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Thread: Climate Change
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09-28-2022, 11:48 AM #1001Registered User
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Solid follow up meme, you're learning!
"playing god" is a euphemism for when man tries to upend the natural order of things.
Why that word triggered you may require introspection on your part, not force the TGR collective to read your tangential drivel that does not address the topic at hand, at all.
Don't have substance? I'm here on topic talking about problems and potential solutions related to climate change. You're in here talking....politics....god.... Honestly we are all at a loss on where your (lack of) logic is going here.
Speaking of substance. Do you have any substantive opinions on climate change? TGR has different forum options for your political opinions if that's what you solely choose to dwell upon.Last edited by Percy Rideout; 09-28-2022 at 01:45 PM.
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09-28-2022, 02:22 PM #1002
New Yorker article on energy storage. Physics for poets.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2...ewable-storage
Much as I hate to admit it, Percy is echoing what John Wesley Powell said--that agriculture and habitation in the West should be limited and only be along watercourses. But now we're 150 years of unrestrained growth and development and industrial agriculture in the desert and trying to dig our way out of a hole, which is tough to do. It's hard for me to imagine that Phoenix and Las Vegas will exist in 20 or 50 or who knows how many years. Even cities on big rivers, like Sacramento, aren't safe.
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09-28-2022, 02:28 PM #1003
This might be a solution..
Enough salt to last forever!Go that way really REALLY fast. If something gets in your way, TURN!
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09-28-2022, 02:33 PM #1004
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09-28-2022, 06:26 PM #1005
Denmark is positioning themselves to produce hydrogen via electrolysis from wind power. Their plan is to turn it into a major export industry.
Producing electricity on an industrial scale that doesn’t emit carbon is a huge task. Neither Solar or wind are able to scale up to that currently. We’re going to need some serious innovation and investing. I’m not optimistic.
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09-28-2022, 06:56 PM #1006
It doesn’t have to be carbon zero. Just really low carbon. Especially if ICEs, shipping, etc get off fossil fuels.
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09-28-2022, 07:41 PM #1007Registered User
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09-28-2022, 08:18 PM #1008
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09-28-2022, 08:31 PM #1009
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09-28-2022, 11:26 PM #1010
Biomass to hydrogen: https://www.energy.gov/eere/fuelcell...t%20combustion.
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09-29-2022, 09:22 AM #1011
Biomass for hydrogen makes sense if the source is material that would otherwise be burned or landfilled and turned into fee methane. It doesn't make sense if, as the article suggests, plants are grown for the purpose of turning them into hydrogen. If there is land that isn't needed for food (is there?) better to plant trees and let them keep growing and absorbing carbon and producing hydrogen with non-carbon energy.
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09-29-2022, 01:05 PM #1012
It’s being explored to address ag practices that typically included open burning. It’s also being explored as a part of forest management.
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09-29-2022, 07:12 PM #1013
Yeah, that's an appropriate use of biomass. When a biomass plant was being considered for the landfill outside Truckee they said there was far more biomass from clearing projects than the plant could handle. But the article did claim that there's a lot more ag capacity than we need for food --which I doubt, especially when western ag goes off line due to lack of water--which should be used for biomass. In any case, growing plants specifically to turn into hydrogen isn't the way to go long term. As a transition it does make sense. I wouldn't count on carbon capture though--according to my geophysicist friend who designs carbon capture projects he thinks capture can reduce CO2 by 5-10% of the amount emitted.
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09-30-2022, 09:23 AM #1014Registered User
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That was what caught my eye: too much CO2 to get a little H.
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09-30-2022, 11:23 AM #1015
I should clarify--what my friend said is that carbon capture, if employed to the fullest extent possible, would reduce carbon emissions by 5-10% of the current total national amount. This was a totally of the top of his head number. Presumably the CO2 generated by biomass plants would be captured much more effectively. But then what to do with the CO2? The number one use is to inject into oil wells to squeeze out more oil. Number to is to manufacture synthetic fuels and plastics. Or it can be injected into the earth, which sounds like another huge industry if we make biomass hydrogen on a massive scale.
On another note, watching a piece on saving Venice (from rising seas, not from the Russians)--apparently salt marshes are far more effective absorbers of carbon dioxide than forests. (And by far the biggest users of CO2 are algae, so be careful when you call someone pond scum--you would be praising them. Maybe we should stop worrying about nutrient runoff into bodies of water--like Lake Tahoe--in order to preserve their clarity.)
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09-30-2022, 11:47 AM #1016
My take is that this is an all solutions at once approach that’s necessary. There are definitely plans being made for injecting CO2 into the ground for storage. Many provide multiple solutions. Wetland restoration in bays, coastlines, estuaries provide ecological benefits, assist with protecting inland adjacent built-out areas from sea level rise, provide recreational benefits, provide jobs (planning, development, and maintenance), and provide sequestration.
In California, I see biomass as a necessary component for forest restoration, dealing with veg ag waste, and dealing with veg waste from landscape property maintenance. It seems a far better alternative compare to other options, such as high severity massive habitat transitioning wildfires, enormous open pile burns, and open ag burning.
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09-30-2022, 03:16 PM #1017
My take is that we are totally fucked.
Enjoy the day I guess.dirtbag, not a dentist
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09-30-2022, 05:13 PM #1018
This ^^X1000
In order to have measurable impact in the next few decades, all options, tailored to the local energy opportunities, ecology, and economy need to be implemented yesterday. Especially the ones that help preserve ecosystem resilience and economic adaptability. There is no silver bullet, but for the removal of our species from the equation. And I like being here, and providing that opportunity to my progeny.
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09-30-2022, 05:15 PM #1019
“We can’t afford the luxury of nihilism.”
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09-30-2022, 06:40 PM #1020Registered User
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Whoa .... who said anything about ferrets in the bathtub?!?!?
Absolutley, anything that produces a net, however slight, reduction in green house gases, should be employed if possible.
The trick is to convince lazy, change resistant people to buy in and participate. The zombie cultists are a complete lost cause and no energy whatsoever should be wasted on them.
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09-30-2022, 06:53 PM #1021
Yep , And it must be done in a way that doesn't create millions of poor people . Lets see what happens in Europe this winter . It's going to be bad when people can't afford heat ,they'll resort to burning everything and anything to stay warm ,definitely not friendly to the environment.
As far as injecting C02 into the ground ...Bad Idea
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Nyos_disaster
A seismic event could trigger a disaster.
Ok ....flash forward Fossil fuels are gone .....Now all of the byproducts that are integrated into daily life will need to have substitutes , plastic in skis? Tires, computers ,pretty much start from scratch to re engineer life.
Like RA says totally effed .....Good intentions can have detrimental un intended consequences ......
Plant Trees!"It's only steep if you're backseat"
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09-30-2022, 08:16 PM #1022
I’ve been told that biomass in California has very thin margins. In most of NorCal, there’s also the issue of dependence on pge.
Article on co2 injection in California: https://mavensnotebook.com/2022/01/0...26373291015625
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09-30-2022, 09:46 PM #1023
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09-30-2022, 09:49 PM #1024
The fact that we don't burn fossil fuels doesn't mean we can't use them to make stuff, provided we can make that stuff without generating CO2. I'm totally ignorant of the chemistry involved and maybe that's not possible, or maybe it means completely changing refineries. Better yet, maybe we can make more stuff out of all the biomass we get from raking the forest.
What do you mean by thin margins? I can think of a couple of ways to interpret that. And do you mean biomass for electricity generation? I assume that's what you're talking about, or do you mean biomass for hydrogen production?
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10-01-2022, 12:45 AM #1025
Climate Change
Thin profit margin for investors to get a facility built and operating, so I’ve been told… and I believe that’s both of those types of biomass facility. I conflated the two (energy and H production). Sry
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