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  1. #4001
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    Aug 2010
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    Park City
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    We are our own worse enemy

    Quote Originally Posted by evasive_MT View Post
    When the “Alliance for the Wild Rockies” is filing suit on behalf of suburban homeowners’ recreation preference, I think it’s a pretty clear sign they’ve strayed from whatever their mission is.

    Yes, it’s definitely older equestrians who are imagining mountain bikers riding 30 mph everywhere, and who don’t have any sense of responsibility for their skittish 1-ton prey animals. I participated in a working group that took us from the draft to a new proposal that’s essentially what the final plan is. I don’t have any trouble imagining some people continuing to undermine that.
    Have you ever been hit by a descending rider? It happens to me every year. Freakin last year it was two guys from the same NICA team on different days. While I've never been creamed, I have had numerous encounters where guys finish their skid touching me or with me having to bail. It's changed how I act when climbing and made me super aware coming around blind spots on trails. That shit scares me on the bike. On a horse it would be terrifying. So, I hate horse crap and I hate the way they damage trails in the spring, or after any rain. But, we could be better about managing our image.

  2. #4002
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canada1 View Post
    Have you ever been hit by a descending rider? It happens to me every year. Freakin last year it was two guys from the same NICA team on different days. While I've never been creamed, I have had numerous encounters where guys finish their skid touching me or with me having to bail. It's changed how I act when climbing and made me super aware coming around blind spots on trails. That shit scares me on the bike. On a horse it would be terrifying. So, I hate horse crap and I hate the way they damage trails in the spring, or after any rain. But, we could be better about managing our image.
    I find that not riding in the main descending line around blind corners works really well to avoid conflict.

    IDK if this is you or not, but there are folks who live and die by "ascending rider has the right of way" instead of using common sense to try and share the trail and avoid conflict. Its these folks who seem to have the lion's share of bad encounters with descending riders, and seem to be looking to find things to grumble about during their recreation. they are also the same people who drive the speed limit in the left lane, because they legally can.

  3. #4003
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    Dec 2007
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    Hell Track
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canada1 View Post
    Have you ever been hit by a descending rider? It happens to me every year. Freakin last year it was two guys from the same NICA team on different days. While I've never been creamed, I have had numerous encounters where guys finish their skid touching me or with me having to bail. It's changed how I act when climbing and made me super aware coming around blind spots on trails. That shit scares me on the bike. On a horse it would be terrifying. So, I hate horse crap and I hate the way they damage trails in the spring, or after any rain. But, we could be better about managing our image.
    I've never, in 30-ish years, been hit by a descending rider. If it's happening to you every year, I question the trails you're riding up.

    And if horses are on popular multi use trails, they're going to need to exercise some situational awareness as well.

  4. #4004
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    Quote Originally Posted by toast2266 View Post
    I've never, in 30-ish years, been hit by a descending rider. If it's happening to you every year, I question the trails you're riding up.

    And if horses are on popular multi use trails, they're going to need to exercise some situational awareness as well.
    I know it has a lot to do with where I am. Huge numbers and a lot of entitlement. My daughter had to bail from a guy descending Armstrong, a climbing only trail three weeks ago. He then bitched at her for making him slow down.
    Regardless of my gaperdom, I still say, we have our contingent of entitled dumbasses. Even if I am one of them.

  5. #4005
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    Oct 2010
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    I could be wrong, but doesn’t that article say they’re building 35 miles of new MTB-only trails? If I were a horse person I’d be happy mtb-ers would have their own trails and probably stay off the multi-use trails.

    Or maybe the horse folks could petition to build some horse-only trails. But oh wait, they rarely do their own trail work and prefer to complain and try to ban other people from “their” land. Oh and enjoy riding on the mtb-only trails when they’re soft.

  6. #4006
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    Oct 2010
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    entrapped
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    Quote Originally Posted by jm2e View Post
    Ironically, the anti mtb arguments from equestrians and hikers sound remarkably similar to the anti Ebike arguments from mountain bikers.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
    Quoted for truth.



    Sent from my SM-S908U1 using Tapatalk
    No matter where you go, there you are. - BB

  7. #4007
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    Nov 2014
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canada1 View Post
    Have you ever been hit by a descending rider? It happens to me every year. Freakin last year it was two guys from the same NICA team on different days. While I've never been creamed, I have had numerous encounters where guys finish their skid touching me or with me having to bail. It's changed how I act when climbing and made me super aware coming around blind spots on trails. That shit scares me on the bike. On a horse it would be terrifying. So, I hate horse crap and I hate the way they damage trails in the spring, or after any rain. But, we could be better about managing our image.
    Not very relevant here. The plan they're litigating involves segregated trails. Any trails you'd imagine 'downhilling' on are bike-only. There will be some new shared-use trails on low-angle terrain that generally has long sightlines. Bikes are excluded from the historic road network where most equestrians currently ride.

  8. #4008
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    Dec 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by toast2266 View Post
    I've never, in 30-ish years, been hit by a descending rider. If it's happening to you every year, I question the trails you're riding up.

    And if horses are on popular multi use trails, they're going to need to exercise some situational awareness as well.
    Pretty much. At some point, if that much conflict is happening to you, you really need to take a hard look at what you might be doing to attract that conflict.

    Its pretty easy to recognize the corners with poor sight distance where conflict might happen while riding uphill, and choose the line where a descending rider wouldnt ride, or where they couldnt hold any speed. Its also pretty easy to avoid riding up popular descending trails, especially at high usage times. Common sense, and situational awareness go a long ways.

  9. #4009
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canada1 View Post
    Regardless of my gaperdom, I still say, we have our contingent of entitled dumbasses. Even if I am one of them.
    Absolutely. Every group has its share of assholes, and mountain bikers are certainly no exception.

    The difference is, when confronted with user conflict, mountain bikers tend to acknowledge that they need to better police their community, and perhaps make some changes to the trail system to reduce conflict. Equestrians, on the other hand, file lawsuits to keep everyone else off the trails. And in this particular case, they're filing a lawsuit to prevent the exact kind of changes to the trail system that would reduce conflict.
    Last edited by toast2266; 09-22-2022 at 10:26 AM.

  10. #4010
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    Oct 2005
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    Tahoe-ish
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    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post

    Its pretty easy to recognize the corners with poor sight distance where conflict might happen while riding uphill, and choose the line where a descending rider wouldnt ride, or where they couldnt hold any speed. Its also pretty easy to avoid riding up popular descending trails, especially at high usage times. Common sense, and situational awareness go a long ways.
    Huh? Do you never ride actual singletrack or bench-cut trails? We're not all riding on 6 foot wide paths where one can just stay off to the side and leave room for descending bros to blast past.

    Courtesy and attention are required, and uphill has ROW. DH riders should stop, not just ride off to the side and make trails wider. Keep singletrack single!

    But yes, uphill riders need to pay attention and be aware. On the very popular bi-directional trail near my house I often whistle or call out when approaching the many blind corners on sidehills, and I recognize that even if both people are being careful it's impossible to eliminate the risk of a head-on.
    ride bikes, climb, ski, travel, cook, work to fund former, repeat.

  11. #4011
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    Oct 2003
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    slc
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    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    Pretty much. At some point, if that much conflict is happening to you, you really need to take a hard look at what you might be doing to attract that conflict.

    Its pretty easy to recognize the corners with poor sight distance where conflict might happen while riding uphill, and choose the line where a descending rider wouldnt ride, or where they couldnt hold any speed. Its also pretty easy to avoid riding up popular descending trails, especially at high usage times. Common sense, and situational awareness go a long ways.
    I don't think you appreciate the level of entitled and/or clueless douchebaggery that pervades Park City riding.

  12. #4012
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    Nov 2017
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    32
    Quote Originally Posted by jm2e View Post
    Ironically, the anti mtb arguments from equestrians and hikers sound remarkably similar to the anti Ebike arguments from mountain bikers.


    Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

    So you're saying they have a point.




  13. #4013
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    Dec 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by climberevan View Post
    Huh? Do you never ride actual singletrack or bench-cut trails? We're not all riding on 6 foot wide paths where one can just stay off to the side and leave room for descending bros to blast past.
    yep i do. Though, I try and avoid the popular descents if i do, or take logging roads if they are an alternative. If i am stuck on a two-way singletrack i usually am super careful and try to stay out of the mainline (even on a 18" wide trail, there is going to be a mainline) and hug the uphill on benchcuts. Never had an issue or collision, but im also happy to drop a foot at a moments notice to get out of the way on the 1% of the trail where sightlines and hearing dont allow me to know if another rider is coming. But i can usually hear folks coming before i can see them, even on smooth flowy stuff.

    Im not saying there arent asshole MTB folks, or everybody rides in control all the time at appropriate speeds. I'm saying that if these conflicts happen to you on a regular basis, it's past-time to look at what you are doing to attract these conflicts.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dantheman View Post
    I don't think you appreciate the level of entitled and/or clueless douchebaggery that pervades Park City riding.
    Fair point, i likely do not.

  14. #4014
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    Oct 2002
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    Shadynasty's Jazz Club
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    9,876
    Quote Originally Posted by Dantheman View Post
    I don't think you appreciate the level of entitled and/or clueless douchebaggery that pervades Park City riding.
    It's not limited to Park City, they're just early adopters. I worry because over the past few years we as a group have gained a lot of entitled users, but proportionally very few folks willing to fight for access.
    Remind me. We'll send him a red cap and a Speedo.

  15. #4015
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    Park City
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    Quote Originally Posted by toast2266 View Post
    Absolutely. Every group has its share of assholes, and mountain bikers are certainly no exception.

    The difference is, when confronted with user conflict, mountain bikers tend to acknowledge that they need to better police their community, and perhaps make some changes to the trail system to reduce conflict. Equestrians, on the other hand, file lawsuits to keep everyone else off the trails. And in this particular case, they're filing a lawsuit to prevent the exact kind of changes to the trail system that would reduce conflict.
    Yes, this is more of a Sierra Club, no one should be allowed here situation. It's really all NIMBY. The reality is that if a horse is scitish, you could startle it from 50 yards away and they would still hate you for being there.

  16. #4016
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    SLC burbs
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    3,623
    Quote Originally Posted by bagtagley View Post
    It's not limited to Park City, they're just early adopters. I worry because over the past few years we as a group have gained a lot of entitled users, but proportionally very few folks willing to fight for access.
    It's creeping down to the valley!! I was pedaling up Quarry trail last night, got to the only spot where there's only 1 manageable line (right before the power plant wood bridge). Couple guys are coming down and slow down to a crawl so I punch it uphill to get over the big rock... and dude decides to sneak between me and the trees. It's all gravel and polished granite in there and it's soaking wet so he gets sideways and slides into me like a confused crab. I try to twist myself out of the way and get brushed in the ribs by his handlebars. He stayed upright, I stayed upright, I just asked him WTF he was thinking, and he kept going. His buddy looked mortified, the 2 hikers who were watching the scene were shaking their heads...

    Getting back to equestrians, had an amusing interaction with a couple of ladies last week climbing Cobblestone on the way to Flying Dog. I round a bend and there are 2 horses on the trail. Lady sees me and just blurts out "OH FUCK". OK... I was already off the bike hiking up the brushy side to give them room. I get well to the side and ask if that's enough. Oh fuck lady gives me a filthy look, her friend tells me I'm good. I figure I should warn them about the bull elk and 4 cows just around the next bend in case that's an issue for the horses. Oh fuck lady looks at me, gets all cross-eyed, and loudly proclaims "WELL FUCK". OK... guess she has limited vocabulary but I'm sure she got it. As she rides by I notice a potent booze smell and the fact that her friend is more than a bit embarrassed. Riding a horse hammered seems sketchy as fuck but what do I know. I got back on the trail and sure enough there were deep holes everywhere, cause what could be more fun than destroying a trail after the only rain we got this summer...
    "Your wife being mad is temporary, but pow turns do not get unmade" - mallwalker the wise

  17. #4017
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    Apr 2009
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    Granite, UT
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    1,523

  18. #4018
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    Oct 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by Touring_Sedan View Post
    "Cosmetic Wear"



    It’s a road bike. Slap some AquaSeal on that and let er rip

  19. #4019
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    15' from MT
    Posts
    310
    Or...let'r buck could apply here as well

  20. #4020
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    Sep 2004
    Location
    LV-426
    Posts
    19,773
    I'm kinda annoyed that I have to buy yet another specialty tool just to change the chainring on a Shimano 12S crank.

    The tool is only $8 on Amazon though, so at least there's that.
    Quote Originally Posted by powder11 View Post
    if you have to resort to taking advice from the nitwits on this forum, then you're doomed.

  21. #4021
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    BC to CO
    Posts
    4,344
    Quote Originally Posted by El Chupacabra View Post
    I'm kinda annoyed that I have to buy yet another specialty tool just to change the chainring on a Shimano 12S crank.

    The tool is only $8 on Amazon though, so at least there's that.
    If you’re buying the crank aftermarket, the tool will come in the box.

  22. #4022
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Walpole NH
    Posts
    10,193
    Headset on my Crux won’t stay tight even after adding a wicked thin metal spacer at the bottom of the stack. What gives?
    crab in my shoe mouth

  23. #4023
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Missoula
    Posts
    1,937
    Compression plug slipping? I replaced the flimsy one that came on my cannondale with a cane creek and feel a lot better about it. I had a click I couldn't ever figure out that seems to have gone away after that too.

  24. #4024
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    Jan 2010
    Location
    Walpole NH
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    10,193
    Okay good, didn’t even know about aftermarket compression plugs, thanks man. I’ll check into it
    crab in my shoe mouth

  25. #4025
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    northern BC
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    Quote Originally Posted by buttahflake View Post
    Headset on my Crux won’t stay tight even after adding a wicked thin metal spacer at the bottom of the stack. What gives?
    So your stem must creep on your fork steerer to have the headset go loose ? you could try some carbon assembly paste on the steerer tube or SFT like that

    my kid used to be able to loosen the headset from dirt jumping and a lot of hard use, I would set everything up properly but a day of dirt jumps the head set was loose

    I supose I could have tried a different stem but instead I instaled a headlock, it worked/ was cheap to instal, just take out the starnut and it clamps the fork & stem together

    https://products.mtbr.com/product/co...head-lock.html
    Last edited by XXX-er; 09-24-2022 at 02:33 PM.
    Lee Lau - xxx-er is the laziest Asian canuck I know

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