Looking for Butcher/Purgatory Alternative for NE

[skibumnh]

Sorry for yet another tire thread.

I've finally had it with specialized 2Bliss and GRID tires and I'm looking for some combo recommendations similar to that front / rear match up. Looking for something with better puncture and pinch resistance.

Willing to give up some rear traction (e.g. DHR2 probably overkill) for speed. Hate eating dirt so I like something more confidence inspiring up front.

Some Ideas (Exo/TR Dual for maxxis)

DHF/HR2
DHF/Advantage
DHF/Ikon
DHF/Ardent 2.2
Ardent 2.4/2.2
Trail Kings

[Anospa]

Minions are your answer.

Sub 800 gram tires blow up too easily from what I've experienced, but I tend to be a hack and land sideways too often.

What type of bike are these on? Tire pressure they are at? Tubeless?

[skibumnh]

Mach 6 rolling flow EX. Usually around 25psi tubeless. Working through some hash bottom out issues with the pivot that aren't helping the cause. All trail riding no lift served.

[HankScorpio]

Minions are great for New England. I also have a set of Schwalbe Hans Dampf I'm enjoying a lot. I'd avoid Ardents unless you stick to dry, harder packed trails. Ardenst are all over the place in loose or wet terrain, but they do roll fast.

[kootenayskier]

For putting in the miles, riding hard on rough terrain, Minions front and back, tubeless at mid 20s psi are the reliable do-everything choice.

[scharny]

Anything but Trail Kings. I had one ("tubeless ready") that lasted less than 50 miles before the sidewalls started weeping sealant.

[skibumnh]

Consensus being minions what are people liking combo wise? DHF fr/rr? DHF/DHR2?

I used to run a clutch in the rear which looks a lot like a DHR2. It was slow as all hell but the traction was unreal - so much so that I started tearing sidewall threads regularly which resulted in nasty tire hops. Once I tried to the purg I couldn't go back to the slowness of something like a clutch despite the silly grip advantage.

[Anospa]

I have been running DHF and DHR2 for awhile and been really happy. DHF might be a faster rear tire so go with that?

[Chugachjed]

The magic Mary rock razor combo is pretty killer for WA. I run a HR2 on the back in muddy season (now),

[kidwoo]

What are you doing to those specialized tires? Pinching beads or putting branches or something through casings? Those things are every bit as durable as what maxxis makes outside of a dh or maybe that new double down casing. Any 'grid' casing made this year is basically the equivalent of the old sx casings for what it's worth......much burlier.

Don't forget the minion semislick exists too. A little more in the rear tire, slaughter vein.

I kinda hated the rock razor I rode. On wtb i23s the sideknobs were just too far over. Wider rims could fix that though.

[PhishingME]

DHF and Tomahawk on rear. Going to try the On One Smorgasbord and Chunky Monkey this spring. The side lugs on the Tomahawk didn't last too long riding Harold Parker. I'll probably put it back on for the summer.

[D(C)]

What are you doing to those specialized tires? Pinching beads or putting branches or something through casings? Those things are every bit as durable as what maxxis makes outside of a dh or maybe that new double down casing. Any 'grid' casing made this year is basically the equivalent of the old sx casings for what it's worth......much burlier.

I remember reading that Specialized uses a heavier casing on Butcher and Slaughter Grid tires than their other Grid tires. First generation Butcher Grids (2014, I think) had the lighter casing, but the new ones are thicker. I can confirm that the Slaughter I ran in back last summer is quite a bit beefier than the Purg Grid I just put on, and managed to puncture 3 rides in.

The Butcher/Slaughter Grid casing is definitely heavier than Maxxis Exo.

I really wish the Purgatory came in the heavier casing. It's a decent-rolling tire that works well during the wetter months. I hope I don't poke any more holes in mine.

[D(C)]

As for recommendations, I am beyond stoked with the Bontrager SE5 I am running in front. It's a bit slow-rolling as a rear tire though.

[Dantheman]

As for recommendations, I am beyond stoked with the Bontrager SE5 I am running in front.

At $75/ea I would sure hope so.

[stuckathuntermtn]

I'm pretty sure the purpose of going tubeless isn't so you can run your tires at 25PSI. That's not that low, but it kinda is, especially if you're bigger/don't air up before every ride.

[Skistack]

I'm pretty sure the purpose of going tubeless isn't so you can run your tires at 25PSI. That's not that low, but it kinda is, especially if you're bigger/don't air up before every ride.

What the fuck are you trying to articulate here?

[toast2266]

Vittoria Goma in a TNT casing is pretty similar tread pattern. And they're fucking tanks, which might be a good thing or a bad thing depending on how you're looking at it.

[intheways]

Minion SS?

[skibumnh]

Pulled the trigger on DHF/DHR2. Might give the SS a go in the rear for weekend racing if the DHR2 is a total dog. Thanks for all the help / ideas.

As for what I'm doing to spesh tires - other than occasionally picking stupid lines - I think it's just where I ride. Ask just about anyone who rides in greater Boston and they'll likely tell you about the time they walked out of NTF or Borderlands (covered in Stans) after running through a sidewall and then multiple tubes in one ride.

It's mostly pinch flats and sharp rock puncture or sidewall cuts that are too big to seal up.

I'll also add the butcher grid has been fine. It's just the purg grids that don't hold up. The only lower profile spesh tire that could hang in the rocks (but eventually gave out) was the ground control armadillo elite which they don't make anymore. It was much tougher but a harder durometer with less grip that took a while to scuff up and get tacky.

[Flounder]

I went from a similar setup (control/purgatory) to Pacenti Neo Moto's. Been on them 2 years and really like them. They perform well in all conditions. Running the 650b in 2.3 front and rear.

Bummer about the harsh bottoming out on the Mach 6. That bike was on my short list but the geometry looked too slack on paper and I couldn't find one to demo. I hear it climbs better than the numbers suggest.

[kidwoo]

It sounds like you're all set but if you do decide to go with a faster rolling rear, don't discount the current grid slaughters. I beat the living piss out of two of them over the last two years (I got advanced copies), moab trips included and never once put a hole in one.

[skibumnh]

Bummer about the harsh bottoming out on the Mach 6. That bike was on my short list but the geometry looked too slack on paper and I couldn't find one to demo. I hear it climbs better than the numbers suggest.

Yeah I rode one for a week in Moab and fell in love. It was bottomless there so I think I am being dumb about my shock setup or the float x is blown. Probably the former and I'm working through it. It climbs and pedals great. Sub 28 lbs and I ride it as a trail bike primarily. Have a 150 pike instead of 160 on it too.

[skibumnh]

Mounted up and ready to rip. The DHR2 is much faster rolling in the rear than the Clutch Control I had. Not a bad setup - can't wait to break it in tomorrow.

Thanks again for the help all.

[Damian Sanders]

Mounted up and ready to rip. The DHR2 is much faster rolling in the rear than the Clutch Control I had. Not a bad setup - can't wait to break it in tomorrow.

Thanks again for the help all.

Interesting. Looks like you have a 3C (softer) front and a 60a / maxxpro (harder) rear, which is a good setup.

I ran classic single ply DHF/DHF for many years and was happy. Went for the new TR series DHF/DHR2 and did not like how the DHR2 rolled in TR/60a/2.30. Got an ikon 2.35 TR rear with the DHF, thought it rolled well, but not enough tire 5% of the time. Found out there are maxxpro 60a and 3C versions of the 2.3 DHF TR, so I put the DHF 60a in the back, and got a softer 3C version for the front. Seems to work really well and roll fast too. Tubeless on WTB KOM i25, 26", 26/30 psi usually.

On a side note, tire pressure is critically important on modern tubeless setups. They are not durable enough to be constantly bottoming out on the rim, you will tear sidewalls and dent rims. You need to find tire pressures that don't allow bottoming and set them EVERY RIDE with the same pump or gauge. You also may need to tweak them for the terrain and aggression level you're riding at on any given day - more pressure for more rocks and speed.

[Dee Hubbs]

I appreciate your attention to detail, with your valve stems lined up with your tire logos. But your cables require some management out front of the bars. And I would prefer your cranks to be at 3 and 9 for the next photo.
Thanks.