New Season, New Tires, New Thread

**D(C)** · 04-07-2018, 09:52 PM

Originally Posted by grinch

I just can’t see myself paying the price of the other systems or lugging the weight around

Agreed.

Huck Norris isn’t perfect and perhaps overpriced, but none of the other systems are reasonable to me. A new rim isn’t THAT expensive...

**jm2e** · 04-07-2018, 11:04 PM

I'm not "really" approaching this from a flat tire perspective. I run 27-28psi in back for trail bike and DH bike (trail tires and DH tires respectively), and haven't gotten a flat in over a year. Last time I did, I put a flat spot on a brand new rim on Cedar Rock in Dupont going downhill very fast on slickrock and smashing a square edge like a mother fucker. The flattened rim hurt more than the snake bite tire. Lesson learned, but man I'd probably do it again because that run is so fucking fun.

Mrs2e on the other hand, breaks more shit than almost anyone I know, including rubber. After a string of flats on long, cold, wet rides I switched her to Huck Norris in rear tires only on both of her trail bikes and she hasn't flatted since. That was maybe 18 months ago. She runs 17-18psi in the back. Neither of us has flatted a DH bike, so haven't been pressed to protect the 2 ply tires, even though we've dented up some rims.

Now, after reading some reviews of Crush Core & Flat Tire Defender, AND listening to an interview with Gwin where he mentioned the most notable thing was increased damping and feeling of being planted, my eyes opened. Since I can theoretically switch from a DH tire to a trail tire on the DH rig, and then add Crush Core for no net weight gain, I though it might be interesting to see if the damping is the real deal.

Sounds like nobody in here has tried Crush Core or Flat Tire Defender though, so I'm left with the $150 decision whether to guinea pig this thing.
https://www.vitalmtb.com/features/Vi...t-Systems,1841

**bagtagley** · 04-08-2018, 05:51 AM

http://ridemonkey.bikemag.com/thread...thread.277271/

**gramboh** · 04-12-2018, 01:11 PM

Originally Posted by jm2e

I'm not "really" approaching this from a flat tire perspective. I run 27-28psi in back for trail bike and DH bike (trail tires and DH tires respectively), and haven't gotten a flat in over a year. Last time I did, I put a flat spot on a brand new rim on Cedar Rock in Dupont going downhill very fast on slickrock and smashing a square edge like a mother fucker. The flattened rim hurt more than the snake bite tire. Lesson learned, but man I'd probably do it again because that run is so fucking fun.

Mrs2e on the other hand, breaks more shit than almost anyone I know, including rubber. After a string of flats on long, cold, wet rides I switched her to Huck Norris in rear tires only on both of her trail bikes and she hasn't flatted since. That was maybe 18 months ago. She runs 17-18psi in the back. Neither of us has flatted a DH bike, so haven't been pressed to protect the 2 ply tires, even though we've dented up some rims.

Now, after reading some reviews of Crush Core & Flat Tire Defender, AND listening to an interview with Gwin where he mentioned the most notable thing was increased damping and feeling of being planted, my eyes opened. Since I can theoretically switch from a DH tire to a trail tire on the DH rig, and then add Crush Core for no net weight gain, I though it might be interesting to see if the damping is the real deal.

Sounds like nobody in here has tried Crush Core or Flat Tire Defender though, so I'm left with the $150 decision whether to guinea pig this thing.
https://www.vitalmtb.com/features/Vi...t-Systems,1841

I get the damping thing Gwin is talking about, but what about cornering with an EXO sidewall vs. DH casing especially at lower pressures? Does the cushcore provide sidewall support?

Related: Dunbar Cycles finally got their hands on the mythical 27.5x2.5WT/2.4WT DHF/DHR II in folding bead/tubeless ready DH casing MaxxGrip. Will be nice to not wrestle with wire bead this summer on the DH bike.

**Jonny Snow** · 04-13-2018, 11:10 AM

I've got a Minion SS 2.3" to run in the rear on some 21mm internal rims. What should I get on the front?

DHF DC 2.3
DHF 3C 2.3
DHR2 DC 2.3
DHR2 3C 2.3
DHR2 DC 2.4WT
DHR2 3C 2.4WT
DHF DC 2.5WT
DHF 3C 2.5WT

Probably going with the DHF 2.3 DC for balanced feel and fast rolling. Maybe the 3C? Any reason to go DHR2 with a SS? Or the bigger tires, even though I'd be putting a WT tire on a narrower rim?

**Jonny Snow** · 04-17-2018, 08:23 AM

How effective is Cush Core as a bead lock? Can it make a non-tubeless rim and non-tubeless wire bead DH tire work safely tubeless with only gorilla tape in the rim bed?

**jm2e** · 04-17-2018, 12:58 PM

Reviews of Crush Core and Flat Tire Defender that I've read make it sound virtually impossible to burp or roll a tire off the rim with those systems on. Obviously nobody is testing this stuff on antiquated rims and tires, but I'd bet the answer to your question is; yes, it'll certainly hold that tire on there for you.

**Jonny Snow** · 04-17-2018, 03:11 PM

Originally Posted by jm2e

Reviews of Crush Core and Flat Tire Defender that I've read make it sound virtually impossible to burp or roll a tire off the rim with those systems on. Obviously nobody is testing this stuff on antiquated rims and tires, but I'd bet the answer to your question is; yes, it'll certainly hold that tire on there for you.

Sounds like a definite maybe.

**Jonny Snow** · 04-19-2018, 01:30 PM

Thought this was pretty nifty - home made foam inserts:

**Jonny Snow** · 04-19-2018, 02:11 PM

Art's has the 650B Schwalbe Procore for $71.98 shippedwith coupon "ARTS10", that's about as cheap as you're ever going to get it. They have one set left.

https://www.artscyclery.com/descpage.html?pcode=SWPCT27

**HankScorpio** · 04-19-2018, 02:35 PM

Originally Posted by Jonny Snow

Thought this was pretty nifty - home made foam inserts:

I would feel like an idiot if I paid $150 for Cush Core after seeing that DIY.

Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

**Cocximus** · 04-19-2018, 04:10 PM

Isn't that foam way softer than crush core? It's very easy to pinch it. It might work like shock air volume reducers, the tire pressure ramps up before it gets close to the rim.

Maybe a pool noodle would work better since it's denser foam.

**Jonny Snow** · 04-19-2018, 06:34 PM

Originally Posted by daught

Isn't that foam way softer than crush core? It's very easy to pinch it. It might work like shock air volume reducers, the tire pressure ramps up before it gets close to the rim.

Maybe a pool noodle would work better since it's denser foam.

Good catch, here's someone squeezing the cushcore (very scientific) and it seems a good bit stiffer. I also doubt the half round of diy foam has much bead locking effectiveness given its rounded shape.

The backing rods are also available in other diameters from the same vendor, 1", 1.25" and 1.5", or bigger:

http://www.bestmaterials.com/Backer_Rod.aspx

The full 1.5" size would be the same cross sectional area and thus weight as half the 2", perhaps that would be more effective, it would be similar to the flat tire defender product, but who knows about the stiffness.

**Jonny Snow** · 04-23-2018, 02:40 PM

I've done some more reading on this "backer rod" material. It's very light, about 2lb per cubic foot, and it compresses 25% with 5 psi pressure. For a 1.5" section around the whole wheel, it will weigh about 65g - very light. I'd be curious what it's actually doing in the tire when it's inflated, how much does it compress down just from being under pressure.

http://www.bestmaterials.com/PDF_Fil...er-rod-101.pdf

You can get polyethylene packing foam board that is considerably stiffer and heavier.

http://www.usafoam.com/tech/PolyethyleneTech.html
http://www.usafoam.com/closedcellfoam/polyethylene.html

**stuckathuntermtn** · 04-23-2018, 10:34 PM

Initial impressions of DHF/SS combo are very positive. Just fyi.

**jm2e** · 04-24-2018, 09:47 AM

Been on an Aggressor for just a couple weeks now. Got my first flat in maybe 4 years? FWIW, this might be an exaggeration, but I honestly can't remember flatting since my last big vacation to Yurp.
Ironically, this was my first tire with Huck Norris. I think the actual variable was that the sealant was spread out over the Huck Norris so much that it wasn't pooling enough to seal the hole. Weirdly, I'd started carrying a 2oz Stan's bottle recently. Dumped it in, CO2 back to pressure, a couple spittles and good to go. Still holding air in the garage.

My limited review of the Aggressor 2.3, without making assumptions about the flat: Compared to a DHRII; noticed some decreased traction on loose/greasy tech climbs. Corners well. Brakes well. The biggest difference by a large margin is that this is the smallest volume tire I've ridden in a while. It feels downright bouncy. Like the opposite of the damping you get from a DH tire. After the flat, I'm afraid to drop the pressure to fine tune the ride on it. I think the 2.5WT version would be superior.

LC · 04-24-2018, 10:01 AM

Originally Posted by jm2e

Been on an Aggressor for just a couple weeks now. Got my first flat in maybe 4 years?

EXO or DD Aggressor? And what have you been riding previously?

**jm2e** · 04-24-2018, 11:44 PM

Went from Butcher Grid to EXO DHRII to EXO Aggressor. Perhaps I've discovered the limit that my tire weight should stay above!
Burly as fuck, this guy!

**Jonny Snow** · 04-25-2018, 08:13 AM

I'm leaning pretty heavy towards the Procore system, because it would provide a full bead lock on my existing non-tubeless DH tires and rims. I'm pissed I missed the system on amazon when it was $80, that would have been a no brainer.

Or I could just run the revolutionary YES TUBES SYSTEM that forever overcomes all the disadvantages of tubeless tires.

**NuMexJoe** · 04-25-2018, 09:32 AM

Originally Posted by Jonny Snow

Or I could just run the revolutionary YES TUBES SYSTEM that forever overcomes all the disadvantages of tubeless tires.

Asshat though he used to be, I miss Pete.

**Dantheman** · 04-25-2018, 10:48 AM

Vittoria is now in the foam insert game, and they are actually charging more than cushcore at $170/set. This shit is nuts. How does a foam cylinder cost as much as a high-end tire?

**bagtagley** · 04-25-2018, 10:50 AM

Weight is the only way to tell. There seem to be several interpretations of EXO. The Minion SS casing feel much more flimsy than the other Mininos, for instance. It's more like an Ardent Race.

**skaredshtles** · 04-25-2018, 11:52 AM

Anybody tried the new Maxxis Ass Guy tire yet?

**skaredshtles** · 04-25-2018, 11:56 AM

Originally Posted by jm2e

Went from Butcher Grid to EXO DHRII to EXO Aggressor. Perhaps I've discovered the limit that my tire weight should stay above!
Burly as fuck, this guy!

When I was riding 26", it was minimum 1000g. Or prepare for pinch-flats. I am about 190# geared up. So far, the 2.4 HR-2 dual (920g reported) has not flatted, but the traction sucks. And I've been pretty fastidious about keeping the pressure at 28-29psi.

**scrublover** · 04-25-2018, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by skaredshtles

When I was riding 26", it was minimum 1000g. Or prepare for pinch-flats. I am about 190# geared up. So far, the 2.4 HR-2 dual (920g reported) has not flatted, but the traction sucks. And I've been pretty fastidious about keeping the pressure at 28-29psi.

The DHR2 is a much, much better tire than those.