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Thread: WTF Silverton?

  1. #276
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrenalated View Post
    The usage numbers were derived from SMG's monitoring of the area in 2016 (an unscientific, clearly biased source) and 14 days of "informal monitoring" by the BLM in 2017. The informal monitoring was conducted from mid-February to mid-March (remember how it didn't snow much then?) While I won't pretend to know what the usage is in those drainages I have a real hard time calling the numbers in the EA conclusive.

    I'm irritated by the lack of unguided (obviously, I started the thread), but I'm a backcountry skier more than a resort skier. Around 75% of my days are in the backcountry, and most of my resort days this year were cruising around with the GF. My opposition to the heli is based on wanting to backcountry ski in cool places without helicopters.

    Kinda sick of the implication that everyone opposed to SMG's expansions must have a personal vendetta against Brill/SM. I've been a happy customer and enjoyed several fine days of skiing at SM, one guided, and a bunch of unguided. I'm not even opposed to guided skiing, in fact I generally recommend that people do a guided day their first trip there as it's a great way to learn the mountain. I've never met the Brills (or didn't know it if I did) and have no personal hostility towards them or their operation in general. Just because I'm not sucking Aaron's dick doesn't mean I have a vendetta against them.
    Well, if you want to get go down the rabbit hole that their affidavits regarding usage numbers are incorrect, as well as the BLMs, go for it. I'll file that with the narrative that the BLM relocated a field manager from AK to Gunnison just to force this deal through.

    I'm clearly more resort than backcountry snowboarder, but I support what they are doing down there, but will also not pretend to understand the dynamics of living and building that operation from scratch in San Juan county.

  2. #277
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    Quote Originally Posted by hatchgreenchile View Post
    Well, if you want to get go down the rabbit hole that their affidavits regarding usage numbers are incorrect, as well as the BLMs, go for it.
    I didn't say incorrect. I said inconclusive.

  3. #278
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    The local community just needs to put an old lift 2000 feet up the side of Kendal and do a bunch of glading. It would be sweet to have an access lift right in town.
    dirtbag, not a dentist

  4. #279
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrenalated View Post
    I'm irritated by the lack of unguided (obviously, I started the thread), but I'm a backcountry skier more than a resort skier. Around 75% of my days are in the backcountry, and most of my resort days this year were cruising around with the GF. My opposition to the heli is based on wanting to backcountry ski in cool places without helicopters.
    OK. Let's meet sometime in Silverton and go ski cool places without helis around. I don't like helis or sleds when I'm in the bc either.

    Kinda sick of the implication that everyone opposed to SMG's expansions must have a personal vendetta against Brill/SM. I've been a happy customer and enjoyed several fine days of skiing at SM, one guided, and a bunch of unguided. I'm not even opposed to guided skiing, in fact I generally recommend that people do a guided day their first trip there as it's a great way to learn the mountain. I've never met the Brills (or didn't know it if I did) and have no personal hostility towards them or their operation in general.
    I'm not implying that everyone does have a personal vendetta.

    But I have several friends in town and this is a very hot topic. People get angry which is understandable. It's a hard topic to talk about with my friends there. So it is a factor with some significant people, the locals and it's been easier to talk about when the issues get teased apart. The fact of this thread drift calls out for the distinction.
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  5. #280
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    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    How is it separate? The community that can no longer ski their local hill is going to want to tour more instead.
    Unguided skiing and the heli operation are 2 very different things.

    Again, the people there I know who have been around told me that they don't go into the areas in question during the high season when the heli runs anyway. They concede the difference between the issues and are the ones most affected.
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  6. #281
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    Quote Originally Posted by raisingarizona13 View Post
    The local community just needs to put an old lift 2000 feet up the side of Kendal and do a bunch of glading. It would be sweet to have an access lift right in town.
    This is being discussed in town.
    Merde De Glace On the Freak When Ski
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  7. #282
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster Highmen View Post
    Unguided skiing and the heli operation are 2 very different things.

    Again, the people there I know who have been around told me that they don't go into the areas in question during the high season when the heli runs anyway. They concede the difference between the issues and are the ones most affected.
    If the heli operation is going to put skiers into the area where the locals are going to access more often since they can't ski at their own hill, then they are linked.

    If the there is no user conflict, then they are not linked.
    Quote Originally Posted by blurred
    skiing is hiking all day so that you can ski on shitty gear for 5 minutes.

  8. #283
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrenalated View Post
    I didn't say incorrect. I said inconclusive.
    I believe the study was January 1-March 1? I can't find that damn link. Right in line with when they'd want to fly.

  9. #284
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    Quote Originally Posted by adrenalated View Post
    They responded to one part of my comments. The response was not unlike the responses I get from emailing Senator Gardner. "Thank you for your comment. Go fuck yourself, we're ignoring it."

    Overall the responses to most of the opposed comments mimics the above, and most of the supportive comments the answer was "Thank you for your comment." Most of the positive comments appeared to have been written by SMG or employees of SMG.
    To be fair, though, that's pretty much the expected response when you come to a decision, it's not evidence of bias in the decision. If after deliberation you come to a decision and you have to publish something documenting the decision and the comments you received, you're probably going to include more positive responses to the comments that were in favor of your ultimate outcome and be somewhat dismissive of the comments that opposed your ultimate outcome.

    As for where the positive comments came from, I have no idea, but SMG and their employees are entitled to comment.

    I have no dog in this hunt, just deal with federal agency responses to this kinda stuff on occasion.
    Last edited by Danno; 05-11-2017 at 11:13 AM.
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  10. #285
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    Quote Originally Posted by raisingarizona13 View Post
    The local community just needs to put an old lift 2000 feet up the side of Kendal and do a bunch of glading. It would be sweet to have an access lift right in town.
    There are some mining roads that go up Kendall, just maintain those, glade some stuff and make it all touring!

  11. #286
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    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    If the heli operation is going to put skiers into the area where the locals are going to access more often since they can't ski at their own hill, then they are linked.

    If the there is no user conflict, then they are not linked.
    I asked around town and the people I talked to said those areas are not generally used in the winter because they're higher up in the basins. There will be some fly over used areas down low. But from the BLM reports and people I talk to in town, user conflict for ski acreage is not an issue.

    There's an awful lot of good touring around CoalBank/Molas/Silverton/Red Mountain Pass.

    I know the Brills, not well, but I have a lot of respect for them and they've always treated me and my family extremely well, far beyond anything that's standard.
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  12. #287
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    Quote Originally Posted by Summit View Post
    If the heli operation is going to put skiers into the area where the locals are going to access more often since they can't ski at their own hill, then they are linked.

    If the there is no user conflict, then they are not linked.
    They may not be mutually exclusive b/c of this, however the unguided days thing as far as quantity of their offer is more linked to Walmart-esque business practices of the industry (their narrative)

  13. #288
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    Quote Originally Posted by hatchgreenchile View Post
    There are some mining roads that go up Kendall, just maintain those, glade some stuff and make it all touring!
    Sweet! It would be rad. It could get people visiting to ski at SM stay a couple more days in town.
    dirtbag, not a dentist

  14. #289
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    Quote Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles View Post
    ^^^you Aspen guys have your reality meter broken. You know a private heli is something like $10K? So reality is that, best case senario, you find 9 friends on short notice and drop a grand each. I know you and Skideeppow probably just fly in private and but down the Amex Black and more power to ya but it certainly ain't in the budget for most.

    If I was 1%-ing, I'd spend it on skiing also and I probably could give 2 shits about what the regular people on TGR think but...now you are that guy.
    I have actually done research for a private family that owns a helicopter, who wanted to do some private heliskiing. As long as you don't land inside a wilderness area, for the most part your ok with landing in/on USFS land. As far as BLM land goes, I'm not sure... But, you need proof of insurance,

    But, they decided to stick with heliskiing in Canada in the end.
    "True love is much easier to find with a helicopter"

  15. #290
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    ^^ I met a guy years ago in BC that had a small 2-seater heli that he could tow behind his van. He would fly around, find a cool mountain, land in the valley, climb it, then ski it. Pretty much the coolest access tool ever, but it was definitely elevation-challenged so he could never fly in CO. But who would want to fly in CO if they could fly in BC?

    5 years from now we'll all have personal drones anyway, so that's something to look forward to.

  16. #291
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    Super Cub is SOP of the Anchorage millennial BC skier.
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  17. #292
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    Quote Originally Posted by BFD View Post
    Super Cub is SOP of the Anchorage millennial BC skier.
    I have heard that a lot of folks are trading in their Super cubs for Robinson 44 helis.
    "True love is much easier to find with a helicopter"

  18. #293
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    Would be tough to use an R44 in CO mtns but it'd be great elsewhere for approach like GB said.

  19. #294
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    Since so many comments seemed to be missing (including mine), and the BLM seemed to ignore that the vast majority of comments were against this expansion, the ruling is being challenged:

    http://www.sanjuancitizens.org/lands...rmit-expansion
    Last edited by goldenboy; 07-18-2017 at 12:46 PM.

  20. #295
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    Stoked!
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