Careful What You Ask for Seattle (No Good Deed Goes Unpunished)

[KQ]

The world will never be completely safe. The question about this bathroom thing is does allowing people to use the bathroom they feel most comfortable with make people less safe.

I say no.

Oh okay.

You are truly a mystery. You say you are a victim of abuse yet you appear to have neither sympathy nor compassion for people who, as a result of abuse, express concern at the prospect of being subjected to a situation that causes them to fear for their safety, real or imagined.

Since we are making pronouncements, I say without some sort of protocol it's a recipe for abuse by those who would do evil and yes, while it is true they are out there already committing heinous acts why open up another avenue for them to pursue victims?

We are not talking about "making the world completely safe" but I will go so far as to say that using the restroom should not involve "assumption of the risk".

[mtngirl79]

When you have been a victim of abuse the fear is everywhere. No where is safe, nobody is safe. I do not not feel for victims of abuse and their fear, I just dont see this situation where they should be catered to.

I will ask again, if it were black men making women uncomfortable, would we be having the same conversation?

[mtngirl79]

This is what the reality is. Most look like woman, a few look kinda manly.

https://www.google.com/search?q=tran...5CDpAQ_AUIBSgB

[mtngirl79]

I'm wondering where this person should pee... he's gonna have to pee a lot from what I've heard...

[mtngirl79]

How about this dude?



Do you feel safe was he walks out of the stall next to you? You should cause he was born a she.

[mtngirl79]

Lots of these pregnant trans men pictures..



Remember the general level of prejudice in our parents generation? Once my brother brought home a girl with tattoos. My mom thought she was the devil...

Our generation's kids are going to be in childbirth class with trans couples!

[KQ]

I do not not feel for victims of abuse and their fear

This says it all. Nice.

The fact of the matter is, it is a well intentioned law that is poorly executed and needs to be rethought. Happens all the time, case and point:

Cracking down on service animal imposters

BUFFALO, N.Y. (WKBW) - New York is looking to crack down on those who pretend that their pets are service animals.

Service Animals are used in airports, restaurants, shopping malls and around the house. However, it turns out that virtually anyone could give their pet the appearance of a "service animal."



It is as easy as logging onto the internet. Just on Amazon.com, there are pages and pages of service dogs vests, harnesses and ID cards for sale.

Cindy White, who has used a service dog for years, has learned first hand that the imposters make it harder for those who actually need a service animal.

White was diagnosed with Muscular Dystrophy. "He's basically for walking, balance and if I'm in a wheelchair, he'll pull the wheelchair," she said.

Watching imposter service dogs can be hard for her.

"I get really aggravated because I depend on him, to motivate, to maneuver my life," she explained. "It effects me, because then I'm questioned and thrown out of places. "

White also trains service dogs with Canine Helpers for the Handicapped, Inc. That is the organization that provided her with Jesse.

White said true service animals receive extensive training that can last years. They are trained not to react in public.

Fake dogs can even be a safety risk.

"There's been times when I was out, and somebody with their supposed service dogs barked and snapped at mine," White explained.

The New York Legislature is looking into a new law to weed out the imposters. In it, only certified groups and trainers could purchase and then provide vests that would identify service animals.

Advocates also want to make it easier for businesses to be able to ask for service animals identification.

"I would like to show my ID to show that he's a service dog, versus somebody that doesn't have a legitimate service dog," White said.

Service dogs can cost from $15,000 to $25,000. Those working on the legislation want to push to make that covered by health insurance.

[Buster Highmen]

I just hope that Seattle is on the cutting edge of identifying and vetting transgender or transpecies service dogs.

[PNWbrit]

Fake dogs can even be a safety risk.

A former member of this forum took his dogs to Argentina on the plane with him by claiming they were service animals.

One of the viscous son of a bitches bit me in Bariloche.

[Buster Highmen]

One of the viscous son of a bitches bit me in Bariloche.

Slimey bastard!

[PNWbrit]

Slimey bastard!

Ha....

[The AD]

The world will never be completely safe. The question about this bathroom thing is does allowing people to use the bathroom they feel most comfortable with make people less safe.

I say no.

I agree. If someone is really intent on assaulting someone in a restroom I doubt the sex labeled on the door is going to thwart them.

[mtngirl79]

Yeah. I deal with "fake" service dogs every day.

The law basically terrifies businesses and the general rule is if the dog us behaving reasonably, it's not worth the risk of being wrong in judgement.

PTSD dogs make really hard to guess, too.

The reality is its mostly crazy old women and lap dogs and very rarely is it more than annoying.

People get worked up about it, though. Usually I have more than one on the bus almost at all times. Once one fake dog barked at another fake dog. That's the worst I've experienced.

[mtngirl79]

Oh... there is also service dogs that I know are service dogs that have lax handler/owners that can seem kinda fake sometimes.

Service dog does not equal perfect. See, I get to watch them in action. A lot. It's different that what I thought before.

[PNWbrit]

That's the worst I've experienced.

Hooray!

You've reached bottom.

[mtngirl79]

Har har.

Once a real service dog bit a fake one. That wasn't on my bus and once this heeler puppy fake service dog nipped a guy and he was allowed back on if he wore a muzzle. The dog, not the man bitten.

[Phill]

The laws on this from both sides seem to be solutions desperately searching for a problem. Trans people are a very small percentage of the population and the vast majority of them use the bathroom that corresponds most with their outward appearance. Most people in the bathroom with them probabaly never notice anything out of the ordinary. Those who do probably just figure it was an effiminate man or a butch woman and don't give it a second thought.

Until I see evidence of a real problem that equal access bathroom laws are solving, I'm going to say that they're stupid. Likewise until I see a problem caused by lack of bathroom segregation enforcement I'm going to call the laws from the other side as I see them, hateful transphobic dog whistles.

Not to go all Ayn Rand but sometimes we really don't need regulations and this is one of those instances.

[mtngirl79]

I think the only real issue is schools, work places and places where people know a person before and after transition.

Some people like to make a fuss when they know...

[GoldMember]

This is what the reality is. Most look like woman, a few look kinda manly.

https://www.google.com/search?q=tran...5CDpAQ_AUIBSgB

Looks like Chris Farley in drag....I might be inclined to ask for an autograph.

What about the guy I know that looks 100% male but has a vagina? People would freak if he went in the girls.

Here's my suggestion for this person. No problem:

[mtngirl79]

They need a special license at marymore park..
We have one that is at lake padden a lot that I doubt you would complain about...

[::: :::]

You know another Seattle 'good deed' that has gone awry?
i'm gonna tell ya
Dog Parks have turned into the domain of the Dog Walking Businessfolks. The new battle at dog park, pits the 'individual dog' owner vs the 13 dogs offloaded by the 'professional dog walker'.
at stake is free use of public land to run a business that impedes on the casual park user only using the land to relieve their dog.
the individual casual user has fear the public park will be overwhelmed by these packs of dogs being brought to the park by business owners. Seattle Parks & Recreation to hold public meeting to discuss concerns.

socal had this issue with personal trainers (well, more "group trainers")

[Tippster]

You know another Seattle 'good deed' that has gone awry?
i'm gonna tell ya
Dog Parks have turned into the domain of the Dog Walking Businessfolks. The new battle at dog park, pits the 'individual dog' owner vs the 13 dogs offloaded by the 'professional dog walker'.
at stake is free use of public land to run a business that impedes on the casual park user only using the land to relieve their dog.
the individual casual user has fear the public park will be overwhelmed by these packs of dogs being brought to the park by business owners. Seattle Parks & Recreation to hold public meeting to discuss concerns.

Charge them a "grazing fee."

[::: :::]

How'd the californistanian's decide?

the grazing fee seemed to be the answer

[pureantigravity]

At rest. When I get an erection, it resembles a light saber.

At work, I use the washroom for trans-galactic identifying persons

[mtngirl79]

Those mirror tile things look painful.