It's Spring. Wash your ski clothes.

[Micol]

What about “welded” seams?

i had a heat welded patagucci ascentionist soft shell I really liked that (glued actualy) fell apart in the dryer....

tape would delam, one of the guys just ironed all the tape back on which seemed to work. {ding, ding, correct answer}

fify

seems the real takeaway is expensive, high end wp/b garments are massively overwashed and used too much for dog walking......

[PB]

My dog hates it when I make him wear my wp/b garments - wrong colors.

[glademaster]

fify

That's also likely true. I was trying to point out that the $750 shell from Arc or Patagucci or Westcomb isn't likely to provide much of an advantage in terms of lifespan over a $400 shell that uses a similar/the same membrane.

[SumJongGuy]

I ski in the rain enough to where my gear gets washed pretty regularly.

[Micol]

That's also likely true. I was trying to point out that the $750 shell from Arc or Patagucci or Westcomb isn't likely to provide much of an advantage in terms of lifespan over a $400 shell that uses a similar/the same membrane.

true that.......if anyone is paying more than say $400 for a premium brand fabric ( e.g. gore, neo, event, ykk zips ) you are really getting raked over the coals....you're paying to let them serf and all that bs .....if buying a non premium brand wpb fabric (especially the in-house proprietary ones) .... $200 is tops (fyi that's a $25 fob china cost product (goes for pants too) even < vietnam) ...... pt barnum said it best....

[Hott Butt Mud]

All of you rich dentists are buying new clothes every year, so why bother washing?

[AK47bp]

Us regular Joe the Plumber’s buy a new jacket maybe every 4-5 years and keep the the jacket we replaced as our backup. So I have a 9 year old jacket and a 5 year old jacket. Patagonia and a Burton. I wash it every year with powdered detergent and extra rinse.

I’m a fucking lunatic!!!

If I’m skiing in the rain I have my skiing in the rain coat (5 yr old Columbia OutDry) that doesn’t breath well but keeps me dry as fuck since I’m such a good skier I don’t sweat when shredding lift laps.

I’m a goddam bum but normal people don’t have a quiver of a dozen jackets to cycle through and never wash.




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[XXX-er]

I think the takeaway at least for me might be that there is a happy medium somewhere between never washing yer kit and being more careful about leaving it in the dryer on high ?

I remember MEC used to have a saying about gortex care in their gear catalogue back when gear catalogs were a thing

" wash it lots, dry it hot "

and Sorry but i am not going to ski in the rain

[Benny Profane]

That's also likely true. I was trying to point out that the $750 shell from Arc or Patagucci or Westcomb isn't likely to provide much of an advantage in terms of lifespan over a $400 shell that uses a similar/the same membrane.

Patagonia is for life now. If it breaks or wears out or something, free repair or new item. So, no, unless said cheaper garment is also for life. And mid priced Patagonia isn't that much, especially, considering, it's for life.

[bodywhomper]

Patagonia is for life now. If it breaks or wears out or something, free repair or new item. So, no, unless said cheaper garment is also for life. And mid priced Patagonia isn't that much, especially, considering, it's for life.

This is not true. Last time I went to Patagonia, two years ago, with some broken and worn out gear, they turned me away. This included a welded seam jacket where the welded seams had failed and another w/b jacket where some seam tape had failed. The staff exercise very high level of discretion of whether they would accept a warranty return, pointing out their change in the iron clad policy and discretion in the “life” of the product. This was at the store in Reno.

[bodywhomper]

I had an older TNF gtx jacket (2 layer) purchased in the late 90’s where tape had failed and the fabric was delaminating in other areas (bubbles). TNF said “no,” and gtx said “no.” Oddly enough, TNF just replaced the zippers on my early-80’s era “windy pass” tent as a warranty repair.

[Peruvian]

This is not true. Last time I went to Patagonia, two years ago, with some broken and worn out gear, they turned me away. This included a welded seam jacket where the welded seams had failed and another w/b jacket where some seam tape had failed. The staff exercise very high level of discretion of whether they would accept a warranty return, pointing out their change in the iron clad policy and discretion in the “life” of the product. This was at the store in Reno.

Mail it directly to Patagonia and you will likely have a different experience.

[Benny Profane]

Yes, he's doing it wrong, somehow.

I didn't say in my OP what brought me to that phone call with Patagonia. I grabbed an older Nitro parka that I used to love out of the closet it had been in for a dozen years, because I lost weight, and, poof, new parka that still was cool and now retro. Outwardly, great shape. So I throw it into the wash with two pants and Nikwash, and the entire lining of this jacket disintegrated into tiny blue bits in the wash. It wasn't Gore Tex, they had their own propietery material at the time. I thought, well, ok, now I have a cool light shell, wore it once on a day that needed a light shell, worked, but, then I thought, eh, wtf, drop it in an envelope and send it to repairs. Maybe they'll credit me a hundred. (I have had great experiences with them, before). A week later I get an email with a 350 dollar credit for a new parka. I bought the new Powder jacket, love it, for 400 online through them and 25 for shipping and something. So, 75 for a brand new jacket.
The young lady on the phone at one point said, you know, sir, that parka was 26 years old. I said, huh, I thought more like 21. But, hey, thanks, you guys rock.

So, 26 year old garment basically swapped for new. That's for life.

[Benny Profane]

Oh, btw, deal with Patagonia online through repairs or call them with a heads up, they'll give you an order number, and THEN go to a store and have them ship it. That's free, and return to your home is free. They repaired a pair of pants last year for free in this way.

Hell of a company.

[bodywhomper]

Thanks for the patagucci recs. I used to simply take care of returns or repairs in one of their stores without a problem.

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[galibier_numero_un]

So I received delivery of that 303 stuff that @geezersteve is big on. Reading the application warnings on the back gives me pause. My wife has chemical sensitivities and I can envision problems the next time the jacket goes in the wash.

If anyone in the Front Range wants my new bottle, it's yours.

... Thom

[jmills]

An old read

https://www.patagonia.com/blog/2008/08/the-care-feedin/

[Micol]

An old read

https://www.patagonia.com/blog/2008/08/the-care-feedin/

I would be awfully careful to take the advice of that author from 2008. Polartec neoshell did not even exist, nor event , nor the latest versions of Gore-Tex.

There is so much conflicting information on this subject. I am getting ready to run a contest here on TGR called the DWR Re-treatment Challenge, I will be announcing it soon along with cash prizes. Maybe some Maggot has a solution that will help us all....tide in a box probably aint it

[skizix]

I would be awfully careful to take the advice of that author from 2008. Polartec neoshell did not even exist, nor event , nor the latest versions of Gore-Tex.

There is so much conflicting information on this subject. I am getting ready to run a contest here on TGR called the DWR Re-treatment Challenge, I will be announcing it soon along with cash prizes. Maybe some Maggot has a solution that will help us all....tide in a box probably aint it

So why is it so hard to re-create the factory DWR? Is it a heat thing that the assembled garment can’t handle (welded seams/seals etc? Or do we just not have access to the proper, nasty chemicals (like car detailing - I once had a detailer give me ajar of carpet cleaner that worked like NOTHING you could buy retail)

[Micol]

So why is it so hard to re-create the factory DWR? Is it a heat thing that the assembled garment can’t handle (welded seams/seals etc? Or do we just not have access to the proper, nasty chemicals (like car detailing - I once had a detailer give me ajar of carpet cleaner that worked like NOTHING you could buy retail)

yeah same for me, i got a hold of some wheel acid once from dealer clean up place and that stuff was unmatched by anything over the counter....spray on and rinse....probably killed more than a few fish...

as for dwr, i have had gallons of the real deal, where the chem factory wanted to sell me barrels of the stuff...we applied it to all kinds of stuff and never got it to work like when we get new fabric on the roll from a fabric brand.

my guess is that it is how it gets applied at the factory making the fabrics. i posted a video of a laminating factory somewhere on these boards in the last year and it is a majorly large grimey operation from start to finish. my best guess is that it is applied to the face fabric on a laminate before the fabric is all fused/laminated together. most of the information related to that process is proprietary, i can ask some people i kno but for the record, i have tested the by the barrel stuff using spray bottles, heat , no heat, dryer, no dryer all kinds of ways and it never caused water to bead up like the new fabric does....

[pureantigravity]

Regular Goretex ski clothes
Throw in a Tide Pod. Wash once and rinse twice.
Then I scrub the snowmobile aluminum and grease stains off, by hand, with a soft fingernail brush, using Simple Green.
Then wash and rinse again in plain water.
Then treat with DWR and throw in the dryer for 30 mins on Medium or even High.
It seems to work well since my ski clothes seem like new and haven't fallen apart.
I do that once every 2 years.
Goretex rules.
All my other DWR are in the back closet or get sold/tossed eventually when they just don't work to keep out rain and wet snow.

[glademaster]

I'm impressed that the Tide Pod and Simple Green don't seriously mess up your stuff. Perhaps it is more stout than some lead us to believe.

I washed my ski pants recently (3 layer GTX, not Pro) using Tide Free and Clear liquid in warm water, "XL Load" setting (giggity!). Dried on Low/Delicate for about 30 minutes and called it good. I think the DWR seems more effective now than it did prior to washing, but they were pretty gross with visible salt/sweat stains in many places, and other general mung from being used for resort and bc skiing, as well as snow shoveling.

Washing your shit does remove the DWR, but not after one wash cycle. But we all knew that.

[swissiphic]

Had a conversation with a guy who did some softgoods design work for a large company that produces Goretex garments. He recommended using Dawn non perfumed dish soap. It strips the grime and pulls body sweat/dirt/oil contamination outta the fabric. It's the 'same stuff they used to clean the crude oil of the birds after the exxon valdez', iirc. Can't recall specifics past that but pretty sure other recommendations included wash it on the cool side of hot and double rinse.

He had some other tech info regarding DWR restoration as well but memory is hazy. I think he suggested that restoring inherent DWR is a function of heat vs. time. So, for a given hot temp, exposure time is reduced, for a lower heat, exposure time is increased to obtain similar results; there was a curve. Something to do with molecules moving to new location...over my head for chemistry/physics stuff.

I mentioned an incident years ago where i accidentally dropped a pretty hot iron on my goretex jacket and it was left there for a few minutes. Noticed that for the life of the jacket that patch seemed to show 'factory fresh' DWR performance much longer than the rest of the jacket after successive wash/dry cycles. It was after that comment that he explained the heat/time curve thing.

Never had the patience to do the ironing thing to restore DWR, but it's probably the most effective method. I just chuck the garment in the dryer and crank it to the highest setting for an hour and hope for the best and live with the less than optimal results.

[AK47bp]

Well if I learnt anything from this thread so far it’s that ski gear washing techniques are like assholes.




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[pureantigravity]

I'm impressed that the Tide Pod and Simple Green don't seriously mess up your stuff. Perhaps it is more stout than some lead us to believe.

I washed my ski pants recently (3 layer GTX, not Pro) using Tide Free and Clear liquid in warm water, "XL Load" setting (giggity!). Dried on Low/Delicate for about 30 minutes and called it good. I think the DWR seems more effective now than it did prior to washing, but they were pretty gross with visible salt/sweat stains in many places, and other general mung from being used for resort and bc skiing, as well as snow shoveling.

Washing your shit does remove the DWR, but not after one wash cycle. But we all knew that.

The outer fabric layer protects the GoreTex membrane and the membrane itself is actually quite durable against chemicals.
I've gone full on detergent and scrub, even with ski wax remover on some grease stains (bio citron ski wax solvent).
My GorTex pants have 6 years of use on them and I duct tape the holes from pole punctures just to add a little "Red Green" ambiance.
I can't seem to destroy them.
No problems with rain or even when sitting in wet spring snow.
So maybe some people store stuff where it goes moldy
.. and mold can eat into almost anything even pure plastics and rubber.