Nurses?

[wildmanwillie]

I had no idea there was so many nurses! I thought it was just dentists and lawyers here. Quite reassuring!
The nursing schedule is as awesome as I've convinced myself it is right?
Charting for 3 hours, ok nbd. Every job has a sucky element. I obviously have never done charting but it can't be that bad. Look, I'm entering data right now.

RUSTY: I've gotten tired of hearing cheerleaders supporting my decision/pursuit and needed to hear it from a group of people I relate to a bit more. Drink conversations with bumble chicks who just met me telling me 'you'll be a great nurse' and 'you'll do great in school' all just sound like proper etiquette bullshit. These people have no idea what I'm doing or who I am. The ABSN route is apparently really challenging and is 'the hardest thing you'll ever do' but I feel that most of these warnings are coming from kids in their mid-20s who only have undergrad to refer to as a 'hard thing to do'. Bet most of them have only had to learn to walk once in their lives. I got my wrist fused, so I've been learning to write again, again.

For those who went through the accelerated, I'd be interested in hearing what typical weeks were like. And if patho/pharma are the 'scariest things ever'. )For reference, braille driving in a white out is pretty high on my scary things scale.)

I don't think charting is that bad, however some people can't stand it. I also don't mind the physical element of the job, others are of the opinion a bachelor's degree should preclude them from physical exertion or other "tech work."

I did not think the accelerated BSN route was difficult. In my opinion the course material is not challenging relative to many other BS degrees. The time commitment was the most trying part for me. Pathophys will be hard if your A&P base is weak. Pharm takes time and memorization, definitely not scary like whiteout I70 driving with rental cars lurking just beyond your vis front and back.

BSN is my first and only degree. Started as a biochem major, which fulfilled most accelerated BSN prereqs, then applied to programs after my sophomore year. My goal is to pay off my student loans (~$40k at time of graduation) and start CRNA school within the next 5 years.

[wildmanwillie]

The nursing schedule is definitely as awesome as you've convinced yourself. My unit self schedules and I routinely work the first 3 and last 3 of a pay period which gives me 8 consecutive days off. Im using 6 days of PTO in March so I'll only work first 3 and last 3 days of the month

[lerxst]

ADN/BSN/CRNA. Started at the bottom now I'm here.

Would be happy to talk to any RN or RN candidate why you should not stop at BSN. CRNA is the absolute best career in healthcare.

[raisingarizona13]

Do you like data entry? It seems a large part of a nurse's job now is charting on the computer.

It's better than wiping asses and cleaning fore skins all day long.

[raisingarizona13]

I would forget nursing, find a good Rad Tech program and get your certification for MRI, CT and/or Ultrasound. You can get the same type of work schedule as an RN and it's clean and the portability is great. The pay nearly equal or equal to RNs.

I was thinking about this option but the job availability isn't nearly as good, or is it?

[shroom]

i think it is if you have the bachelors. have a few friends doing well with the ultrasound degree.

[Tryingtostaywarm]

Depends on what you want to do and what your background is. I did a ABSN after being out for six years from my previous undergrad(B.A.). Between that time, I had a federal law enforcement job which was mostly overseas. It was about half-way through my 18th month program that I realized that I wanted nothing to do with this profession. It drove me nuts hearing people bitch and moan all the time about 3x12's. Motherfuckers, you have four days off a week. The construction workers across the street are working 6x10's in the winter, outside. At the end of the day, I finished the program because I was already committed but went back to my old job.
It's a great profession if you are in it for the right reasons.

[ill-advised strategy]

I had no idea there was so many nurses! I thought it was just dentists and lawyers here. Quite reassuring!
The nursing schedule is as awesome as I've convinced myself it is right?
Charting for 3 hours, ok nbd. Every job has a sucky element. I obviously have never done charting but it can't be that bad. Look, I'm entering data right now.



I'm half alive but feeling mostly dead.



Good work.



See above.





Hi guys. I've been estranged for a while. Had planned to make a surprise appearance at Platts trail day, Magic trail day and UllrFest but I kept getting distracted by people dying.

RUSTY: I've gotten tired of hearing cheerleaders supporting my decision/pursuit and needed to hear it from a group of people I relate to a bit more. Drink conversations with bumble chicks who just met me telling me 'you'll be a great nurse' and 'you'll do great in school' all just sound like proper etiquette bullshit. These people have no idea what I'm doing or who I am. The ABSN route is apparently really challenging and is 'the hardest thing you'll ever do' but I feel that most of these warnings are coming from kids in their mid-20s who only have undergrad to refer to as a 'hard thing to do'. Bet most of them have only had to learn to walk once in their lives. I got my wrist fused, so I've been learning to write again, again.

For those who went through the accelerated, I'd be interested in hearing what typical weeks were like. And if patho/pharma are the 'scariest things ever'. )For reference, braille driving in a white out is pretty high on my scary things scale.)

There are other RNs here who aren't posting in the thread. There's a bunch.

The academics were really enjoyable and not hard, The youngest student in my cohort was 25, and she already had a masters degree in psychology...we had an Army medic just back from Iraq, we also had an Army ranger, we had a couple of 50 year olds. Why nursing school was the hardest thing ever for me (not a 20 year old): it's a world of bullshit, and I had a hard time tolerating it. The bullshit drains me, and the sad situations stay with me, and the generalized inability to fight the enormous momentum of it all makes me feel powerless and depressed. It's bullshit how we (society) condemn poor people to suffering. We bounce medicare people with the bare minimum and milk the guy in the next room with good insurance...it's bullshit. It's bullshit how companies and individuals enrich themselves from folks too sick to fight the system...the demented residents in long term care on 15 drugs they don't need, and nobody notices or cares. Drug companies are bullshit. Peoples' religious bullshit is bullshit. Dealing with rich, cocky doctors is bullshit. Lawyers and litigious people are bullshit. Drug addicts trying to con the system into a prescription are bullshit. Having to lie your way through interactions, pretending none of this bullshit bothers you is bullshit. I had to become a bullshitter to live in this morass of bullshit and maintain a cheerful, professional, positive demeanor. Obviously all this bothers me because I don't belong in there, or I don't belong in there because all of this bothers me...take your pick.... and the whole idea that there's so many jobs in nursing that there's surely a fit for whoever can handle the academics....that's bullshit. I enjoyed the academics.

So anyway, that was hard, but that wasn't really the hardest thing ever, the hardest thing ever was putting a few years (away from skiing) and a chunk of money (my life savings) into that with a growing sense of discomfort about it all, slowly realizing I really didn't want to live in a BS persona, surrounded by all that intractable BS, then having to scrap all that time and money and start from scratch again. That was hard.

Also, folks in this thread keep mistaking ADN and a nursing diploma. Without making value judgments, it's worth stating these are different tracks with different implications.

[Groomer Gambler]

My younger brother did a 1-yr surg tech program at NYU. His first job he was working in the trauma unit at NYU when he was 21yrs old starting salary in the 70k range (with lots of overtime). Now he works on plastic surgery surgeons for U Miami. Never finished an Associates degree. Ya, I know there's less upward mobility and pay raises, but he actually gets to be in on surgeries and has very little debt from the program.

Meanwhile, I have a bachelor's and looking at grad programs and have never made close to that.

[MagnificentUnicorn]

My younger brother did a 1-yr surg tech program at NYU. His first job he was working in the trauma unit at NYU when he was 21yrs old starting salary in the 70k range (with lots of overtime). Now he works on plastic surgery surgeons for U Miami. Never finished an Associates degree. Ya, I know there's less upward mobility and pay raises, but he actually gets to be in on surgeries and has very little debt from the program.

Meanwhile, I have a bachelor's and looking at grad programs and have never made close to that.

This is what I do. Got my training in the military. I make more than what your brother does here in Wenatchee. I only work on call Sunday through Thursday nights. Good schedule with a salary based on my hourly wage. Basically get paid for 40 hours for a 50 hours call commitment.. I probably am at work an average of 15 or less hours a week.

[nihiles]

If I had to rate my life experiences from easiest to hardest, my BScN would be some place in the middle, closer to the easy spectrum. But still, at the time it is quite demanding of your attention...

Did you live at/near school or commute?

I would forget nursing, find a good Rad Tech program and get your certification for MRI, CT and/or Ultrasound. You can get the same type of work schedule as an RN and it's clean and the portability is great. The pay nearly equal or equal to RNs.

I did look into it as this was something I was interested in back in high school but the schooling takes the same amount of time as earning the BSN which I believed would open more doors and options.
Along the lines of what CMCRAWFO, LERXST and others have mentioned.

Fuck these people that say you'll make a great nurse. Also, I've never seen a nurse truly take to ER after they turn 30-35. It's just hard to adjust your habits. Food for thought when you start. I would highly advise a year on tele or busy med-surg, then switch gears. One of the best, smartest nurses I've seen was maybe 27-28, and worked med-surg ortho, surgical, renal and onc, but was also trained for stroke tele and heart tele. That's one fucking bright individual that can write her ticket in any city in this country. Don't stunt your growth and start at a smaller, easier hospital, unless that's your only option. True, at a smaller hospital, you'll have less resources, but you will see less and have less room to grow. (Edit: So, less resources being a positive thing in that you will jump start your problem-solving skill set)

Good luck to all you nurse jongs!!

Hard to take to the ER after 30-35 for those who have previously been working in the field? Can you expand on what you mean since I'm 37...

I don't think this is what Gregory Isaacs had in mind.

Cool song. Never heard of this guy. Thanks!

I did not think the accelerated BSN route was difficult. In my opinion the course material is not challenging relative to many other BS degrees. The time commitment was the most trying part for me. Pathophys will be hard if your A&P base is weak. Pharm takes time and memorization, definitely not scary like whiteout I70 driving with rental cars lurking just beyond your vis front and back.

BSN is my first and only degree. Started as a biochem major, which fulfilled most accelerated BSN prereqs, then applied to programs after my sophomore year. My goal is to pay off my student loans (~$40k at time of graduation) and start CRNA school within the next 5 years.

That's similar to my plan with $40-50k. I want to do some travel nursing first and then start on CRNA before I turn 45.

[MagnificentUnicorn]

I did look into it as this was something I was interested in back in high school but the schooling takes the same amount of time as earning the BSN which I believed would open more doors and options.
Along the lines of what CMCRAWFO, LERXST and others have mentioned.

I never considered going back to nursing school, I don't want to be a nurse. I like being hands on working with the instruments and equipment and assisting in surgery. I've been lucky with my military training and have had managerial positions while still being able to stay in the OR and be hands on. The only part of my career I didn't like was a short stint working as a medical device salesman and as the director of a robotic surgery program. The latter led to all kinds of added responsibilities once they figured out I could solve problems and had no problems taking on extra duties. I wound up as the acting director of surgical services at a hospital in the Bay Area while the searched for a more "suitable" candidate. The COO and surgeons went to bat for me and they offered me a huge raise but I didn't have any sort of life outside work so I quit and moved here. That situation is what you can look forward to as a nurse if that's what you're looking for. If I had been able to continue to focus on the robotic and remote presence surgery I may still be there.

You are more limited being a surg tech than an RN and the opportunities for growth are limited for most but you can still work as a traveler and any hospital with an OR will have positions for surg techs. Last time I was looking I talked to places in Hailey ID, Mammoth Lakes, Vail, Redmond/Bend, South Lake Tahoe, Truckee, pretty much where ever I wanted, and they were eager to hire me because of how long I'd been doing it and my connections with surgeons I'd worked with over the years.

[delco714]

Bsn is the best bachelor's degree you can get. Period. I'm a PA and I'll admit It

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Bsn is the best bachelor's degree you can get. Period. I'm a PA and I'll admit It

I know more than one nurse that's going the PA route rather than getting a BSN or LNP. It really comes down to what you want. If you want to move into administration then a BSN is probably the way to go. There is absolutely no reason working nurses need a BSN. The whole push for more nurses because of a shortage and the drive to have all nurses be BSNs is because the state nursing associations have such a strong lobby. State nursing associations want to be in control of healthcare and hospitals. I'm not saying that's what all nurses want, most just want to work the floors and take care of people but the leadership wants more control.

[delco714]

I know more than one nurse that's going the PA route rather than getting a BSN or LNP. It really comes down to what you want. If you want to move into administration then a BSN is probably the way to go. There is absolutely no reason working nurses need a BSN. The whole push for more nurses because of a shortage and the drive to have all nurses be BSNs is because the state nursing associations have such a strong lobby. State nursing associations want to be in control of healthcare and hospitals. I'm not saying that's what all nurses want, most just want to work the floors and take care of people but the leadership wants more control.

Missed my point. Flexibility flexibility flexibility. It's a springboard for almost any position in healthcare including admin and insurance companies.

Asn going to PA school I mean is fine..you need to get a bachelor's anyway, but it'd be way simpler to get the bsn. Then become an np. Are they as well trained and flexible? No. But I'd you want guaranteed career success and labor force.. Yeah.. Any who..I digress

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Missed my point. Flexibility flexibility flexibility. It's a springboard for almost any position in healthcare including admin and insurance companies.

Asn going to PA school I mean is fine..you need to get a bachelor's anyway, but it'd be way simpler to get the bsn. Then become an np. Are they as well trained and flexible? No. But I'd you want guaranteed career success and labor force.. Yeah.. Any who..I digress

Some, a lot, of people don't care about a springboard to anything in healthcare or industry. Most want to take care of people and have a steady, good and secure income.

The idea that nursing should be the foundation of all things healthcare is relatively new and driven by the nursing lobby. Nurses by dint of their education aren't particularly well qualified for anything but nursing. Your example of a PA being better trained than an NP is apt. Why would you want to go to a lesser trained mid level? If our mission is to provide the very best patient care shouldn't we have the best trained and qualified people for each given area? Why have a catchall class of healthcare workers? I think nurses are great and have worked with many great ones. The ones I've worked with in administration usually are not that great because they tend to have an adversarial relationship with physicians and other more qualified administrators, this isn't always true but in my experience it usually is. Again this drive for nurse centric healthcare is because of a strong nursing lobby and has nothing to do with better healthcare IMO.

[delco714]

Some, a lot, of people don't care about a springboard to anything in healthcare or industry. Most want to take care of people and have a steady, good and secure income.

The idea that nursing should be the foundation of all things healthcare is relatively new and driven by the nursing lobby. Nurses by dint of their education aren't particularly well qualified for anything but nursing. Your example of a PA being better trained than an NP is apt. Why would you want to go to a lesser trained mid level? If our mission is to provide the very best patient care shouldn't we have the best trained and qualified people for each given area? Why have a catchall class of healthcare workers? I think nurses are great and have worked with many great ones. The ones I've worked with in administration usually are not that great because they tend to have an adversarial relationship with physicians and other more qualified administrators, this isn't always true but in my experience it usually is. Again this drive for nurse centric healthcare is because of a strong nursing lobby and has nothing to do with better healthcare IMO.

Can't Argue most of that. We need more PA in admin

[old goat]

Some, a lot, of people don't care about a springboard to anything in healthcare or industry. Most want to take care of people and have a steady, good and secure income.

The idea that nursing should be the foundation of all things healthcare is relatively new and driven by the nursing lobby. Nurses by dint of their education aren't particularly well qualified for anything but nursing. Your example of a PA being better trained than an NP is apt. Why would you want to go to a lesser trained mid level? If our mission is to provide the very best patient care shouldn't we have the best trained and qualified people for each given area? Why have a catchall class of healthcare workers? I think nurses are great and have worked with many great ones. The ones I've worked with in administration usually are not that great because they tend to have an adversarial relationship with physicians and other more qualified administrators, this isn't always true but in my experience it usually is. Again this drive for nurse centric healthcare is because of a strong nursing lobby and has nothing to do with better healthcare IMO.

The advantage of having nurses in health care administration is that they tend to think of patients and patient care first and dollars second. There are obviously exceptions. Certainly better than having the docs in administration--they put what's best for the docs first--as at Tahoe Forest in Truckee where the BOD is dominated by docs on staff. The trick is to choose nurses for administrative posts based on their leadership qualities and peer-relationship skills, rather than their resumes and seniority.

Nothing wrong with PA's but the PA's I know don't seem to have an interest in anything more ambitious than doing their job (except for my friend that likes to spend his weekends in a kilt throwing around rocks and telephone poles.)

[summit]

Nursing school isn't that hard. It is not nearly as conceptually hard as your science prereqs. Those prereqs form your broad foundational knowledge base that you can apply to analyzing nursing problems. Nursing school is a lot more about analysis, application of knowledge, and jumping through hoops. Conceptually, the nursing school challenge is fusing all your knowledge and applying it to critically analyze situations and choose the best actions with proper prioritization... that and human interactions + time management.

I guess what I'm saying is know your biology so you can understand your A&P so you can understand your Pathophys. Then you'll be fine conceptually in nursing school.

Well you can get a 2 year licence (ADN) for $2K/semester @ a Jr College while prob double that in a 4 year program. Get your diploma go to work and get your BSN on line a lt's cheaper and make decent $$ the while.

The problem is in a lot of markets you will have to move rural or work nursing home nightshift or as a glorified assistant at a doctor's office while you earn that BSN and the hospital may still say "good you got a BSN, but you no longer a new grand and have no acute care experience so move along."

A bigger problem with the EMR is that at least in Epic, which is the one I'm familiar with, there is no easy way for a nurse to communicate in an easy-to-locate place things he or she is concerned about. In paper charts nurses would enter progress notes on the same pages as physician progress notes. Now the nurses' notes--if there are any notes;there may only be a lot of checked boxes that don't tell you anything-- are sequestered and easily ignored. Maybe other EMR's are different.

Nurses can write progress notes in Epic, but most don't because who has time to do that after charting 600-1000 boxes per patient?

My old format was:

Patient Summary
Dx
Shift Summary
Review of Systems

Now I work #1 and #2 most common EMRs with a gajillion boxes, but only write actual notes if something extraordinary requires it.

[summit]

Hard to take to the ER after 30-35 for those who have previously been working in the field? Can you expand on what you mean since I'm 37...

That's similar to my plan with $40-50k. I want to do some travel nursing first and then start on CRNA before I turn 45.

Are you EMS or prior service?

Realize you need ICU, not ER, if you want to do CRNA.

[MagnificentUnicorn]

Nothing wrong with PA's but the PA's I know don't seem to have an interest in anything more ambitious than doing their job (except for my friend that likes to spend his weekends in a kilt throwing around rocks and telephone poles.)

You say this like it's a bad thing. Too often I see people with ambition try and advance and they haven't begun to master their job. Did you stop improving and learning during your career? I would bet no. If satisfaction and success is measured by striving for absolute mastery of your job, then that's who I want taking care of me and making decisions.

[old goat]

You say this like it's a bad thing. Too often I see people with ambition try and advance and they haven't begun to master their job. Did you stop improving and learning during your career? I would bet no. If satisfaction and success is measured by striving for absolute mastery of your job, then that's who I want taking care of me and making decisions.

No--I don't see it as a bad thing at all. Way too many ambitious people in the world. I was never ambitious myself--basically did the same thing for 26 years without any desire to manage (I did wind up as chief of vascular surgery in a 2 man dept and the other guy was unmanageable (although a great surgeon) --worth an extra $300/month for doing the same thing I was doing already.) We had a lot of Air Force surgeons--they all left the AF because staying in meant getting moved to administrative jobs and out of the OR.
One of the big reasons I retired when I did--age 61--was that I had lost the desire to keep improving and learning. Didn't think it was fair to my patients to keep practicing if I wasn't keeping up. A lot of people hang on to their careers long after they should have quit; I was fortunate I could afford to quit (thank you DOD and the American taxpayer for putting my kid through med school).
I have great respect for PA's--although when I heard the president of the national PA organization speak at a convention, the guy had a mullet.

[ill-advised strategy]

If satisfaction and success is measured by striving for absolute mastery of your job, then that's who I want taking care of me and making decisions.

amen!

[raisingarizona13]

[QUOTE=Summit;4873251]Nursing school isn't that hard. It is not nearly as conceptually hard as your science prereqs. Those prereqs form your broad foundational knowledge base that you can apply to analyzing nursing problems.



This is great to hear. I'm in AP-2 right now and I'm not having any fun at all. In fact, this is miserable. AP-1, Bio-081, Chem and now this have been awful. I'm struggling with it. My kids Mom and every other nurse I know says that they don't really ever use this stuff and they barely remember any of it. I'm sort of gathering that I'm developing a basic idea of how the body works but there is no way I'm going to remember details. It's WAY too much information way too fast. I did the AP-1 in a condensed summer course, it was 8 weeks long, I made it through it but my head was spinning and I didn't think I learned anything but I'm starting to see some of that material coming back and I think I have it stored away somewhere. Things are sort of starting to click anyways.

[nihiles]

There are other RNs here who aren't posting in the thread. There's a bunch.

The academics were really enjoyable and not hard...

So anyway, that was hard, but that wasn't really the hardest thing ever, the hardest thing ever was putting a few years (away from skiing) and a chunk of money (my life savings) into that with a growing sense of discomfort about it all, slowly realizing I really didn't want to live in a BS persona, surrounded by all that intractable BS, then having to scrap all that time and money and start from scratch again. That was hard.

So are you a nurse or did you go through it all, say fuck the bullshit and are in a different career path?
I have a masters in media and live outside NYC. Media jobs abound but I wasn't interested in having three phones and constantly being connected. Keeping up with Kardashians so you can maximize is bullshit. Every job is going to have bullshit. But drilling down to the things I would be doing everyday, pumping out marketing tweets does far less for the betterment of society as a whole than helping people when they are hurt or sick.

I never considered going back to nursing school, I don't want to be a nurse. I like being hands on working with the instruments and equipment and assisting in surgery.

You are more limited being a surg tech than an RN and the opportunities for growth are limited for most but you can still work as a traveler and any hospital with an OR will have positions for surg techs.

I decided on nursing over surg tech because the schooling was about the same amount of time and the pay was more. Yes, traveling is something I want to do but that also includes long breaks between contracts to study Eastern medicine in Asia or spend a summer at a Boy Scout camp (climbing instructor). Theoretically, at a nurses higher salary I can still clear $40k working 9 or 10 months of they year. If I can make that in less time even better. $40k is my sweet spot to live.

Some, a lot, of people don't care about a springboard to anything in healthcare or industry. Most want to take care of people and have a steady, good and secure income.

I don't know that I want a springboard but I do know that it's smart to lay a foundation should I ever want to mount a springboard in the future.

Are you EMS or prior service?

Realize you need ICU, not ER, if you want to do CRNA.

Yes, I know I need ICU for CRNA. I've been a volunteer EMT for a little over 2 years. This past summer I worked as the EMT at Boy Scout camp since I had wrist surgery and couldn't teach climbing. Was busier in those 6 weeks than all the volunteer time combined.
I'm also OEC for ski patrol and though it's expired I was at Woofer. A lot of people hear this and say 'oh then nursing school will be even easier' which I don't quite get. Yes it means I have patient contact experience but I don't think it will help with the academic side. That's what all the pre-reqs were about right? Going more in-depth than the anatomy of EMT/OEC.

[QUOTE=raisingarizona13;4873540]

Nursing school isn't that hard. It is not nearly as conceptually hard as your science prereqs. Those prereqs form your broad foundational knowledge base that you can apply to analyzing nursing problems.


This is great to hear. I'm in AP-2 right now and I'm not having any fun at all. In fact, this is miserable. AP-1, Bio-081, Chem and now this have been awful. I'm struggling with it. My kids Mom and every other nurse I know says that they don't really ever use this stuff and they barely remember any of it. I'm sort of gathering that I'm developing a basic idea of how the body works but there is no way I'm going to remember details. It's WAY too much information way too fast. I did the AP-1 in a condensed summer course, it was 8 weeks long, I made it through it but my head was spinning and I didn't think I learned anything but I'm starting to see some of that material coming back and I think I have it stored away somewhere. Things are sort of starting to click anyways.

I loved AP1 but AP2 sucked. Mostly because of the professor. But school is what you make of it. I'm hoping things start to click for me as well as the schooling gets moving. I had AP1 over a year ago so last night I dug up my notes and books and have them out for review... now I gotta find the time to go with it. Shit, what have I been doing for the last hour?!!?