Truck Tire Time

[bodywhomper]

Yes, they also have P-metric in some sizes, at the cost of durability. I drive a lot of rocky roads so I do want the extra durability.

Aren’t the c-rate wildpeaks that you talked about getting p-metric? The roads that we frequently drive are also very rocky.

[bodywhomper]

General Grabber ATX. I did a ton of research when it came time to replace the same Coopers you've been running and couldn't find any really negative reviews.

Thx. I’ve seen those come up multiple times in my brief searches but i haven’t looked close at them. We have happily run their snow tires on two of our cars for years.

[east or bust]

Anyone have experience with the new-ish BFG Trail Terrain? Not the easiest 2 words to search on here and there aren't a ton of reviews online.

Have a dedicated set of snows for winter, so not too concerned with snow/ice performance but obviously there's always the potential for mid April/October storms. My summer tires since I bought this vehicle ('09 4runner) in 2019 have been Yokohama YK-HTX, which, have actually been pretty damn good for what I've been using the vehicle for - very light fire road travels, longer road trips, etc. I think the K02 is more tire than I need and the Trail Terrain may be a good difference-splitter.

[MarsB]

Yes, I've been running Trail Terrains on my '05 4Runner since November '21. I bought them for similar reasons as you state, more highway friendly than the KO2 (had several sets of these on different vehicles). Extremely pleased with them through two winters in northern Utah, light off-roading in the Uintas, etc. 3PMSF so they pass muster with the Cottonwood Canyon restrictions, they do very well in both snow and mud but are lighter and more efficient as advertised for highway driving. Way quieter than KO2s. Highly recommend for what you describe.

[auvgeek]

Aren’t the c-rate wildpeaks that you talked about getting p-metric? The roads that we frequently drive are also very rocky.

P-metric have load ranges LL, SL, and XL. LT have load range B-F. So the C-rated Wildpeak AT3W (and Toyo AT3) are LT tires but not as stiff as the E-rated Mickey Thompsons. For FS roads in a lighter truck (aluminum F150), I want something that I can air down to 20 psi and have some sidewall flex for comfort. I believe the sidewalls on the E-rated Baja Boss ATs will barely flex at 20 psi.

There are a lot of different aspects that go into making a tire durable for gravel/offroad use, and the load rating isn't everything. And I'm also not an expert.

I think the K02 is more tire than I need and the Trail Terrain may be a good difference-splitter.

Yokohama G015 is also a good "light AT" tire to consider. We run a P-metric on our Outback, and it's great.

[bodywhomper]

So maybe I need to refresh my memory, but isn’t load index the more accurate info over load range designation? When I look at the falken website, it looks like the at3 lt versus non-LT are likely different tires. Also, don’t see a “c-rate” load rating for in 285-75-17, only two different “e-rate” with higher load index values than the c-rate tires.

My retired tire guy used to tell me that if you truly wanted side wall protection, look for tires with marketing material or specs about extra sidewalk protection. At that time, the KO2 was the only AT tire easily available with that sort of extra sidewalk material

[SchralphMacchio]

For FS roads in a lighter truck (aluminum F150), I want something that I can air down to 20 psi and have some sidewall flex for comfort. I believe the sidewalls on the E-rated Baja Boss ATs will barely flex at 20 psi.

Well you can look at the load inflation charts for each manufacturer and see if any will even let you go down to 20.

Here is Falken’s, looks like 35 psi is their minimum published inflation pressure in the load inflation charts.

https://www.falkentire.com/load-inflation

You ever scaled your truck with gear and passengers (or empty for that matter)? We have a lot of ag and timber scales around here that I hit up from time to time just to get a good sense of weight distribution and payload.

I’ll have to check out Michelin’s inflation chart to see what I would feel comfortable airing down to for MTB shuttle season … LTX AT2 is not the most forgiving when I have it set to door sticker recommendations for tire pressure, but that’s what I get for using a 10k GVWR vehicle also as a daily driver and adventure vehicle …

[anotherVTskibum]

Well you can look at the load inflation charts for each manufacturer and see if any will even let you go down to 20.

Here is Falken’s, looks like 35 psi is their minimum published inflation pressure in the load inflation charts.

https://www.falkentire.com/load-inflation

You ever scaled your truck with gear and passengers (or empty for that matter)? We have a lot of ag and timber scales around here that I hit up from time to time just to get a good sense of weight distribution and payload.

I’ll have to check out Michelin’s inflation chart to see what I would feel comfortable airing down to for MTB shuttle season … LTX AT2 is not the most forgiving when I have it set to door sticker recommendations for tire pressure, but that’s what I get for using a 10k GVWR vehicle also as a daily driver and adventure vehicle …

I'm pretty sure rated tire load is more relevant at highway speeds than bumping down a semi primitive road. I don't think anyone who airs down seriously for rock crawling, mud or sand driving is sticking to those load numbers.

I'd personally be very comfortable dropping my tires to 20 psi for off-road use, and I'd seriously consider 12-15 psi if doing something particularly silly. For what it's worth, that's running LT tires on an F-150 where 38-39 PSI matches the OEM tire load rating at placard pressure.

I would, however, be pretty quick to reinflate when approaching pavement. I've had an underinflated tire fail on a passenger car on the highway, presumably due to overheating, and I don't really want to do that again.

[SchralphMacchio]

That’s good feedback, thanks!

Personally I still couldn’t imagine going too far below the minimum inflation numbers, partly because I have highway approaches to our FS roads and I don’t have a legit compressor onboard that could easily handle rapid re-airing of all the tires. But also I’m not trying to do silly stuff, just not have such a harsh and bucking ride getting to various THs.

[anotherVTskibum]

That’s good feedback, thanks!

Personally I still couldn’t imagine going too far below the minimum inflation numbers, partly because I have highway approaches to our FS roads and I don’t have a legit compressor onboard that could easily handle rapid re-airing of all the tires. But also I’m not trying to do silly stuff, just not have such a harsh and bucking ride getting to various THs.

I've got vastly more experience riding a 500-pound BMW motorcycle in places better suited to a dirt bike, and if the same lessons hold true (which, in my experience, they tend to), tires designed to work well at lower pressure will give vastly more traction at 15 PSI than at 25, and short highway connections aren't a huge deal as long as you realize handling will be affected. One big caveat: it's possible for tires that are road oriented to close up the gaps between tread blocks when pressure drops enough.

I have a Viair 88P. It's not super quick for truck-sized tires (going from 15 back to 40 takes some time), but at the time I bought it, anything better was a big step up in price. The motorcycle was quicker but more of a pain since I just used an MTB pump.

[muted reborn]

I'm getting new tires on right now - anyone think I should keep the worn KO T/As with 4/32 of tread left on them and sell the set for maybe $200? I thought I read here months ago that clapped out truck tires with some thread are easy to sell - I'm in SLC so a big market of big ass trucks, although the tires aren't huge 285 70 17, E rated.

[SchralphMacchio]

Do you like dealing with sketchy people from Craigslist or FB marketplace? What’s the datecode anyways?

II’m sure someone on hard times would appreciate a cheap solution for a year or so, $200 is probably steep considering that mounting and balancing will cost the buying party, but $150 is probably square. I also wouldn’t feel right selling them if the date codes are from before 2019.

[mcski]

I was looking for basically what you have at that price a while back but couldn’t find the size and ended up buying some nice new rubber

I think they’d sell pretty easily and quickly on CL

[Buzzworthy]

I'm getting new tires on right now - anyone think I should keep the worn KO T/As with 4/32 of tread left on them and sell the set for maybe $200? I thought I read here months ago that clapped out truck tires with some thread are easy to sell - I'm in SLC so a big market of big ass trucks, although the tires aren't huge 285 70 17, E rated.

Whadya get?

[El Chupacabra]

Do you like dealing with sketchy people from Craigslist or FB marketplace? What’s the datecode anyways?

II’m sure someone on hard times would appreciate a cheap solution for a year or so, $200 is probably steep considering that mounting and balancing will cost the buying party, but $150 is probably square. I also wouldn’t feel right selling them if the date codes are from before 2019.

I agree $200 is unlikely at 4/32" tread, but I could see you getting $100 for the set.

A 2019 manufacturing date is nothing to be concerned about. Tire shop probably won't mount anything older than 6 years, but 10 years (or visible cracking, chunking, etc) is the disposal time. A 2019 tire with 4/32" tread isn't going to last long enough to be a problem.

[jmedslc]

Thanks. I believe the “W” of the Cooper At-W stood for “winter.”

The tire that I’m looking at is available in both p-metric and lt versions with the deeper tread and higher max weight being the differences on paper. Are there any other functional differences? Does the higher load rating make the sidewalls more durable to rocks? I’ve torn one side wall on an all season in my van in the middle of no where, which sucked, and clipped a rock on the sidewalk in my land cruiser that resulted in a sidewalk bulge/delamination with the p-metric copper AT tires. My current thought is to get the LT version because of added tread depth with the compromise of a harsher ride, which we may not notice. Thoughts?

Looking through tire rack, the toyo open country a/t III also looks interesting….

So ko2, open country a/t III, and wild peak at3w…. Are reviewers finding huge functional differences/experiences?

It’s my understanding that LT tires will generally have more plies and as such be tougher all around, while being able to run a higher pressure. While my tundra doesn’t require LT tires, I only run them now due to carrying weight, pulling trailer and just generally rallying the fuck out of the truck in the desert. Last thing I need is a wimpy P tire blowing out 40miles down a dirt road.

[bodywhomper]

It’s my understanding that LT tires will generally have more plies and as such be tougher all around, while being able to run a higher pressure. While my tundra doesn’t require LT tires, I only run them now due to carrying weight, pulling trailer and just generally rallying the fuck out of the truck in the desert. Last thing I need is a wimpy P tire blowing out 40miles down a dirt road.

I have read inconsistent information from tire companies and tire sellers about "LT," ply, and associated load rating. It seems like a lot is old semantics and marketing. "E" tires do not actually have 10 plys anymore, supposedly. In the past, I have looked at the load index rating value as the general consideration of the strength of the sidewalls, unless there's information about material differences in sidewalls, like the "CoreGard" layer in the KO2's. However, I have seen tires with "LT" and none "LT" versions where the LT version is pretty different, deeper treads, larger shoulder blocks, and more vertical (versus curved) sidewalls.

i called my local tire shop of repute, "family owned since 1950," to get their recommendations and quotes. it took a while for the guy to understand my need (he kept recommending highway-oriented tires, focusing on noise). He had one question to eliminate all E-rate: are you frequently hauling or carrying a lot of weight? "No" means that he's looking at non-E rate tires. Recommendations were Wildpeak AT3 ($1073) and Toyo Open Country ($1302), both with 116 load index. Also recommended cooper discoverer at tires, but I shared my experience of torn tread blocks on the AT-Ws and not being interested.

ya'll running 50 psi in your E rate LT tires in your SUV or light trucks?

[anotherVTskibum]

I'm currently running 39 PSI rear and 41 front in 275/70/18 E-rated tires on my F-150; I started much closer to 50 and had serious center-biased wear on my summer (AT) tires that way. I do have about 200 pounds of winch and bumper adversely affecting the front/rear weight balance on my F-150.

E rated tires are considered equivalent to old 10-ply tires for weight bearing capabilities and thus are described as "10-ply rated," but that actually has no direct connection to actual construction details. For off-road resistance to damage, the actual sidewall construction seems to be more relevant, and you'll have to dig through descriptions for that. A lot of the tires specifically designed to avoid damage will call that out (iirc three sidewall plies are common in that group of tires), while others will make you dig for the sidewall ply count because it's only 2.

I run LT tires primarily because of beefier construction relative to the p-metric tires that came on the truck, and in no small part because I got to install my spare at the far end of a high clearance forest service road. It happened to be a nice day, but it could easily have been a much worse experience. Some of the off-road-targeted p-metric tires may well have comparable resistance to sidewall damage.

[SchralphMacchio]

Heh, I’m running 64 psi front / 68 psi rear

[jackattack]

ya'll running 50 psi in your E rate LT tires in your SUV or light trucks?

Only when the camper is loaded.

[bodywhomper]

Toyo’s website for the open country atiii, describes three different tires: “floatation,” LT-metric, and p-metric. Looking at their tire specs for the different sizes, you can only sort of know what’s what; it’s not clear.

[Cocximus]

Asking for a friend, can wildpeaks be studded?

[bodywhomper]

Anybody have negative experiences to the ko2 compared to the at3w, open country atIII, or general grabber atx? The deal from Costco for the ko2 ends today.

I've been learning myself a bit. I got a lot of info from these threads:
https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/do-...-tire.1125424/
https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/tir...dation.997546/

And there's a doc from toyo linked to from this page related to figuring out the optimal tire pressure for pavement
https://www.toyotires.com/tires-101/...lation-tables/

Talking to my wife, our cruiser's weekly use in the summer is 1/3-1/2 mileage spent on rough FS or county roads/trails, and occasionally we'll use it for a road trip instead of our mini van when we know we'll spend a loy of time offroad. We also use the truck for towing a trailer loaded with wood, slash, or dump run stuff. And I've delamed a sidewall on a p-metric at tire. So we're going LT (e-rate is all I find in the size I need). Thinking about ko2 from Costco over ordering at3w's or atIII's from tire rack and trying to get a local shop to install. I think'll be about the same price (w/in $50). But the ko2 have that extra sidewall protective layer. Maybe the generals do, too?

[SchralphMacchio]

I can’t say anything about those specific models but here are some thoughts.
-I believe the Costco deals rotate 2 months off / 2 months on, and they switch back and forth between their various brands (e.g., 2 months Bridge/Firestone $150 off then 2 months Mich/BFG)
-Costco has a great warranty and fills with nitrogen, but install appointments can be limited and you have to book decently in advance; Costco also has limited services and capabilities (like no trueing/shaving, so your options with them are usually new replacement and deal with the traction difference on a part time 4WD or refund for the tire if you have full time AWD)
-I don’t think towing a utility trailer, even full of firewood, would affect much as it’s probably rarely going to add more than 300 lbs of axle weight, it’s nothing in comparison to a side by side in a truck bed, or a travel trailer with 1300 lbs tongue weight … for me it means my tears wear out a lot faster when I tow and I have to have air pressure changed up to deal with the different axle weights
-I think the BFG has a great reputation for off road performance superior to the Falken, might as well just go that route if you live near a Costco and the price is right! Or if you trust your local Toyo or Falken dealer more than you trust Costco, maybe go that route …

That was a really cool article about tire inflation BTW. I kind of knew, and mentioned above that your tire pressure would be different in an LT but I didn’t know why. I’ll have to re-read it again in more detail later.

[SchralphMacchio]

Also have you checked rim width to confirm the new size will work? If it doesn’t, I’m guessing Costco is a no hassle return. Contrast that to Tire Rack …