Daily Driver

**gregL** · 05-13-2016, 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by Leavenworth Skier

Way stiffer, pretty even flex.

I don't have one handy to compare with my Cochise, but I recall them as flexing about the same with a slightly sofrer tip. The tip is wider than the Cochise which gives it much better float, and more tail rocker means it doesn't always lock into the turn at the finish like the Cochise (which gives you no choice). IMO the Invictus 108 is a better soft snow choice and more versatile in trees or tight quarters.

**TAFKALVS** · 05-13-2016, 10:37 AM

Originally Posted by gregL

I don't have one handy to compare with my Cochise, but I recall them as flexing about the same with a slightly sofrer tip. The tip is wider than the Cochise which gives it much better float, and more tail rocker means it doesn't always lock into the turn at the finish like the Cochise (which gives you no choice). IMO the Invictus 108 is a better soft snow choice and more versatile in trees or tight quarters.

I'm mentally comparing it to this years Inviticus to a few year old Cochise.

**auvgeek** · 05-13-2016, 10:54 AM

Seems like the OP might like next year's Kartel 108.

**TAFKALVS** · 05-13-2016, 10:57 AM

Originally Posted by auvgeek

Seems like the OP might like next year's Kartel 108.

Totally. It's a sick ski, I kinda want a pair.

**Skiwurrel** · 05-13-2016, 09:01 PM

How about Big Sky daily driver? Kind of want to go back next winter. What about a pair of head supermojo 105? Have a pair of head boneshakers that I think will dominate many days too.

**2FUNKY** · 05-13-2016, 09:20 PM

^193 Praxis MVP. 193 Cochise. 190 Goliath, if u can find some. So on and so forth you get the idea.

**chewski** · 05-14-2016, 01:48 AM

Originally Posted by LC

A few mentions of the Invictus here. It's on my radar as my new bigger touring ski but I've never bothered to check it out in the flesh. How does it flex compared to a Cochise? Even flex pattern or soft tip?

Skied the og invictus (before it was called 108 ti) in 188 for 2 days and 2nd year cochise in 185 1 day. I disagree that the invictus is stiffer. Ut is an even medium/stiff flex throughout. But i do believe it is more work than the cochise. It skies just as stable, but is more soft snow oriented, whereas the cochise is better in firm crud and anything truly hard. Both skis are pretty versatile, though. The invictus really blends dampness and pop pretty well, as well as edge grip vs looseness (the 4frnt devastator does this even better), which i attribute to the wood/metal/carbon construction and the rocker profile. Personally i liked the invictus more the duller the edges got, as it became more predictable. Pultimately it was a bit more work than i wanted (even compared to cochise, bodacious, supernatural 108, motherships all in simikar lengths). Good ski, but found a better fit in the supernatural 108 and devastator for my tastes

**TAFKALVS** · 05-14-2016, 09:09 AM

Originally Posted by 2FUNKY

^193 Praxis MVP. 193 Cochise. 190 Goliath, if u can find some. So on and so forth you get the idea.

Cham 107

**dynodonkeyaltabird** · 05-14-2016, 12:58 PM

RC112 damn near perfect daily driver for UT. Pretty fucking stiff tho.

**The SnowShow** · 05-14-2016, 03:49 PM

Thanks, I'll look at all of these.

Based on the Blister Gear review, the Line Supernatural 108 sounds awfully good for what I'm looking for. Playful with a backbone.
The 108 Wren looks great too.

I don't need something to carry me Mach speeds through crud but definitely don't want something that gets completely knocked around.

Would the Automatic 109 be too soft for this?

**DGamms** · 05-14-2016, 05:36 PM

2nd vote for the Devastator. Wish they had a 189 cm (which would be 187ish straight pull) but otherwise the most versatile ski I've skied to date. Mount at -1 to -3 cm from recommended if you don't like a more centered mount

**galibier_numero_un** · 05-14-2016, 10:47 PM

Originally Posted by The SnowShow

Thanks, I'll look at all of these.

Based on the Blister Gear review, the Line Supernatural 108 sounds awfully good for what I'm looking for. Playful with a backbone.
The 108 Wren looks great too.

I don't need something to carry me Mach speeds through crud but definitely don't want something that gets completely knocked around.

Would the Automatic 109 be too soft for this?

I would guess that you'd prefer the stiffer Wren, etc. to the Automatic 109 in all conditions - less tip deflection in chop, along with a higher speed limit in all conditions.

Those are the two attributes I'd change in the AA 109 (and why I repurposed it to a touring ski as I expanded my quiver).

Cheers,
Thom

**MagnificentUnicorn** · 05-15-2016, 11:25 AM

Originally Posted by chewski

Skied the og invictus (before it was called 108 ti) in 188 for 2 days and 2nd year cochise in 185 1 day. I disagree that the invictus is stiffer. Ut is an even medium/stiff flex throughout. But i do believe it is more work than the cochise. It skies just as stable, but is more soft snow oriented, whereas the cochise is better in firm crud and anything truly hard. Both skis are pretty versatile, though. The invictus really blends dampness and pop pretty well, as well as edge grip vs looseness (the 4frnt devastator does this even better), which i attribute to the wood/metal/carbon construction and the rocker profile. Personally i liked the invictus more the duller the edges got, as it became more predictable. Pultimately it was a bit more work than i wanted (even compared to cochise, bodacious, supernatural 108, motherships all in simikar lengths). Good ski, but found a better fit in the supernatural 108 and devastator for my tastes

Interesting. I got my Invictus from you and I don't find them overly demanding at all, maybe because I'm bigger? I wonder how you would like the shorter length. I agree that it's a way better powder ski than I expected, really good actually for the resort and 18" or less snow. I think they have decent edge grip and also can be pretty playful if you want that too.

**Mofro261** · 05-15-2016, 11:27 AM

Get a pair of Morgan Freemans.

Best daisy driver ever.

**Angle Parking** · 05-15-2016, 01:03 PM

Coomback 104

**grinch** · 05-15-2016, 01:15 PM

Depending where you live, I'd look at praxis gpo or mvp. I own a gpo for this in Revy . It's just so versatile. Pow, groomer, in tight stuff , stable, can open it up. Really does everything exceptionally well and bomber construction. If I lived in lake louise(less snow) I'd probably look at the mvp. Never tried it but it's basically the wider bro of the piste jib with a stiffer flex. I also find the piste jib exceptionally versatile over a lot of different conditions. A stiffer wider one would make a great daily driver. Good weights on both for a standard layup hill ski so would be good to have it slack country capable

**2FUNKY** · 05-15-2016, 01:35 PM

PM Gear 187FAT if you can find them. Sick DD, wish I never sold mine.

**chewski** · 05-15-2016, 04:14 PM

Originally Posted by AaronWright

Interesting. I got my Invictus from you and I don't find them overly demanding at all, maybe because I'm bigger? I wonder how you would like the shorter length. I agree that it's a way better powder ski than I expected, really good actually for the resort and 18" or less snow. I think they have decent edge grip and also can be pretty playful if you want that too.

Definitely the extra weight helps. I am 175, and i don't recall by how much, but i'm pretty sure you are heavier than me. They weren't outright unmanageable (195 superbros and 192 big dumps have kicked my ass), but they were noticeably more work than the direct competion (cochise, sn108, etc) in similar sizes. Blister noted this as well. If i weren't constantly chasing the unicorn, they would have been just fine to keep

**swissiphic** · 05-15-2016, 06:21 PM

Originally Posted by chewski

Definitely the extra weight helps. I am 175, and i don't recall by how much, but i'm pretty sure you are heavier than me. They weren't outright unmanageable (195 superbros and 192 big dumps have kicked my ass), but they were noticeably more work than the direct competion (cochise, sn108, etc) in similar sizes. Blister noted this as well. If i weren't constantly chasing the unicorn, they would have been just fine to keep

For what it's worth in limited testing, the 180 o.g. invictus felt 'just right' for me at 180 lbs dry weight plus 15/20 pound pack, mounted on the line using dynafit bindings and mercury boots no tongue.

**MagnificentUnicorn** · 05-16-2016, 08:48 AM

Originally Posted by chewski

Definitely the extra weight helps. I am 175, and i don't recall by how much, but i'm pretty sure you are heavier than me. They weren't outright unmanageable (195 superbros and 192 big dumps have kicked my ass), but they were noticeably more work than the direct competion (cochise, sn108, etc) in similar sizes. Blister noted this as well. If i weren't constantly chasing the unicorn, they would have been just fine to keep

Originally Posted by swissiphic

For what it's worth in limited testing, the 180 o.g. invictus felt 'just right' for me at 180 lbs dry weight plus 15/20 pound pack, mounted on the line using dynafit bindings and mercury boots no tongue.

FWIW, I'm about 240. I think the blistergear review is probably about right that the 188 Invictus fills the gap between 185 and 193 Cochise. I find the 188 pretty easy going.

**XavierD** · 05-16-2016, 09:33 AM

Originally Posted by Leavenworth Skier

Totally. It's a sick ski, I kinda want a pair.

It is a sick ski, and I have a pair.

**TAFKALVS** · 05-16-2016, 09:45 AM

Originally Posted by XavierD

It is a sick ski, and I have a pair.

You got me hooked.

**MMMSKI** · 05-16-2016, 02:36 PM

Cochise

**mtb** · 05-16-2016, 07:45 PM

XavierD -- I'm looking for a ski in the 105-110 range to handle inbounds powder and leftovers and would like to go with ON3P. I ski at Baker, and really need a ski to deal with the heavy chunder but ideally one that doesn't mind if I'm not maching at all times. Have you had the Kartel in these conditions much? How about the Wren 108? I realize they're very different skis, but wonder how much Wren crud busting you give up for the more playful Kartel. Thanks.