Any of you dentists moonlight in land-use law?

[BmillsSkier]

Expectin' trouble on the claim this summer are ya?

[dunfree]

Expectin' trouble on the claim this summer are ya?

panning for paradise, so hot.

[mecc69]

It's not surveyed, but is described in the deed as "10 feet from center" along it's existing route. It is drawn on the rough survey of the property in its approximate location. The provenance of the roads and the jurisdiction they fall under are all incredibly inexact in most places around here (had a front row seat for a Home Owner vs. HOA vs. USFS vs. County debate several years ago), but on my property it's pretty well defined. We own the claim, and everything else is USFS.

I assume highangle is headed there, but getting a property survey done by a licensed surveyor to identify the easement and property boundaries with permanent markers is the first step here. Then identify your property boundary and enforce the easement conditions.

It is probably worth a phone call to the FS to determine if they will help with ticketing easement violations or if you are on your own. I would think the local FS would be interested in helping reduce conflicts if they can seeing as how they are attempting to address issues down the road from you.

[stfu&gbtw]

I assume highangle is headed there, but getting a property survey done by a licensed surveyor to identify the easement and property boundaries with permanent markers is the first step here. Then identify your property boundary and enforce the easement conditions.

It is probably worth a phone call to the FS to determine if they will help with ticketing easement violations or if you are on your own. I would think the local FS would be interested in helping reduce conflicts if they can seeing as how they are attempting to address issues down the road from you.

One might think as much, but the FS is good for very little up here. Currently have one LEO for a 225,000 acre district.

[highangle]

It's not surveyed, but is described in the deed as "10 feet from center" along it's existing route. It is drawn on the rough survey of the property in its approximate location. The provenance of the roads and the jurisdiction they fall under are all incredibly inexact in most places around here (had a front row seat for a Home Owner vs. HOA vs. USFS vs. County debate several years ago), but on my property it's pretty well defined. We own the claim, and everything else is USFS.

OK bro. You seem set against revealing pertinent info, so I won't wear out horses trying to pull teeth.
I do hope things pan out. If you ever have to pay someone to help you with this, you may want to drop the obscurantist bit and give him the info he asks for.


You might can move the trail to your advantage.

[mecc69]

One might think as much, but the FS is good for very little up here. Currently have one LEO for a 225,000 acre district.

Right, but you can clarify for yourself how they might react when you start towing vehicles or start having issues on a routine basis. Are they going to be in agreement with you or are they going to make life hard for you? If FS law enforcement is clear on the easement conditions well in advance they will have your back if you operate inside of them instead of having no clue what is going on when they show up because "the landowner stole my car".

Are they going to interpret the easement differently, etc.

It's worth a phone call or meeting.

Someone suggested earlier that you create a parking area. Bad idea.

[stfu&gbtw]

OK bro. You seem set against revealing pertinent info, so I won't wear out horses trying to pull teeth.
I do hope things pan out. If you ever have to pay someone to help you with this, you may want to drop the obscurantist bit and give him the info he asks for.


You might can move the trail to your advantage.

Sorry dude - I don't know what info you're looking for... What info do you want? I'm not trying to be obtuse... But I'm not going to post my claim #.

[stfu&gbtw]

Right, but you can clarify for yourself how they might react when you start towing vehicles or start having issues on a routine basis. Are they going to be in agreement with you or are they going to make life hard for you? If FS law enforcement is clear on the easement conditions well in advance they will have your back if you operate inside of them instead of having no clue what is going on when they show up because "the landowner stole my car".

Are they going to interpret the easement differently, etc.

It's worth a phone call or meeting.

Someone suggested earlier that you create a parking area. Bad idea.

I speak with the FS on the regular. As frequently as they'll return my calls anyway.. I know they will not be psyched with any activity that starts creating a lot of work. I'm not going to have vehicles towed... At least not yet. I think I'm just going to stake or pole fence the easement boundary, maybe +5'. We'll see how that goes.

[goldengatestinx]

If the easement is a mining road then the only allowed use should be for mining access by those having mining claims which it accesses.

All the dumb fucks joking about trespassing are disappointing. Ruining the quality of life of a legal owner and condoning dumping, illegally shooting, harassing, etc isn't part of being a good steward of the land which we all use for skiing, riding, hiking etc.

I worked the wildland fire above Idaho Springs a couple months ago apparently started by a dumb fuck shooting acetylene cylinders with a .50 cal rifle. The place looked like a war zone up there with all the shot up trash, a trashed and shot up RV, shotgun shells, litter, broken glass etc. stfus plce could end up looking like that.

Two years ago we had a wildland fire started by illegal campers across the canyon from us. And now the county wants to buy the land next to us and will likely build a county open space park attracting fucksticks too close, bringing noise, trash, barking dogs, illegal camping, shooting, etc. The county and sheriff can't control the other open space park at the mouth of the canyon today. They put in a message sign saying criminal activity in the park and keep your valuables with you. No park would eliminate the criminal activity.

'Progress' isn't always a good thing.

[highangle]

Sorry dude - I don't know what info you're looking for... What info do you want? I'm not trying to be obtuse... But I'm not going to post my claim #.

Your lack of candor and layman vocabulary are getting in the way. I understand you don't want to reveal personal info on the internet, but you're creating quite a bit of ambiguity about this easement with your executive summaries, and I for one am having to work too hard to make sense of it.

A rough sketch, or transcription of the easement, or a zoomed in pic of the description of the easement in the deed would have saved you and others some typing already (we still don't even know what this easement is for...). But if it's too much trouble, then that's just the way it goes.

[TNKen]

I'm in. I also have access to a huge amount of shipping pallets for a giant bonfire. Plus I have 2 old tube TV's that the landfill won't take. We can shoot at those. I might have an old refrigerator we can dump there too.

I'll start the paperwork to bring the machine guns. See if you can find an old car somewhere.

[GeezerSteve]

I, like others, are a bit confused by OP's descriptions of the easement. So, it's a 20' wide easement and use is restricted to accessing USFS road beyond? If so, consider rolling big rocks or eco blocks or placing posts on either side to the edge of the easement corridor to prevent people from parking. I've seen that done around here for FS road easements that cross inholdings.

[RootSkier]

If the easement is a mining road then the only allowed use should be for mining access by those having mining claims which it accesses.

LOL.


......

[stfu&gbtw]

Your lack of candor and layman vocabulary are getting in the way. I understand you don't want to reveal personal info on the internet, but you're creating quite a bit of ambiguity about this easement with your executive summaries, and I for one am having to work too hard to make sense of it.

A rough sketch, or transcription of the easement, or a zoomed in pic of the description of the easement in the deed would have saved you and others some typing already (we still don't even know what this easement is for...). But if it's too much trouble, then that's just the way it goes.

I, like others, are a bit confused by OP's descriptions of the easement. So, it's a 20' wide easement and use is restricted to accessing USFS road beyond? If so, consider rolling big rocks or eco blocks or placing posts on either side to the edge of the easement corridor to prevent people from parking. I've seen that done around here for FS road easements that cross inholdings.

Here's a drawing that, while I'm sure you won't believe it, is nearly 100% accurate. The only difference is that the road crosses at an angle, which makes it longer than the 150' that would be depicted here.

There's another place a couple of valleys over that was finished recently where the guy has marked the boundary with nicely finished 6x6 posts every 50' or so, with the name of the claim burned into the side facing the road, and a small "Private Property - No Parking" beneath it. Then, every few hundred feet, he's put up single sections of nice wood fence, just indicating the continuance of the boundary line - not actually making a barrier. It looked nice... Certainly far more attractive than a shitty looking wire fence, and far less obnoxious than a full permanent fence. And no one was parked there, and none of them had any bullet holes in them. And his property was far more accessible than mine... I'm surrounded by pretty dense forest and the road cuts directly across it, where the other place is mostly meadow and the road sort of winds through it. I think that seems like the thing to do. I wouldn't have to move the posts to plow in the winter, it would actually look nice, and would hopefully have the intended effect.

[stuckathuntermtn]

Perhaps a sign mentioning the ample parking day or night a little farther up the road?
Hahaha, CO is so fucked.

[hatchgreenchile]

"High clearance & 4x4 vehicles strongly advised beyond this point" sign at your boundary, and standard "Posted" signs along the boundary. Start small.

Geezus, you think this stretch was Stillwater Pass. I didn't realize west Gilpin county was such a public debauchery paradise.

[summit]

You suck at mspaint STFU

[::: :::]

how is the remainder of your perimeter delineated from USFS land?

[stfu&gbtw]

how is the remainder of your perimeter delineated from USFS land?

Just the USFS/PP signs that are up every couple hundred feet... No one wants to walk in woods - they just want to drive their ATVs and 4x4s. Have never once had someone approach the property from any other direction.

[stfu&gbtw]

You suck at mspaint STFU

Says who?

[BmillsSkier]

I know the joke is MS Paint is for crude drawings but come on man.

Where's the paint can shaker of a house?

[wyeaster]

Says who?

wow pm fls. there's an existence here that gets joked about a lot but on the internet nobody hears the nervous laughter.

[AK47bp]

I used to leave large caliber spent casings laying in the gravel at the end of the driveway.

Some other things that helped-
Large dog
Kept the road graded and plowed to the trailhead

One guy refused to move his truck and sled trailer out of my driveway until I went and started the tractor.

As an ex-POS I can tell you, spent shell casings just means "cool, I can shoot here, clearly other people have".

That's bout alls I got to offer counsler

[stfu&gbtw]

As an ex-POS I can tell you, spent shell casings just means "cool, I can shoot here, clearly other people have".

That's bout alls I got to offer counsler

Yeah, there's nothing about left over shooting crap that will indicate people shouldn't shoot there, except maybe for someone who's been shot...

[Foggy_Goggles]

I think you got 2 things going on here. One is you need to understand your easement which is what highangle and Steve are trying to help you with. People often mistake an easement for defacto public property which it is not. Second is that you are trying to figure out how to prevent trespass. It sounds like aesthetics is a concern. So big rocks or 6X6 posts. You can string cable that can be removed in the winter for plowing. Pretty standard stuff. If you don't care how it looks, Jersey Barriers AKA Type 3 Barricade.

People in Colorado are weird with property rights and trespass. They act like they support land owner rights but they always have an excuse for why their trespassing should be OK. My advice is to talk in through with your county sheriff to understand how they interpret your rights.

If necessary, be that asshole at the end of the road with a 12ga. For better or worse, aggressive signage and defensive of property works.