Question for Lift Maintenance Experts

[gibbssco]

Yetiman, you gotta get yourself up to da keweenaw a few times a season. 169" so far up here, and plenty of aspects for hiking/skinning, as well as bohemia for 99 bucks a year. We steal all your snow mang!!!! Let's hope this rain doesn't fuck it all up.

[ill-advised strategy]

Yetiman, you gotta get yourself up to da keweenaw a few times a season. 169" so far up here, and plenty of aspects for hiking/skinning, as well as bohemia for 99 bucks a year. We steal all your snow mang!!!! Let's hope this rain doesn't fuck it all up.

I'm sitting here getting ready to go spin little wrod laps because I didn't want to do an 8hr round trip drive up there and get rained on. If I had left early this morning I'd be skiing boho now. Wrong call. Bummer.

[ill-advised strategy]

So here's what I learned this afternoon:

Talked to a friend who is the ultimate straight-shooter, and who is familiar with these lifts (the actual specific lifts locally) and who was present and involved with inspections over the past few years. He says what I'm seeing is frayed threads of a nylon core that doesn't provide structural integrity...they get disturbed when the chairs are removed and moved a few feet down the rope in the offseason.

I went and ninja'd around after one lift was shut down this evening and touched a couple with my hand...what I'm seeing is not metal, it is sprigs of nylon. I feel a lot better....you know...false alarm and whatnot.

This thread is a little embarrassing under the circumstances, but I don't want to douche out and delete it, so I'll likely go and put an update in the first post.

[hawkgt]

why embarrassing? i never knew the cable was wrapped in nylon.

consider yourself a seeker of knowledge

[ill-advised strategy]

why embarrassing? i never knew the cable was wrapped in nylon.

consider yourself a seeker of knowledge

well, mainly I don't want any slanderous implications toward the (thus far unnamed) operator...who has done nothing wrong.

[slackerpbr]

Can't believe no lift mechanics posting part of your morning start up on fixed grips is grip slip and broken strands that's why you see paint marks on the cable

[Shred Baron]

why embarrassing? i never knew the cable was wrapped in nylon.

consider yourself a seeker of knowledge

The more common core is a single piece of extruded plastic. Fiber core ( like this on) isn't as common bit a less expensive option.

[Shred Baron]

So here's what I learned this afternoon:

Talked to a friend who is the ultimate straight-shooter, and who is familiar with these lifts (the actual specific lifts locally) and who was present and involved with inspections over the past few years. He says what I'm seeing is frayed threads of a nylon core that doesn't provide structural integrity...they get disturbed when the chairs are removed and moved a few feet down the rope in the offseason.

I went and ninja'd around after one lift was shut down this evening and touched a couple with my hand...what I'm seeing is not metal, it is sprigs of nylon. I feel a lot better....you know...false alarm and whatnot.

This thread is a little embarrassing under the circumstances, but I don't want to douche out and delete it, so I'll likely go and put an update in the first post.

Did he give you the make of the lift ( curios because it would explain a bit). Uh like everything else, every lift incident gets lots of coverage, and a bit sensationalized these days. When was the last time you saw an article headline like " 1 million passengers transported through the air without incident"?

[ill-advised strategy]

Did he give you the make of the lift ( curios because it would explain a bit).

Not entirely sure, but based on description in a PM from Tacklebox and a little bit of checking around on the web, I feel pretty confident saying these are Riblets....

[ill-advised strategy]

Found this photo on the interwebs....this is not the actual chair(s) in question, but it's identical to the design we have:

[ill-advised strategy]

Mmmmmm. Riblets

[Shred Baron]

That's kinda what I expected, and your picture shows you why it isn't so hard to believe a bit of core is poking out by every chair.

[tacklebox]

Now that we get down to it.....it sounds more like shoddy workmanship than a failing rope. If they cant take pride in what the public sees, how are they treating the stuff they cant see?

I was kinda anal about stuff like this when I was in they game, but I think you have to be when youve got a few hundred people in the air at any given time.

[slackerpbr]

I did lift maintenance for a season and every morning we had a checklist sheet where we would count broken strands and grip slip on fixed chairs that’s what the paint stripes are for . We would spend an hour per lift just doing safety checks a lot goes on before a lift goes on line. If you never want to ride a lift again google roll back obviously the detachable is more extensive

[ill-advised strategy]

I don't think this setup can slide, it looks like they spread the cable and insert the tab....rather than a clamp over the top of the cable.

I'm led to believe it's that spreading and insertion process that can leave a bit of nylon core sticking out, looking like frayed cable.

In any case, just noticing this and discussing it with patrol and management was explosive. Basically I became viewed as an enemy of the operations people. It's a long and complicated thing to explain but we were trying to have a field of machine-made moguls for a competition later in the season, and in the process of getting it all sorted out sometimes the run was roped off and I'd go in there with a shovel and work on it....and ski it...and work on it....and ski it. Twice these guys flipped out, and eventually this turned into a whole thing with me losing my pass and I spent a good amount of last season driving to a better ski area about 3 hours away instead of skiing this place a mile from my house. The pass-pulling incident involved a guy completely losing it, parking me in with a ski area vehicle and shoving and grabbing at me trying to rip the pass off my neck. I'm told that guy is gone, and there was a period of time where a friend was offered the job, but will likely turn it down.

So...long story short, instead of just getting on it and explaining in detail to me how this tuck and nylon thing can look like frayed cable, they dodged and went away simmering and stewing about it thinking what an asshole I was to have pointed it out. Never mind the whole reason I look up at the rigging now is because we've found a missing cotter pin from a chair on the loading ramp....so my trust in this operation is damaged. So I look, and when I look I see frayed cable...and being concerned about our fragile little ski area and public safety I mention it...you know, so they can deal with a little problem before it becomes a disaster. Duh. But their main response is to target me for retaliation.

People are crazy...I go through the same thing where I work. Yesterday a new coworker backed into a parking spot all the way into a chainlink fence and left his truck parked there with the bumper pushing the fence back like 6 inches. I don't know whose truck it is, or if it even is a coworker for sure, so I snapped a photo and texted it to the building superintendent saying "hey, if the fence is pushed back when you get in Monday, this is why"...so there's no mystery and they can deal with the professional driver who backed his pickup into a fence and left it there.
Response: if you're so worried about it call the police. So if I call the police the word around the shop all week will be about how I called the police on coworker; if I don't, this building superintendent will make big deal out of the dented fence and involve me. The response isn't to deal with the problem and say thanks for the heads-up, it's to retaliate against the messenger.
The general mentality is: we don't have a problem, you have a problem. Kill the messenger. The problem isn't the physical thing you're pointing out, but that you noticed it and you won't keep it to yourself. If we all agree not to notice or discuss problems, we magically have no problems...by extension, if we remove people who notice and discuss problems: problem solved!

[ill-advised strategy]

I didn't pitch a fit, it's not a big deal. I snapped a photo and sent it to the guy who will have to fix the fence tomorrow so he knows wtf happened.

If he were smart, he'd look into placing some curbstones at the edge of those parking spots. Instead, he responds with hostility toward me for sending him a photo of a problem I didn't cause. It's not taking a stand. It was a 30 second time commitment and what I viewed as a courtesy to him, the guy who has to fix the fence and will likely want to know who wrecked it for his paperwork.

[stayalert]

Where I work the person who backed into the fence would be all bullshit about the fence being there and who is going to pay for a new truck.

[SB]

liftblog.com

[Buster Highmen]

cliffs ridge.

[grskier]

It's a riblet style chair, as opined on the first page as a possibility.

ETA

Yeah, some people don't get far for a reason.

[powdrhound]

Since the subject is haul rope:
I have a Riblet chair and a piece of haul rope. I haven't hung it yet.
If I was able to get a tab, is it possible for a hack like me to spread the cable, to insert it?
I figured I would anchor one side and a couple feet away clamp on a 6' pipe, than torque it open. Hopefully not breaking any bones in the process.
Stupid idea?

Thanks.
Good info here. Glad you didn't delete it.

[ill-advised strategy]

We all have spheres of responsibility in our lives. sometimes these overlap with others. But when they don't overlap, and you step into someone else's sphere it can be seen as unwanted or hostile.... you are essentially telling some how to their job, and if you don't have a position of responsibility the value and motives for you stepping into their sphere are called into question.

If you have to step into someone's sphere as a matter of safety or imminent danger, this is generally acceptable. If its a trivial matter, social norms would dictate that you are a just a dick. Rather than assuming that you are smarter than everyone, and you should some how be policing their day to day operations of trivial matters, consider how you would feel people around you were regularly telling you how to do your job. specifically, telling you how to do things that you perceive as trivial in your day to day work.

Quite honestly, when it comes to trivial material or property damage, I would much rather not know who the specific individual is. Its much better, for everyone, to simply repair the minor damage (if that's even required) and simply make a blanket statement to all equipment users, reminding everyone of their responsibility for proper care and use. Having a single person to blame (ie the guy who backed into the fence) can lead to discipline and one on one discussion over a trivial matter, and often it reduces the organization's ability to address the problem on a broader scale (as its now a personal performance issue with that one employee) , chances are, he isn't the only guy to ever back into the fence, just the only guy to get ratted out.

some problems are only problems if you make them that.

Actually that building superintendent just got torn a new one today for not handling the matter when like 10 different people contacted him about the fucked up fence and truck that needed to be towed off of it. So, you know....my getting a hold of him was a courtesy to him, and he actually probably should have listened to me, the first of apparently many people who contacted him...the last being his boss, who is pissed he didn't handle it earlier.

Kind of like letting the ski area know there's something that looks sketchy on their haul rope before some lawyer or OSHA guy sees it and makes it worse.

The point was, and is, snarling at people who inform you of problems does not make problems disappear. A true friend tells you when you have spinach in your teeth, and tells the ski hill their haul rope looks frayed, and tells the building superintendent somebody ran his pond fence over. The douchebag looks at all that stuff and says "that's somebody else's problem".

It's all a matter of perspective. If you have half a brain and you're in a position of responsibility, taking in information about a potential problem isn't something that sets you off into a rage. I have people tell me about small issues all the time, even when it's useless information I don't view it as a hostile act. We're all in this together.

[goldengatestinx]

Not pointing out an issue like the fence could turn into a safety problem and people injured or killed.

Not addressing simple things and rules means the important ones are likely being ignored or bent. Cultural issues in an organization with more than internet butthurtz implications will end up with major issues sometime in the future.

[glademaster]

There's a very fine line between "doing the right thing" and being meddlesome. Very fine.

[Shred Baron]

Since the subject is haul rope:
I have a Riblet chair and a piece of haul rope. I haven't hung it yet.
If I was able to get a tab, is it possible for a hack like me to spread the cable, to insert it?
I figured I would anchor one side and a couple feet away clamp on a 6' pipe, than torque it open. Hopefully not breaking any bones in the process.
Stupid idea?

Thanks.
Good info here. Glad you didn't delete it.

You could get it open, how long is it. I haven't worked on riblet much, but for opening the rope if you had two chain wrenches, or a good vice (especially a pipe vice) with a bit of extra leverage on the wrench you could twist it open if it's not too long. The longer it is the more you're going to want someone turning the rope that's behind the wrench. The. You'll need to hold it, cut out some core and gently twist it back, it may really want to close back up so be careful, and have lots of leverage and an extra set of hands. Just a guess really never tried doing this exactly.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums