally Posted by NW_SKIER

And if you're a more traditional mount skier, the Billygoat.

/Endthread

I am and love my Bllys, but I def consider my 116 Kartels a playful charger... My 191 Billy's when it comes to POW is untouchable, but I would not consider them playful... They are not demanding at all, but not playful like the Kartels...

Different strokes... And just to add my all time favorite ski is the 191 Katana and tha is def traditional..,

**SkiDaddy970** · 08-11-2017, 02:56 PM

Originally Posted by Undertow

The 193 Gunsmoke is not to soft... I own it along with the 192 Line Influence 115, 191 Billygoat and 191 116 Kartel... If you are looking for a playful charger go with the ON3P 191 116 Kartel...

So how does the Gunsmoke compare to the Influence 115s (chargy, playful)? Where do they fit in your quiver - which one do you ski when?

Do you have the 13/14 Influences which are essentially the Supernatural (or earlier, charger version)? I'll investigate the Kartel.

Thanks for the input.

**wildmanwillie** · 08-12-2017, 06:33 AM

Originally Posted by SkiDaddy970

So how does the Gunsmoke compare to the Influence 115s (chargy, playful)? Where do they fit in your quiver - which one do you ski when?

Do you have the 13/14 Influences which are essentially the Supernatural (or earlier, charger version)? I'll investigate the Kartel.

Thanks for the input.

I have the older chargier 186 Influence 115's and I skied the 186 Gunsmoke ~50 days last season mostly at ABasin and Breck. Not the 190 length versions, but I'm 5'8 135 so the big boy skis just aren't necessary for me. I haven't busted out the Influences in couple years, but the Gunsmokes are not significantly softer than them. Gunsmokes obviously have a rounder flex profile that is more tip-tail balanced whereas the tail on Influences is much more stout with a softer tip. I would never consider calling those older Influences playful.

The Gunsmoke is definitely not a noodle and holds up at speed quite well. Its playfulness comes from it's shape/rocker profile. I demoed the Jeffery 114 a couple years ago right before I ended up with the 'Smokes, they are very similar skis. The Jeffery felt easier to push deep into the flex, lighter and with more pop. The Gunsmokes felt more damp with a flex that ramps up quicker. Both awesome skis and I've been dying to try the new Kartels.

The Gunsmoke is very close to the perfect ABasin ski IMO. Stout/damp enough to mach in the alpine, but the shape and rocker allow it to be thrown around pretty easily in the tight trees. It's also pretty fun to butter and press, not very much fun in the park but it's a fairly heavy damp ski.

**tenB** · 08-12-2017, 08:50 AM

I don't consider the billy goats a daily driver, but the gunsmokes could be. I have zero experience with the supernaturals, so I can't speak to those, but I found the 193 gunsmokes to a versatile ski and a master of none. They handled chewed up bumps fairly well were fun to bounce around on, but I sold them after a dozen days. I wanted the gunsmokes to be a wider, more agile cochise and they just didn't have the liveliness I wanted. They were only marginal in deeper snow too.

I went back to cochise for lower tide days and billygoats for deeper days. I've come to the long conclusion that I prefer straighter skis with more active front rocker that are damp and loose. The rustler looks like it might be what blizzard wanted the gunsmokes to be. My buddies who are smaller seem to love the gunsmokes for what that is worth..

**ScrewYou** · 08-12-2017, 09:40 AM

Gunsmokes and Billy Goats are both super fun. Different flavors of skiing, but both are very predictable, very good skis. I think the gunsmokes make for better daily drivers though.

Gunsmokes like to be skied more from the center of the ski, though they will still enjoy being driven more aggressively. They have MUCH better edge hold and grip on super firm snow, compared to any On3p, not just the BG. Still easy to break free and do what you want though, they can be jibby if you got the skills for the 193.. good in powder, but not as good as the BG

The BGs mount point feels more traditional, although the ski shape is pretty untraditional. Its super slarvey, yet still charges fall line like a boss. Best 3D snow charger you can buy. Great in trees too, but less of a daily driver than the gunsmoke, IMO.

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**Not Neil_Armstrong** · 08-12-2017, 12:35 PM

I had the SMOKES in 193, I'm 6'6" and a lean 250. They are fun all around but sink in deep. I liked them but didn't love them. I ditched them for 4frnt's EHP in 193.

**undertow2** · 08-12-2017, 05:47 PM

At 250 you are going to pretty much sink any ski... I got some 193 EHPs on the cheap and holy sweet baby jeebus what a ski...!

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**SkiDaddy970** · 08-12-2017, 08:33 PM

I'll throw another one out there - since it is TGR

...

Blizzard Spur

Quite a bit wider, but pretty versatile based on the reviews I've read.

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**skibrd** · 08-13-2017, 12:39 AM

OG Spur and I were not friends. I needed to take a lot off the edges to make it a fun ski for me. I detuned the from about 6 inches in front and behind boot to the tip and tail. They are a wider version of the Cochise and Bonafide, and wants to blast through everything. I did go for one of the best tours I've even been on with the OG Spurs. They are right up there with the narrower but longer 203 Shiros, and wider and longer 196 Praxis Protests for easy to ski in bottomless pow, and that's saying a lot for a ski that 14 and 7 cm shorter.

**whyturn** · 08-13-2017, 07:23 AM

BG is daily driver for UT but maybe not for CO

Spur is really fun on groomers and Mach in pow.

Can't comment on gunsmoke

**ScrewYou** · 08-13-2017, 07:24 AM

Skibrd should get 194 Quixotes

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**skibrd** · 08-13-2017, 07:30 AM

Originally Posted by aevergreene

Skibrd should get 194 Quixotes

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I'm thinking about it...

**doebedoe** · 08-13-2017, 08:23 AM

SkiDaddy -- may help recommendations if you tell people what your use purpose is.

My understanding for the first post is that you're looking for a ski on snowy days or during a storm cycle -- a powder-friendly ski that can still hang in the resort and isn't one dimensional.

And that you already have a 98mm daily driver in the Alibi?