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  1. #3426
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
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    Shadynasty's Jazz Club
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    9,600
    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    But, you can also probably baby a wheel riding out on a flat tire with inserts, vs having to stuff the tire full of pine needles and leaves without an insert. Other good part of an insert would be if you do get a flat, a single CO2 canister could fill two tires, as opposed to having to carry two cannisters or just hoping you only get 1 flat.
    Not sure how you got from slow leak to stuck in the woods.

    Can't I just use a tube rather than resorting to detritus?
    Remind me. We'll send him a red cap and a Speedo.

  2. #3427
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    1,961
    Quote Originally Posted by bagtagley View Post
    Not sure how you got from slow leak to stuck in the woods.

    Can't I just use a tube rather than resorting to detritus?
    What if you dont have an extra tube? what if the extra tube is old, or somehow got cut or degraded whilst on your bike/in your pack, and wont hold air? What if you bring 1 tube but get 2 flats? I thought we were talking what-ifs? SImply mentioning a couple flat-tire situations i can think of where inserts would be a benefit.

  3. #3428
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Hell Track
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    11,206
    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    What if you dont have an extra tube? what if the extra tube is old, or somehow got cut or degraded whilst on your bike/in your pack, and wont hold air? What if you bring 1 tube but get 2 flats? I thought we were talking what-ifs? SImply mentioning a couple flat-tire situations i can think of where inserts would be a benefit.
    What if I get a slow leak, and I have a perfectly good spare tube that I can put in. But the tire has an insert in it which makes it completely impossible to get off the rim. And 4 bike mechanics that are on the ride, who collectively have probably changed 10,000 tires, are all unable to get the tire off after much sweating, swearing, and broken tire levers. So I end up cutting the ride short and ride out 15 miles on the insert, pumping the tire up every 5 minutes or so. Whereas if I didn't have an insert in, I would've just thrown a tube in and finished the ride with minimal fuss.

    Inserts are dumb for 95% of riders.

  4. #3429
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    1,961
    Quote Originally Posted by toast2266 View Post
    What if I get a slow leak, and I have a perfectly good spare tube that I can put in. But the tire has an insert in it which makes it completely impossible to get off the rim. And 4 bike mechanics that are on the ride, who collectively have probably changed 10,000 tires, are all unable to get the tire off after much sweating, swearing, and broken tire levers. So I end up cutting the ride short and ride out 15 miles on the insert, pumping the tire up every 5 minutes or so. Whereas if I didn't have an insert in, I would've just thrown a tube in and finished the ride with minimal fuss.

    Inserts are dumb for 95% of riders.
    First off you are fucking high. there is nothing short about a 30mile RT ride, IDC how you cut it. Lets get that out of the way haha.

    Second, that sounds infuriating, and like a "never again" type of experience.

    thirdly, i cannot be bothered to adjust my derailleur properly, or true my wheels, so i assure you i would not stand for the hassle of an insert. But, i can see some situations where they provide benefit.

  5. #3430
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    Dec 2007
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    Hell Track
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    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    First off you are fucking high. there is nothing short about a 30mile RT ride, IDC how you cut it. Lets get that out of the way haha.
    It was a shuttle drop, and the shuttle had already left. So I was only a mile or two into the trail, but had to ride ~15 miles of road back to where the shuttle pick up was.

  6. #3431
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
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    1,925
    Quote Originally Posted by toast2266 View Post
    What if I get a slow leak, and I have a perfectly good spare tube that I can put in. But the tire has an insert in it which makes it completely impossible to get off the rim. And 4 bike mechanics that are on the ride, who collectively have probably changed 10,000 tires, are all unable to get the tire off after much sweating, swearing, and broken tire levers. So I end up cutting the ride short and ride out 15 miles on the insert, pumping the tire up every 5 minutes or so. Whereas if I didn't have an insert in, I would've just thrown a tube in and finished the ride with minimal fuss.

    Inserts are dumb for 95% of riders.
    Pretty much, though fortunately haven't had to get that quite far into it. I did ride a flat home this week 1/2 for a quick fix, but my point earlier is that I'm not sure I would have actually gotten the flat if the insert weren't there.

    I'm no pro mechanic, but have put many thousands of miles on Mountain, CX, Road tubeless with the amount of tubeless tire changes that accompany that and I was seriously contemplating cutting off a pretty new $70 Maxxis tire last night. Still had a slow leak this morning after I gave up for the night. My buddy swears he can change it out in 15 minutes, so will gladly sit back drink a beer and mock his bravado or cheer his success tonight.... for now going to go ride my other bike with a slightly less annoying slow insert driven leak.

    Rant on... and Californiagrown. There is a skinny bridge unofficially named after me on my local trail system b/c I crashed and split my chin open when my son was 6 days old. Rode back to my buddies drank a beer, took a shower, and then made the dreaded phone call. My mom was in town helping w/ kid, so I called her instead of my wife... she was like "uh huh yeah ok.... you're going to have to talk with your wife" and handed her the phone. I got off easier than I woulda thought, but then again had 8+ stitches in my chin.

    Still haven't forgiven my mom for that

  7. #3432
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Calgary
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    1,763
    Quote Originally Posted by VTskibum View Post
    Then Iím convinced it prevents sealant from actually covering everything even w more sealant than normal as it blocks flow.
    Totally this!!! Now that I finally got my hands on the elusive 29x2.4xDDxMaxxTerra combo DHR2, I'm leaving the Tannus out. Mind you it did ride nice with the Tannus in there, sealing took WAY longer than necessary.

  8. #3433
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Pagosa Springs CO
    Posts
    821
    Saw a guy today w/ a rack on his bike w/ a boom box strapped on blasting Folk music. What?

  9. #3434
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Wenatchee
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    10,814
    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    Interestingly, i would also be very much in favor of a 5spd drivetrain with MASSIVE jumps between gears. I really only use my granny gear, the next gear down, a middleish gear, and then my biggest gear on downhills/bikepark/shuttling. out of my 11spd drivetrain, probably 7 of those cogs have seen less than a mile of use in 3 years. Probably goes back to not having rolly trails, and instead just settling in to the long uphill grind.
    Add a second chainring and now weíre talking useful.


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  10. #3435
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Missoula
    Posts
    1,793
    Heh.

    I think the reality of riding a wide range like 5-7s cassette would not be so great. Bad shifts, big jumps in cadence and rarely being in a gear you want. The basic 10-11s stuff is not that expensive and works well so what's the problem with just using that?

    Anyway, to contribute- on my ride yesterday I notice someone had dragged a bunch of logs and sticks and stuff across a trail. I've head about this happening on there before, friend said he almost crashed because of it. Oh yeah then some lady's off leash dog tried to bite me. Overall good bike ride though.
    Last edited by jamal; 11-06-2021 at 09:27 PM.

  11. #3436
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
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    1,925
    Quote Originally Posted by VTskibum View Post
    I'm no pro mechanic, but have put many thousands of miles on Mountain, CX, Road tubeless with the amount of tubeless tire changes that accompany that and I was seriously contemplating cutting off a pretty new $70 Maxxis tire last night. Still had a slow leak this morning after I gave up for the night. My buddy swears he can change it out in 15 minutes, so will gladly sit back drink a beer and mock his bravado or cheer his success tonight....
    So update is my buddy is the insert whisperer, though I still generally stand by my earlier theory that it blocks flow of sealant.

    One very subtle thing he was doing differently which made a big difference. Also found my preferred park levers donít work as well for this compared to some others he had. His trick was after pushing everything to center of rim was to push the whole tire and insert over the opposite rim to get the tire lever like 1/2 in and under the bead and when pulled over pops bead off more easily. Not sure exactly why but my park levers this didnít work with. Got an older and thicker Bontrager with a smoother backside worked much better.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  12. #3437
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
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    base of the Bush
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    13,722
    Quote Originally Posted by Powder Ho View Post
    Saw a guy today w/ a rack on his bike w/ a boom box strapped on blasting Folk music. What?
    Heard two kids today with a speaker that I heard quite well from a hundred yards, blasting shitty music as they left the system I was getting ready to ride.
    www.apriliaforum.com

    "If the road You followed brought you to this,of what use was the road"?

    "I have no idea what I am talking about but would be happy to share my biased opinions as fact on the matter. "
    Ottime

  13. #3438
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    Feb 2008
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    Donner Summit
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    1,089
    Quote Originally Posted by californiagrown View Post
    Everyone with this complaint is missing the point. People who want this drivetrain are rarely actually shifting on trail. We shift into the granny gear at the start of the climb and then shift into the two bigger gears once we top out and are ready to descend. We arent constantly shifting to maximize effeciency. I don't mind shitty shifting because im not doing it much... which is why i dont need many gears... and want this bastardized drivetrain.
    Maybe we could have two different chainring sizes, one for uphill and one for downhill. And we could switch between them, sort of like how you shift the derailleur to change cogs. We could call the derailleur we have now the "rear" derailleur, and add another "front" derailleur to change chainrings. And put another shifter on the left side of the bars, next to the dropper lever. Wouldn't that be cool?

  14. #3439
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    1,961
    Quote Originally Posted by teledad View Post
    Maybe we could have two different chainring sizes, one for uphill and one for downhill. And we could switch between them, sort of like how you shift the derailleur to change cogs. We could call the derailleur we have now the "rear" derailleur, and add another "front" derailleur to change chainrings. And put another shifter on the left side of the bars, next to the dropper lever. Wouldn't that be cool?
    No, no dropper lever. Just need a small handfull of gears to winch me to the top, a quick release seatpost clamp to slam the seatpost once i reach to top, and a single bigger gear for the steep descent back to the car. KISS bike setup. Less shit to break when i see a penny on the side of the trail and decide to investigate.
    Last edited by californiagrown; 11-08-2021 at 08:55 AM.

  15. #3440
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Park City
    Posts
    1,606
    My Bias. I make some day trips to Moab this time of year. Took daughter for her first slick rock last week. Why do E bikes bug me when Iím at home, but not at all there? Maybe itís because they donít have a cooler on the rack And bad music playing as they ride without a helmet. Maybe itís the fact they are legal, but why do I care if people break the law locally? Itís weird and I need to get over it. Just like people cutting in lift lines. I canít keep my mouth shut when it probably only costs me 30 seconds.

    Anyway, stuff I think about while spinning my crank,

  16. #3441
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    In a van... down by the river
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    9,011
    Quote Originally Posted by Canada1 View Post
    <snip> Maybe itís the fact they are legal
    Unless something has changed, they are *only* allowed on motorized trails in Moab. I mean - I know a *lot* of the trails ARE moto trails in Moab... but I'm pretty sure a lot of trail is off-limits to e-bikes there.

  17. #3442
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Park City
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    1,606
    Slick rock allows moto's and thus e bikes.

  18. #3443
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    15' from MT
    Posts
    254
    Quote Originally Posted by teledad View Post
    Maybe we could have two different chainring sizes, one for uphill and one for downhill. And we could switch between them, sort of like how you shift the derailleur to change cogs. We could call the derailleur we have now the "rear" derailleur, and add another "front" derailleur to change chainrings. And put another shifter on the left side of the bars, next to the dropper lever. Wouldn't that be cool?
    Drop the derailleurs and just use the QR on the rear wheel. Move chain with hands from small front/large rear(uphill gear) to large front/small rear(eh gear). Back in the oughts, we called it dinglespeed.

  19. #3444
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    SW, CO
    Posts
    923
    GG was broken into today https://www.instagram.com/p/CWEorMFlA_R/

    Where do you even go to sell bikes like these?? Fuck bike thieves.

  20. #3445
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    Aug 2010
    Location
    Park City
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    1,606
    Quote Originally Posted by ASmileyFace View Post
    GG was broken into today https://www.instagram.com/p/CWEorMFlA_R/

    Where do you even go to sell bikes like these?? Fuck bike thieves.
    20 + years ago I worked on a deal where 2 prototype bikes were stolen in that same neighborhood. The police found them being ridden by crackheads. Call them meth heads today. I donít think a lot of criminals are thinking about how to fence.

  21. #3446
    Join Date
    May 2016
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    1,814
    Quote Originally Posted by tellybele View Post
    Drop the derailleurs and just use the QR on the rear wheel. Move chain with hands from small front/large rear(uphill gear) to large front/small rear(eh gear). Back in the oughts, we called it dinglespeed.
    Consider Trail running.
    I <heart> hot tele-moms

  22. #3447
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Down In A Hole, Up in the Sky
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    31,486
    So, why don't any gatorade/powerade/water bottles from the grocery/convenience stores fit a damn bicycle water bottle cage?

    HUNH?

    Is it some sort of weird size? I know they make adjustable cages, but that's not the point!

  23. #3448
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    Apr 2004
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    Three-O-Three
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    14,790
    Quote Originally Posted by rideit View Post
    So, why don't any gatorade/powerade/water bottles from the grocery/convenience stores fit a damn bicycle water bottle cage?

    HUNH?

    Is it some sort of weird size? I know they make adjustable cages, but that's not the point!
    Because they're made to fit into cup holders?

  24. #3449
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    Nov 2005
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    Down In A Hole, Up in the Sky
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    31,486
    Solid logic. But my bike water bottles fit all of my cupholders too?

  25. #3450
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    1,961
    Quote Originally Posted by rideit View Post
    So, why don't any gatorade/powerade/water bottles from the grocery/convenience stores fit a damn bicycle water bottle cage?

    HUNH?

    Is it some sort of weird size? I know they make adjustable cages, but that's not the point!
    Dont they? Pretty sure a 20oz gatorade or powerade bottle would fit fine in my basic cheap metal bottle cage. Especially because it bends to tighten or loosen. Never tried, but im like 90% it would.

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