Results 1 to 20 of 20
-
10-17-2016, 01:50 PM #1Registered User
- Join Date
- Jan 2014
- Location
- Gaperville, CO
- Posts
- 5,851
2016 - 2017 Indemnification Lists (and their bullshit)
Solly and Atomic lists here: http://www.salomoncertification.com/...20Bindings.pdf
The good:
- Added a "last year" heads up.
- Recognizing that the all metal version of Solly bindings shouldn't be retired at the same time as their plastic counterparts (916 etc).
The stupid:
- FFG 12/10/7 are marked as "last year". You could buy these as 2016 model year. By 2017-18 they will be off the list. Yet, their exact counterparts (STH12) are fine?
Atomic putting itself in an odd place where they could potentially have products which are still covered under their 2 year warranty but are no long indemnified?
Guess I'll go mount my own fucking skis.
-
10-18-2016, 01:13 AM #2
Dropping FFG while maintaining STH is crazy stupid. I'm not sure which deserves more hate, legal dept. or marketing dept.
-
10-20-2016, 10:02 AM #3
Doesn't everyone on TGR? Amer's biggest blunders this season are not in their indemnification list but introducing the non-MNC Warden 11 (WTF, isn't that the whole point of the Warden?) without a sliding AFD, and not bringing out a Warden 16 (they already have all the parts in the Guardian or STH2 16 bin).
-
10-20-2016, 11:15 AM #4
That is pretty bad...
-
10-20-2016, 01:56 PM #5
I wonder if they don't think the Warden MNC 13 scales well to a skier requiring 16 DIN? With the Guardian, the weak point is likely the rail/pivot system, and perhaps this masks some inherent weakness in the heel & toe piece? Just thinkin' out loud ...
... ThomGalibier Designcrafting technology in service of music
-
10-20-2016, 02:43 PM #6
The heel is exactly the same as the STH2, the toe is the same as the Guardian without the frame, only the spring is different.
-
10-20-2016, 04:20 PM #7
Shops can still work on them, they just fail visual inspection. No need to live and die by the table. A proper should just do anything, you just have to sign off on it.
Click. Point. Chute.
-
10-20-2016, 04:36 PM #8
Someone in the know at Salomon contacted me within hours of post #3 above with some of the backstory on the Warden bindings. Apparently it wasn't just a matter of adding a sliding AFD to the Warden 11, there was an engineering issue with the heel as well, hence the ISO 5355 only spec. As for the Warden 16, a few pairs were made but they found the frame of the Guardian enhanced the strength of the toe structure in a way the stand-alone toepiece couldn't match, so for the time being the 16 spring is a no-go.
I'd encourage them to keep working on both projects, though, as I think the use of powerful ISO 9523 boots and crossover boots is only going to increase (they could also retrofit a sliding AFD on the STH2 bindings, they already go high enough).
-
10-20-2016, 04:48 PM #9
This is encouraging - that they're thinking about MNC bindings for powerful 9523 boots/skiers. Thanks for that update, Greg.
The fact that the frame of the Guardian enhanced the toe's strength is a surprise, but points to the fact that you can't transfer part of a system (i.e. convert a Guardian to a Warden MNC) and expect it to behave identically.
This was what I was trying to articulate previously, although I had it a bit inverted - thinking perhaps that a weak rail system or pivot was the first point of failure in the bindings.
... ThomGalibier Designcrafting technology in service of music
-
10-20-2016, 04:52 PM #10Registered User
- Join Date
- Jan 2014
- Location
- Gaperville, CO
- Posts
- 5,851
That's all fine and well, but it sends a very nasty message to consumers. It undermines the whole purpose of an indemnification list which is supposed to be related to the likely safety of a particular binding. Telling consumers that two identical bindings, one of which says "STH" and one of which says "FFG" have different safety characteristics is, well, dumb.
Unfortunately most people buy and get bindings setup by folks who have less knowledge than your average tech-talk TGR poster.
-
10-20-2016, 10:12 PM #11
-
10-20-2016, 11:33 PM #12
The STH Steel isn't on the list either, but undoubtedly it's covered.
-
05-06-2020, 09:31 PM #13
Man, didn’t know where else to put this, gotta love the 4 year bump....
How long do you reckon the STH16 (non 2) but also newer than the 916, will be indemnified for? Mine are the white/orange ones, reckon they were like third year of STH run? Like maybe 13/14? 14/15?
These jams
https://www.rei.com/product/822962/s...l-ski-bindings
Just found a pair buried in a closet. Pretty psyched.Do I detect a lot of anger flowing around this place? Kind of like a pubescent volatility, some angst, a lot of I'm-sixteen-and-angry-at-my-father syndrome?
fuck that noise.
gmen.
-
05-06-2020, 10:31 PM #14
According to Solly's 19/20 indemnified list, this was their last season. But like Phil said four years ago, if you brought them in to my shop I wouldn't hesitate to mount them for you. You just sign a form and go ski happy. Its a brand new binding.
And yes, Amer Sport's bullshit continues: the Tracker, which was produced up until 2018 and is still available for retail sale, is on the "last year" list as well. They have extended that before with a small handful of models, but it really is complete crap.
-
05-07-2020, 06:39 AM #15Do I detect a lot of anger flowing around this place? Kind of like a pubescent volatility, some angst, a lot of I'm-sixteen-and-angry-at-my-father syndrome?
fuck that noise.
gmen.
-
05-07-2020, 08:17 AM #16
Just looked at the 2020 list. Nothing I have mounted is indemnified.... 916s, 914s, FFG14s, FFG16s....
Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkBest Skier on the Mountain
Self-Certified
1992 - 2012
Squaw Valley, USA
-
05-07-2020, 09:00 AM #17
FKS pivot 18 FTW
Sent from my iPhone using TGR ForumsI need to go to Utah.
Utah?
Yeah, Utah. It's wedged in between Wyoming and Nevada. You've seen pictures of it, right?
So after 15 years we finally made it to Utah.....
Thanks BCSAR and POWMOW Ski Patrol for rescues
8, 17, 13, 18, 16, 18, 20, 19, 16, 24, 32, 35
2021/2022 (13/15)
-
05-07-2020, 01:30 PM #18
-
10-23-2020, 05:35 PM #19
Anyone have a link to the 20-21 list? Why is the list such a secret? Manufacturers hoping to screw people buying used gear so they can sell more new? Only reason I can think of. Are first generation STH off the list, as threatened? Mine don't need work--although I suppose I should have them tested--but it would be useful to tell my wife that my bindings and therefore the skis they are attached to are no long safe to ski on.
-
10-24-2020, 01:06 PM #20
Bookmarks